Editor’s Note: The article below is by an anonymous commenter. It is so nicely written and on point, that I chose to publish it as a post. It is in response to the article, Former EDNY Judge John Gleeson: Why Trials in the USA Are on the Verge of Extinction.
…. The justice system, especially the use of the grand jury, isn’t going to change. I would love for the grand jury system to go away. I wish most people understood how meaningless and manipulated a grand jury is.
The grand jury is bullshit, political cover that prosecutors use as a weapon to avoid blame while very much dictating exactly how the case will go forward.
Most people have no clue that a grand jury is the puppet of the prosecutor, that the prosecutor has absolute control over everything they see, hear, read, or do about a case. A grand jury actually has a great deal of power, they could force the prosecutor to either dissolve them or be their puppet, but they do not know this because the prosecutor needs their ignorance to puppet them instead.
That is just grand juries.
Not even getting into the boon that cases can bring to those with political aspirations. Or, if get into the huge amount of money that moves around to politicians, prosecutors, and judges via the privatization of jails. These jails make money by headcount.
Basically, think of it as C number of people times $D amount – the cost of watching those people = profit.
Those jails make the most money when two conditions are met:
(1) when the jail is filled beyond capacity and
(2) most, if not all the inmates, are non-violent.
The money flow literally benefits the system to go after low-level drug dealers, marijuana users, and other minor offenses.
Violent offenders need more guards, have more fights, and require more medical treatment. Every dollar that goes to those is money taken away from the profit margins. It’s why you keep hearing of bad medical conditions, refusal to act on COVID, and more in our jails and prisons.
Because all those actions hurt the profit margins.
Why does this matter?
Mandatory jail sentences mean consistent and known sources of profit, something all corporations love.
I don’t know if Keith is at a private jail, but he is a perfect example of the type of criminal all private jails want – guaranteed income for several decades at least and almost no cost to watch as he’s non-violent (in jail terms, not in his behavior towards women).
A private jail would love to be filled with nothing but Keith Ranieres.
All of this is very much by design.
Do you seriously expect those that benefit from it, aka politicians and judges at all levels of government, to actually change it?
You have lost your damn mind to think this is true or going to happen even in your great grandchild’s lifetime.
The only time change occurs is when the people force it or when those in charge benefit from it.
The people do not understand the justice system enough to force it (see grand jury example) and those in charge most definitely would not benefit from changing it.
[…] Let us now take a look at another excellent contribution by a reader/commenter, Erasend, who recently wrote, US Criminal ‘Justice’ System Is Operated for the Benefit of Those Who Operate It, Not for Justic… […]
The US (and here in the UK ) has a better system than many other countries. The UK does not have grand juries – instead our prosecutors decide whether to prosecute (used to be the police when I was small but the role was split off) although we have normal juries for normal criminal trials in the usual way.
What is the cost per inmate? How much money are we talking about on an annual basis?
Interesting piece. Thank you.
Frank, thanks for posting this. I enjoyed the read.
Interesting facts that relate to the comment/article regarding the court and prison systems in the United States:
1. The United States and Liberia are the only two countries in the world that have grand juries.
2. 74% of people in jails are not convicted of any crime. Currently, 470,000 people in jail have not been convicted of a crime.
More Prison stats breakdown of prisoner demographics below:
3. Largest private prison corporation in US is CoreCivic. Its revenue in 2017 was $ 1.77 Billion. More info below:
Sorry bro, but $1.77 billion dollars is PEANUTS relative to our total economy and yearly budgets.
There’s no major ‘influence’ being wielded to sustain that level of PEANUTS type budget. Get a clue.
Frank is a conspiracy theorist now.
As for your claim about the US having a justice system below all other countries except Liberia, LOL, you obviously don’t know how every South American country works. They have no grand juries there alright. In fact, they have no real justice system at all. It’s like something out of the dark ages.
Try watching LOCKED UP ABROAD to get a clue. It’s mind boggling.
People arrested for drug charges sometimes wait for up to 2 years (in prison) without ever having gone to trial, just to hear what their ‘sentence’ will be, which they are often notified via a letter.
The prisons there make you pay for food and water sometimes. Beds are mats on the floor of a cell filled with 30 inmates who can barely fit, near cockroaches.
Medical treatment consists of “hauling out dead bodies” or letting you lay down in a room by yourself, where you either heal on your own or die. LOL
You really have no fucken clue how fair the US justice system is compared to most other countries. Claviger doesn’t either. That geezer has never even seen a jail in South America.
A guy like yourself would probably be somebody’s bitch within the first week, since I doubt you’d fight for your own self respect. 🙂
Have a good day.
