FMN, a frequent and intelligent commenter, wrote about Dr. Danielle Roberts, as a comment in response to the article, Alanzo Defends Dr. Danielle Roberts in Her Quest to Get Medical License Back.
What needs to be acknowledged is that people make mistakes. We all do. And when we do, we tend to hang our heads in shame and feel the need to jump off bridges. This is akin to “slut shaming” and revenge porn. Evil ways to destroy women.
Societal shaming is horrible.
But for some reason, people like, well, politicians get shamed all the time, and just brush it off.
Dr. Roberts can do this, too. Reinvent herself.
But in my humble, humble opinion, this WAS a cult, and no one can progress forward until that is acknowledged and dealt with.
Until it’s dealt with, followers remain harem members of a defunct organization. And harem members are stuck in a downward trajectory until they figure it out for themselves. When the rest of the world sees a cult, and a small family of sex partners don’t, one of the two groups –the world, or the harem – needs to look in the mirror to see if perhaps their judgment is skewered.
That process is awareness, healing, redemption, reinvention.
She can do this.
Alanzo had this comment in reply to FMN.
I’m going to challenge some of the assumptions in your comment, FMN.
I hope you don’t mind.
You wrote, ”When the rest of the world sees a cult, and a small family of sex partners don’t, one of the two groups – the world, or the harem – needs to look in the mirror to see if perhaps their judgment is skewered.”
“The rest of the world” is not actually the rest of the world. It’s a particular culture: US mainstream culture.
For instance, the Hare Krishnas are straight-up Hindus, a religion with 1.35 billion adherents, four times bigger than the population of the entire US.
Hare Krishnas, or the Society for Krishna Consciousness, study and promote the Bhagavad Gita, one of the principle texts of Hinduism, and one of the most enlightened spiritual scriptures ever written.
Have you read it?
Here in the US, Hare Krishnas dress funny, eat funny, chant and behave in ways North American society deems a “cult”.
So it isn’t “the rest of the world” who thinks Hare Krishnas are a cult.
It’s North American society, which is dominated by Jews and Christians, mostly, who believe that there are, per their teachings, “false prophets” who lead you away from their Gods, such a Yahweh and Jesus. Because of this, they target Hare Krishnas as a “cult”.
And so you use the term “harem” to describe Dr. Danielle Roberts, which is a term from Islam, from their practice of polygamy. Islam comprises 1.9 billion adherents, six times the population of the United States. But was Dr. Roberts actually part of a harem, or has your culture only presented her that way?
Your conclusion that Dr. Roberts ‘needs to look into the mirror’ is based on assumptions that US society is somehow world society, and when a member of a minority subculture like NXIVM is faced with US mainstream persecution, as Dr Roberts has been, what you ask her to do is impossible.
Remember, our culture is supposed to be a free society. That moral value CAN be assigned to our culture. That is a yardstick or a standard, that can be used to criticize the actions of people and institutions in our culture when they fall short of it.
And in this case, what was done to Dr Danielle Roberts, because we pretend to espouse freedom in our culture, was completely condemnable.
And because you believe that “the world” is only mainstream US culture, you are missing this incredibly vital point if we wish to uphold freedom in our society, as so many of us pretend we do.
Hi Alanzo, hope you’re doing well. Still curious. If Raniere deprogrammed someone from a cult, does that make him an anti-cultist?
Seems like a relatively straightforward question to answer…
[…] I actually never said Dr. Roberts was in a ‘harem’. I said some followers seemed to be. Harem implies sexual devotion, adhesion, and she said she only […]
This comment section with the Alanzo nonsense has gotten really stupid. Takes down the quality of the whole site. It’s starting to get hard to take Frank seriously. He used to have some interesting snippets here. Shame.
I agree! Ban Alanzo!
I do not easily ban anyone from commenting. Alanzo is giving his opinions. He is trying to do it in a thoughtful way. I truly suspect that there is something else going on here – with possibly certain Scientologists who are stalking and harassing him.
I am kidding. Alanzo offers a different perspective, in the same vein as the Amway Cowboy.
Thank you for standing up for free speech and diversity of opinions, Frank. I don’t agree with everything Alanzo says and sometimes maybe he goes a little too far, but I respect his right to express himself. We need more eloquent and intelligent voices speaking out. It is obvious Scientology feels threatened by what he writes and he needs allies like you to defend him.
I agree that something is going on. He does have intelligent, well thought out, albeit skewed, thoughts. They are a welcome deviation and thought-provoking, yet he is constantly harassed.
He is harassed because he uses sock puppets and baits people. Frank supports that which is his right and his website. I’m just saying that it isn’t a good look.
Now that Nice Guy has outed Alanzo as FMN/Ableard/etc, Alanzo is threatening to dox him and call his wife where she works. He doesn’t even try to hide his stalking habits.
Now Alanzo has become a real-world threat, not just a web troll.
Frank, you need to do something.
November 15, 2021 at 8:25 am
Is this the “Nice Guy” who told the world here on the Frank Report that he closed on a house with his wife on 23 October 2021 in Buzzard’s Bay, MA?
November 15, 2021 at 6:33 pm
But really. Do we need to call your wife at her place of work for an intervention, “NiceGuy”?
That makes me feel very uncomfortable and unsafe. How are we supposed to enjoy this blog? Totally unacceptable
No one will be doxed. Triple Gold is trying to pull my chain, personally.
I posted the area where I have a Cottage. No one is doxxing me or anyone else.
The Frank Report is a secure website. Otherwise, I wouldn’t be here.
Alanzo is a bag of hot air who doesn’t exist outside of the internet. If he messed with Nice Guy in the real world, my money would be on Nice Guy.
Well if Alanzo docks Nice Guy, Alanzo should plan on a visit from his friends from OSA…..
…You know the rest aLambZo
Alanzo left Scientology because his love for himself is greater than his love for the church. In addition, he didn’t receive a promotion. So the crybaby ran out the door.
Okay, Alonzo. You think maybe the Hare Krishna or Muslim people would feel differently about masters commanding their slaves to command their slaves to enact a seduction assignment?
Maybe we could ask them what they think?
Why did “Nice Guy” decide to accept the payments of the Scientology PI’s harassing Frank Report commenter, Allen Stanfield?
I’m being paid in iTunes gift cards that can purchase apps, music, movies and so much more……
iTunes Gift cards are a great way to launder money, obtain international currency below exchange rates, buy steroids, drugs, and unregistered guns….and all other manner of illicit things.
Don’t believe me? Google it. 😉
Here’re some articles on the uses of iPhone gift cards:
Here’s a better article on organized crime using the Gift Cards:
Alanzo was trying to leave a post as “FMN” but forgot to actually login, so he just left the username.
I guess with so many sock puppets it is hard to juggle everything.
Nice Guy, you flustered Alanzo with your unmasking of FMN and Ableard.
The first rule of Fight Club is you don’t talk about Fight Club. The first rule of cults is you don’t call it a cult. This was certainly the rule in Nxivm.
Journalist Sarah Berman titled her comprehensive book on Nxivm “Don’t Call It A Cult”.
Former Doc Roberts didn’t lose her medical license because of narrow-minded “mainstream American culture”. She lost it because she was branding dear leader Vanguard’s initials onto women’s nethers. Women who had been coerced and lied to.
It had nothing to do with Roberts being in a cult. Even though she was. Nxivm was a cult. The exalted leader, the bowing to his picture, the enforced groupthink, the sashes, the Knox Woods compound. Cult, cult, cult.
Cults aren’t some freedom-loving expression of individuality, persecuted because of “mainstream American culture”. You don’t shave your head and put on orange robes and chant in unison and do whatever dear Leader tells you because you’re an independent thinker. It’s a surrender of freedom. It’s choosing to be a slave.
Ah yes, the Hare Krishnas in robes at airports. Haven’t seen them since the era of the Hippie. They were the embodiment of the word “cult”. Forty years ago.
They weren’t a cult? They were “straight-up Hindus”? What is a straight-up Hindu? There are four sects of Hinduism, subdivided into six sub-sects https://religionfacts.com/hinduism/branches
Hinduism has a very ugly side, sectarian and violent. Brought to prominence by Modi’s recent Hindu Nationalist chauvinism https://www.economist.com/briefing/2020/01/23/narendra-modis-sectarianism-is-eroding-indias-secular-democracy
So saying “they’re Hindus!” Isn’t much of an endorsement.