Blah! Blah! Blah! Blah!
Think of the conviction rate at the eastern district for example (97%); it not only creates direct pressure for prosecutors to get convictions (regardless of the truth), but it also removes any feeling that the defendant may be innocent. A court system with no real presumption of innocence is not able to deliver justice, it becomes an impossibility.
All you need to know about today’s Sham impeachment
Citizen Of Impeachment
Trump incited a mob to attack the Capitol building.
Trump has succeeded in destroying faith in and respect for the USA in a way that any enemy you can invent has not.
For what its worth, I notice no glee, no schadenfreude, no sense of triumph from anyone who might have been secure in their criticism of American policy as it affects their territories, it was such a great and ultimately benevolent power, that such opposition was a given part of the democratic process it proselytised for and often enforced – globally.
All gone. All over. Nothing to celebrate or crow about, an insurrection that doesn’t arise from mass starvation or state terror is surely nothing to be proud of. Does America want to be seen as insecure, neurotic, shrill, decadent, and weak, totally identified with its leader like any other tyranny, Kim Jong Un’s North Korea? Putin’s Russia? American justice and its political institutions look very sketchy atm certainly.
So, that’s it, the end of western democracy as we know it. But you patriots, have at your repetition of the [Q==>] lies that brought your great nation down. Celebrate! you’ve ‘trusted the plan’ this far and look where it’s taken you. I wouldn’t have expected it, but to me, what happened on your Capitol hill is a tragedy beyond words – it actually hurts.
You have put my own beliefs/feelings in a much more articulate manner than I can render myself.
—an insurrection that doesn’t arise from mass starvation or state terror is surely nothing to be proud of.
I never believed manufactured dissent could result in the events of January 6th.
In the 224 years of United States history nothing similar has ever happened. Even in events leading up to the Civil War.
To any U.S. history buffs: Fort Sumpter is not an equivalent event by any stretch of the imagination to 1/6/21.
God bless, Nice Guy, I’ll never stop thinking of America as great, as in Great, I don’t mean to suggest that I come from some superior place, I don’t. It’s just that, America has been such a presence on the world stage, such an intrinsic part of all the culture I know. A friend of mine was saying how the first pop songs he ever knew and sang, he sang in an American accent, we realise we all did. First music I ever learned on guitar was the 12 bar blues. first political tract I ever read, Tom Paine- Common Sense. If I wrote a list, would it ever end? More people than live in, and are of the US, feel very attached to your culture. Odd, like a sort of American diaspora by proxy, certainly by choice.
Cheers to that!
In the interests of brevity and my time I ask you 4 questions to ponder?
1. How many Republican vs Presidents have there been i.e. transfers of power?
2. How many times has the Capitol building been ransacked?
3. Why are things, this election cycle, so different?
Things we can agree on:
•The Constitution should be defended!
•Gun rights are Constitutionally protected.
•AOC and the Squad are as appealing as used toilet paper.
• Bernie Sanders should have stayed in Cuba.
• People who wear hip Expos retro baseball caps are fucking tools, not sport fans, and most likely to be libtards.
Interesting piece. Is there a list of names of the private and non private owners of these prisons? Or are they kept secret?
‘A death sentence’: US prisons could receive Covid vaccines last despite being hotspots
On most days the largest Covid outbreaks have been in jails and prisons, as some states see the mortality rate seven times as high as in the general population
On most days of the pandemic, the largest Covid-19 outbreaks in this country have been in prisons and jails. In December, the National Commission on Covid-19 and Criminal Justice found that the Covid-19 mortality rate in prisons was twice as high as for the general population, with four times as many positive cases overall. In some states, the mortality rate in prisons is over seven times as high as it is among the state’s general population.
The total number of coronavirus deaths in detention facilities is hazy at best. According to the UCLA Covid-19 behind bars data project, which is tracking deaths at prisons and some jails across the country, there have been at least 2,270 deaths in detention due to the coronavirus this year. The number of actual deaths is probably much higher, as many facilities very narrowly define deaths from the coronavirus in their custody.
So there were 2,270 covid deaths in US prisons?
Out of a total of over 2 MILLION inmates nationwide?
That’s 1/10th of 1 percent, LOL.
How is that a ‘death sentence’, LOL?
May they rest in peace cuz those were likely the oldest and sickest inmates who probably would have died from flu, or other ailments, anyway.
You sound like a liberal hate-monger who can’t stop reciting talking points from HuffPo and CNN.
We had thousands of kids who died in the last 24 hours (worldwide) from starvation, yet you’d rather talk about 2,270 older inmates who died from covid?