Lastly, this sneering at “mainstream American culture”. What exactly is it? Republican or Democratic? Pickup truck or Prius? LA or rural Oklahoma? Evangelical, Unitarian, Mormon, liberal Catholic like Biden, or agnostic? BLM sign in the front yard, or the American flag, or both?
I find it odd that all this disparity can be lumped together as “mainstream American culture” and the various sects of Hinduism can be grouped together as “straight-up Hindus” and yet there is no commonality that allows Nxivm and Scientology to be categorized as modern-day cults. I find that both odd and unconvincing.
Great comment, Aristotle!
Let’s not forget Rajneesh/Osho.
Let’s do an exercise:
Which is a part of mainstream American culture and which is not?
The Lutheran Church or the Hare Krishas?
The Republican Party or the Socialists Worker’s Party?
NFL Fooftball or Cricket?
Can you see that one of these in each example is known and thought of as “normal” by the overwhelming majority of Americans and the other is thought of as “weird” or not understood at all by a majority of Americans?
The difference is mainstream vs minority culture.
Your recent inability to define your use of the word “cult” is probably mixed up with your lack of understanding of what a culture is. Unfortunately, it’s quite common among anticultists such as yourself.
So here’s a good working definition of what a culture is:
Blah! Blah! Blah! Blah! I’m Alanzo.
Here’s you definition of Cult courtesy of Webster’s Dictionary:
I hope you embrace it! ♾
When’s the last time you exercised? 🏋🏽♂️
Dropping knowledge on Alonzo’s head. Great points!
Alanzo: “What’s a ‘light bulb’?
‘Light bulbs’ don’t actually exist!
That’s a myth perpetuated by the Anti-Light Bulb Light Bulb tribalists.”
How would Alonzo know even what light is?
His head is up his azz!
I must applaud you, Alanzo (Are you any relation to Zorro, btw?) for dumbing down this blog to an unprecedented level – beneath even Scott Johnson’s abilities to please the mostly MAGAt, misogynist contingent. Not that I’ve ever read more than a paragraph of your posts or comments. (I stopped in to read FMN and had to stop to cat nap after your first sentence, as usual. Yawn.)
I conclude by the “Zoro” comment you’ve come to surmise, like I have, that Mr. Allen Stanfield (Alanzo) took over the identity of a former commenter(FHM), on the Frank Report. My favorite part regarding the new FMN is the playful banter between Allen and FMN. FMN occasionally disrespects Allen(Alanzo), and uncharacteristically, Alonzo takes it in stride. Allen has never once insulted FMN with his go-to blind*****, and Allen always insults anyone.who diverges from Allen’s narrates.
THE CREEPY PART is Allen (Alanzo) spent time searching for the right account to procure(takeover).
It’s safe to assume Allen is behind all the “ASO” accounts too.
Last thing, Scott is an asshole. He’s not nuts. Allen is a f*cking total whacko. Also, our, dear Allen is more annoying than Scott by an order of magnitude.
You seem to have come to life in the presence of Alonzo, Nice Guy.
Poor Allen, yet another person has figured out all your sock puppet bullshit.
You love talking with yourself.
I must say that you have come up with some innovative insults and your self-doxxing has been most impressive.
Is this the “Nice Guy” who told the world here on the Frank Report that he closed on a house with his wife on 23 October 2021 in Buzzard’s Bay, MA?
Or is it another troll pretending to be him?
Allen’s getting pissy that his puppet theater has been exposed.
Not the first time. Doubt it’ll be the last.
What’s the next website he’ll turn to?
No November 15 12:30 pm is not me.
Whenever, you ask, Alanzo, I’ll always answer truthfully.
Our aliases reside on a blog. Get over yourself. It’s a blog. There’s dialogue and there’s barb-trading.
You are a monologue. All we receive from you is how the great Alanzo sees the world.
You are the purveyor of truth and the arbitrator of dialogue. Or so you believe.
I pointed out you are using old aliases/accounts which are no longer in use.
I believe this individual is just following my lead or maybe not. 😉
And I pointed out to you that I don’t contribute to the trolling sporgery going on here by using sock or anonymous accounts.
You, however, have admitted to using multiple sock puppets and Anonymous accounts to hide your identity and contribute to the disruption of the discussion here – mostly to hide your behavior in case your wife finds out what you’re up to on the Frank Report.