If you really cared about ‘innocent deaths’ then you’d be talking about how many kids are starving and dying every day.
Why don’t you donate money to help feed these kids? Do you not care about them? Why do their deaths not bother you? It is because you can’t link them to liberal talking points?
Try getting a life outside of your CNN coverage.
Frank needs to start debating these issues and grow a pair of balls.
Frank likes to “hide in the woodwork” and not really comment too strongly either way, mostly cuz he’s terrified of presenting any facts which might not align with the liberal narrative.
May Frank rest in HELL cuz that mother fucker ain’t welcome in heaven until he starts getting back to his roots of taking on any subject matter with facts, no matter how politically incorrect.
Have a nice day. 🙂
Typo: Should be: IS IT because you can’t link them to liberal talking points? 🙂
That’s the most stupid logic I have ever heard, so if you talk about disease, then it should be cancer or some other nasty disease?
In any argument you can find something worse, why are you talking about Vanguard in your posts? By your own logic, you should be talking about the many wrongly convicted waiting for death sentences, that could be freed by a simple DNA test or those in prisons in South America or some Asian countries dying from violence or poor hygienic conditions, those are in a 1000x worse condition.
So you can’t talk about anything at all without mentioning the worst cases, being an expert or doing something about it, oh and apparently also being a Republican, it’s a wonder people should post at all…
I appreciate this commentary, but you do realize this is something that People of Color have known/been dealing with for a long time, right?
I found it very interesting that you chose a picture and the infamous “ham sandwich” quote of Sol Wachtler. Interesting because Sol Wachtler was Chief Judge for the State of NY — as head of the Court of Appeals as well as chief administrator of the entire state court system. While in this position, he had an extra-marital affair with a woman who eventually broke it off with the Chief Judge. After she did that, Judge Wachtler began to harass her and was eventually arrested and charged with extortion, racketeering, and blackmail. (Sound a wee bit familiar? 😯) He also threatened to kidnap this woman’s daughter.
He served time in the federal prison system after pleading guilty.
I remember this well as I was working for Mario Cuomo at the time this drama was blowing up!!
I would like to take a step back from the current justice system and allow the people to disfigure these criminals in the streets. Mr. Mack should get dibs. Followed by Mr. Bronfman.
I’ll just pray Big Tech allows the videos since I’m a simple person.
There are many MANY Nxivm victims who feel justice was served.
Sol Wachtler is an interesting person to quote.
Born Solomon Wachtler
Solomon “Sol” Wachtler (born April 29, 1930) is an American lawyer and Republican politician from New York. He was Chief Judge of the New York Court of Appeals from 1985 to 1992. Wachtler’s most famous quote, made shortly after his appointment as Chief Judge, was that district attorneys could get grand juries to “indict a ham sandwich.”
He achieved national notoriety when he was charged with, and then convicted of, acts stemming from threats he made against a former lover, Joy Silverman, and her daughter. Upon conviction, Wachtler served thirteen months in prison and a half-way house. After his release, Wachtler became an author and critic, as well as an advocate for the mentally ill.
Criminal charges and resignation
In 1988, Wachtler began an affair with Joy Silverman. At the time, Wachtler was a co-executor of the estate of Alvin Wolosoff, Silverman’s stepfather and the uncle of Wachtler’s wife. He was also trustee of four trusts stemming from Wolosoff’s estate for the benefit of Silverman and her family. The trusts (in aggregate) were reported to be worth US$24 million at the time. According to then-United States Attorney Michael Chertoff, over time, Wachtler received fees of more than US$800,000 for his work as executor and trustee of the entire estate. After Silverman ended the affair in September 1991, Wachtler began to harass her.
Wachtler was arrested on 7 November 1992, on charges including extortion, racketeering, and blackmail. Prosecutors alleged that he demanded a $20,000 blackmail payment in exchange for turning over compromising photographs and tapes of Silverman with her then boyfriend, attorney David Samson. He eventually pleaded guilty to harassing Silverman and threatening to kidnap her daughter. He resigned as a judge and from the bar, and Governor Mario Cuomo appointed Judith S. Kaye to replace him as chief judge of the N.Y.S. Court of Appeals. He served his sentence, first at the medium-security Federal Correctional Institution in Butner, North Carolina, and from December 1993 at the Federal Medical Center in Rochester, Minnesota after he was stabbed in the shoulder while dozing in his cell in November.