It doesn’t matter how many times you and the rest of these sporging trolls accuse me of using sock puppets, I don’t use them.
But you do. And you accuse me of using them while you use a sock puppet to accuse me.
I’m sure you get a major brain spooge out of that while you’re drunk posting here.
But really. Do we need to call your wife at her place of work for an intervention, “NiceGuy”?
I use old aliases and accounts which are no longer in use?
How’s that done exactly, Nice Guy?
Are you saying that after seeing this creep take your “Nice Guy” name and post as you for weeks, you think I’m using sock puppets?
Do you think I’ve been using your name too? Who’s doing that, Sherlock?
—02s: Do you think I’ve been using your name too? Who’s doing that, Sherlock?
You don’t have to be Sherlock Holmes to catch a schmuck masquerading around as different sock puppets.
BTW: I read Mao: The Unknown Story.
The fact that you would display such an inaccurate historical book means you have no knowledge of Chinese history. The dates in the book are correct, but the rest of the book is made up of absurd conclusions and false narratives.
Such as the Chinese communists were manipulated into committing atrocities by the Russians.
You have to be one pretentious individual to keep a book like that on your shelf.
The book’s spine and cover are elegantly designed, and that’s the best thing about the book. The shade of red on the cover is so rarely used.
Allonzo learned courage from watching Star Trek.
You are simply a brilliant observer, Nice Guy.
You aren’t going to believe this: looks like the first post Allen made after taking over the FMN screen name) by entering an email address and password) regarded bankruptcy law. You can’t make this shit up!
November 4, 2021 at 9:39 pm
Chapter7 doesn’t discharge willful and fraudulent acts.
I only noticed because Alanzo’s writing pattern is the same. So then I looked it up to confirm it. Alanzo’s vocabulary and writing are fairly obvious. Plus the old FHM was normal. 😉 lol
I seriously need a life I’m not kidding.
Are you a real person, or are you just my sock puppet as these disinformation idiots are trying to portray?
I’m real, but no matter what position anyone takes here, they’re going to be stoned.
I do think some of the rules of moderation can be reviewed here, and can be improved.
The trolls are making it impossible to have a conversation – which is their goal.
We know you are real, FMN.
A real sock puppet of Allen T. Stanfield.
And well-versed in bankruptcy law from experience. Your point about not being able to discharge debts due to fraud re: NIXVM lawsuit was actually worthwhile.
See, Garbanzo, if you weren’t so insecure and didn’t spend so much of your day planning and plotting how to hold conversations with yourself online, you might actually have friends.
It wouldn’t look like this when you meet your acquaintances at a local pub:
Give it a rest. Alanzo. You’re FHM or whatever…
“I do think some of the rules of moderation can be reviewed here, and can be improved.
The trolls are making it impossible to have a conversation – which is their goal.”
Then the Frank Report will ban you. 😉
I disagree on one point, NG. Allen, by Alanzo or any other mask, is the poser. Johnson is certifiable. Allen’s mid-west, puny town “Scientology” experience obviously didn’t traumatize him enough to drive him as batshit as Johnson was born or Amwayed, either.
We can at least agree that both of the gentlemen are incredibly annoying. 😉
On a sliding scale, I’d put Allen more at obnoxious than annoying and Johnson closer to terrorist troll. Btw, Johnson aka “Tex2” on Twitter was banned, restrained from nearly all mainstream social media outlets over 2 years ago. Looks like “Zoro’s” creepin’ up to a similar fate.
Heidi, Alanzo serves a purpose.
What is the point of shooting into a barrel if there isn’t a fish in it?
Ding ding ding ding!
New Facebook page for Allison Mack
No workplaces to show
No schools to show
No schools to show
Did Allison Mack fall asleep under the UV lamp?
Ouch, Frank. That’s an unflattering photo of Danielle up there.
Anorexia and aging are not a good combination.
She’s overdue for a shot of botox.
I’m going to share something that is esoteric knowledge. No one has been able to figure this out until just now. This is like the wisdom of every religion’s prophet combined into one.
Are you ready?
Doctors, if you don’t want to lose your license to practice medicine and your ability to earn a livelihood that enables you to pay off your major student loans, don’t join a cult and violate your sworn oath of ethics.
Pretty mind-blowing, eh?
It is a cult. Have the NXIVM remoaners and their hangers or Alonzo ever owned a pet shop?
Keith frequently told his followers he wasn’t a cult, so it has to be true!
Actually, most people involved with Krishna Consciousness in the Western hemisphere don’t “dress funny.” What you are thinking of, because you obviously don’t know anyone who is actually involved, are the “devotees” who renounce worldly pleasures and are the colorful, spectacular public face of the cult. Most adherents are “householders” who get married, have kids, dress like everyone around them and work regular jobs.
I know several people who have been heavily involved for years. Unless you were to go inside their house you would never know they aren’t Joe and Jane Normal. Nor would you know just how abusive the domestic situation is. It is a violently patriarchal organization. My sister is an attorney who works as a guardian ad litem and she has dealt with literally scores of cases involving Krishnas. Violence is part of their DNA. The merrily chanting boys in saffron are hardly representative of the warrior mentality that drives Krishna Consciousness.
If you actually ever studied it, you’d discover that “Hinduism” represents a vast panoply of widely divergent and contradictory beliefs and, most importantly, practices. Krishna Consciousness is a particularly nasty version.
And, yeah, I know abusive Catholics and Protestants and whatever else, but that doesn’t make Krishnas any less fucked up.
Cults always hide the most messed-up parts from public view.
It takes discernment to see through cults.
People who fall prey to cults lack discernment. Unfortunately, most people who fall out of cults never develop their critical thinking skills sufficiently to avoid getting sucked back into another one or end up being orbiting excuse-makers.
This is absolutely true! Met many low key Krishna. @ 10:50 am.
And there are celebrities who chant and practice different versions of Buddhism and Hinduism and while not secretive they are private in their beliefs and practices. As are most humans who are not trying to recruit other souls but merely live a spiritual life of their own choosing.
If I wanted to read so much Alanzo – I’d visit his blog. I thought this was the Frank Report. The endless and pointless back and forth fighting with the people who come to debate Alanzo and then to debate who’s actually debating Alanzo – I would prefer a little less… Of him. Not more.
First and foremost: I am not a NXIAN. I am an outsider, with these caveats:
–I don’t live far from where their headquarters used to be and it was always in my face;
–I used to (and sometimes still do) hang out at a coffee shop called Moca Lisa’s, and there was always a group of members there–largely attractive females–with notebooks open, working diligently on their projects;
–My wife–a spitting image in her younger years of one of the women featured in “The Lost Women” (The resemblance is shocking). My wife WAS approached by a NXIVM member to “come check us out”;
–My interest in this is multi-fold. I absolutely love Frank’s reporting and writing style. No one does investigative reporting anymore–it’s a lost art. 60 Minutes doesn’t even do it. So I have absolute respect for the mind-bending journalism featured in The Frank Report.
That aside, let’s clarify some issues:
1. I actually never said Dr. Roberts was in a ‘harem’. I said some followers seemed to be. Harem implies sexual devotion, adhesion, and she said she only was the recipient of a kiss. I have no reason to doubt that.
2. However, I do believe in the general context of an “emotional harem”, which, at this point, I will describe as a blinding adhesion to someone who has spiritual power, real or imagined, bestowed upon them, resulting in blind allegiance. I am not saying this applies to anyone. I am saying I see this as a potential.
3. A cauterizing pen is a medical instrument. I had surgery two months ago, and when I smelled my burning flesh and saw smoke waft in the operating room, I asked the doctor if that was a cauterizing pen.
“Yup,” he said. “It is used to seal the capillaries so you don’t bleed.”
To that end, I agree completely with the Board that Dr. Roberts was using a medical device.
4. As for the “practice of medicine”, that’s not up to me, that’s up to the Board–and the Board said it was. If they say it was, it was–they have the sole authority. If on appeal the Board changes its mind, then “No”, it’s not the practice of medicine. But as of now, it is.
5. In my humble opinion, it was horrible to brand women, in their pubic areas, with the initials of another man and not disclose this. I think we agree on this.
While you tout societal views on cults, I ask: Who is there to represent the interest and rights of those “Injured” by a permanent scar of a man’s initials, when it was not disclosed? The answer: The Board, and the court system. That’s the system Americans use.
5. Before this gets too long, or if Frank turns this into another article, I want to address, in my opinion, what a cult is. It’s similar to the Supreme Court holding, “I don’t know what pornography is, but I know it when I see it.”
NXIVM wreaks of cult.
One difference between a “cult” and a “religion” is you can leave a religion, you can’t leave a cult. Can one voluntarily leave being a Krishna? A Catholic? If yes, it’s a religion, not a cult. Can one voluntarily leave NXIVM? That is open to further debate, but there’s testimony in the court proceedings that say “not always.”
There’re swingers, and threesomes and polyamory–not one of these use starvation, sleep deprivation, and blind allegiance to one Vanguard, along with other attributes, and none of them without these practices appear to be prosecutable.
My prediction: RICO was brilliantly and effectively used, and will be upheld on appeal. There’s a lot of case law of Criminal RICO.
My next prediction: Criminal RICO has a civil component, and with the convictions in place, subject to appeal, the Plaintiff lawyers have a great case and are going to steamroll the Defendants. Many of the components are the same, and the Burden of Proof is lower.
My next hope: Dr. Roberts dusts herself off, lifts her chin up, and takes herself to higher levels than ever before, because I have no doubt she can do it.
My opinions, as always.
You make lots of good points, FMN.
However, former-osteopath Roberts has to do more than “dust herself off” and “lift her chin up.”
She must develop an ethical conscience. Since ethics is a matter of habit, that’s going to be a high mountain for her to climb. Can she? Sure. Will she? Doubtful.
Her biggest challenge is herself, not what other people thing of her.
Plenty of people are the subject of social scorn for far less understandable and appropriate reasons than Danielle and still manage to succeed. She’s had plenty of advantages which she’s wasted, and she only has herself to blame.
The social ostracism she’s experiencing can be a source of learning.
Remember all the DOS lessons about embracing pain?
People have a lot of “litmus tests” like these for what makes a “cult”.
17,000 people reportedly took courses in NXIVM. Were they all kept from leaving? What percentage? You have apparently learned quite a lot about NXIVM, and this is your litmus test for a cult, so I’m sure you have the numbers here.
Could you present them for us?
A cult is a subculture within the context of a mainstream culture. Hare Krishnas are a subculture, or a minority religion, here in North America. But in India they are part of the mainstream. So they are not considered a cult in India. Jews and Christians would be considered a cult by some in India, but they aren’t considered a cult here. Here they’re mainstream.
Just as stereotypes, prejudice and persecution exists for racial minorities in almost all mainstream cultures on earth, so does stereotyping, prejudice and persecution exist for religious and subcultural minorities – in the exact same way.
Fortunately, racial bigotry has been frowned upon in our mainstream society in the last few decades. Maybe, someday, sub cultural bigotry will be frowned upon, too.
This culture/subculture framework makes it much easier to understand “cults”, and it is grounded in social science. It’s much more accurate and constructive when approaching the phenomena of “cults” in any society. Using this framework allows you to understand groups and people who live differently than you.
You said that Dr. Danielle Roberts was part of a “harem” because she was in DOS. What justifies your slur of her?
Is it justified by the construct of “cult” that you use?
I think so.
For that reason alone, you should dump it.
Interesting and persuasive points!
Sometimes Alonso cheats on his beloved RingDings with, Little Debbie,
Devil Squares. The Devil makes him feel mischievous — plus Little Debbie Squares are 1/2 the price of RingDings.
Little Debbie claims Alanzszszso invaded her Hot Pocket, but did she testify under oath??!!
Ultimate slam! LMFAO!!!!
2x Comedy Gold!!!
Thanks, Nice Guy.
That’s the second time you’ve given me a Comedy Gold award. This time a twofer!
But… I have to give credit to Allen (AKA Alanzo, FMN, Abelard, juzernejm, huntingpeople2, Ex and a host of others) for the inspiration.
However one chooses to define a “cult” has no legal relevance to anything involved in the prison sentences and financial judgements that are the _real_ issues here — not cultie or cultie-apologist public intellectual masturbation.
To quote Glazer’s recent letter to Honorable Eric R. Komitee, United States District Court, Eastern District of New York:
See Salinas v. United States, 522 U.S. 52 (1997) (explaining the broad scope of the RICO conspiracy statute § 1962(d) and that “[i]f conspirators have a plan which calls for some conspirators to perpetrate the crime and others
to provide support, the supporters are as guilty as the perpetrators.”