Wachtler was sentenced to 15 months, but received time off for good behavior. His sentence started 28 September 1993. He was released after serving 13 months
Seems I repeated most of your post, Shadow, doing so before I even got to the comments section. I worked for the NY Governor when this happened and remember it well…
It’s a nice post, but with all due respect to the author (and my respected colleague, Frank Parlato Jr.) it fails to make the CONNECTION between these so-called “corporate profits” and each individual segment of the system which is separated from each other and not acting in collusion.
The beat cop making arrests does not care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from these so-called private prisons, LOL, since it has no effect on their own career.
The local prosecutor doesn’t care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from a few private prisons, LOL, since they only care about their own career advancement.
The judges who sentence inmates don’t care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from a few private prisons, LOL, since it doesn’t benefit them in any fashion.
Private prisons are not controlling everything behind the scenes with congress either, as you’re also implying.
Drug laws may be misguided in some aspects, but they were passed many years ago when crack cocaine (and other drugs) were taking over America. They were passed by lawmakers who intended to do ‘good’ —- but who may have been too overzealous about it.
These laws were not passed by ‘greedy people’ being paid off by private prisons.
You overestimate the lobby power of private prisons.
BTW: Prisons don’t cut back on medical care because it cuts into “corporate profits”, LOL. They cut back on medical care because most prisons are not private —– and most of them are already way over budget for most things.
Just look at the prisons of South America, Mexico and other poor nations. These prisons are FAR WORSE than our prisons in terms of medical care and food, yet it has nothing to do with “corporate profits” — it has to do with not enough cash in their budget.
You have a conspiracy mindset. You probably read Huffington Post or Alex Jones.
Yes, private prisons exist and wanna make a profit. But that’s simply filling a necessary void.
I just hope that Claviger doesn’t jump on this bandwagon. I just hope that Claviger gives us an article with more depth than a few conspiracy theories.
Have a wonderful day. 🙂
I think the system works now so that there does not have to be a collusion for the system to burgeon. The prosecutor is driven by advancement of career by conviction stats.
The FBI agents are driven by indictment stats. Judges want plea deals for judicial efficiency. Prisons want prisoners for budget purposes. Lawmakers want harsher sentences to look tough on crime and to advance the agendas of the generous prison industry.
You make it sound like prosecutors are incentivized to dupe juries.
I think they are incentivized to dupe juries – first the grand jury and then the trial jury. Career advancement for prosecutors is conviction stats.
“The prosecutor is driven by advancement of career by conviction stats. The FBI agents are driven by indictment stats. Judges want plea deals for judicial efficiency. Prisons want prisoners for budget purposes. Lawmakers want harsher sentences to look tough on crime and to advance the agendas of the generous prison industry.”
I have a simple theory about people – everyone has a motive for everything they do. People assume motive is negative (too much TV) but it is simply just the why someone does a thing. It could be as simple as feeling warm and fuzzy for doing a good thing to absolute lust for power. More often than not it’s just a desire to keep their job and, hopefully, advance in it. But even doing that has certain requirements and minimum goals.
The above is a great summary of just some of the motives people have for what they are doing in the criminal justice system. It’s not inherently wrong motives, not even bad ones, but they can lead to decisions that have bad outcomes. I have no clue how to prevent that. Experts have been trying since the concept of a justice system was first invented. Human motivation always muddies the waters, intentionally or otherwise.
This leads to things like prosecutors trying to dupe juries, especially grand juries, when they need to. Prosecutors want to win, they do not want to advance cases that they think will either lose or in winning create a losing situation for them (like say piss off the police force they need to do their job).
Examples of this have been seen hundreds of times over the years. The cases against police shootings. The evidence is sometimes clear as clean water (video of shooting guy in the back) that the case should move forward to trial and yet somehow they announce “The grand jury decided to not indict”.
A Grand Jury’s job is basically to decide if the charges by the prosecutor have merit based on the evidence presented to them. It’s not to decide guilt or innocence. It’s a voluntary process the prosecutor engaged in on the case and usually, it is a very low bar to clear. In effect, by convening the grand jury, the prosecutor is indirectly declaring “I have enough evidence to make this process worth perusing”. Maybe not enough to win an actual jury trial but enough to go to a jury trial. Yet it’s amazing how often when it’s a politically charged case that could hurt the career prospects of a prosecutor, mayor, etc, they just can’t clear that low bar. People just go “Oh well, I wonder what happened? There must be more to the case than we thought!” and thus political cover is provided.
In other words, there doesn’t to be an overarching conspiracy. Self-interest works quite well enough.
Yes, it just happens to work in a way that gives impetus to take people’s freedom away, without too much concern about innocence or guilt.
Huh, weird to see my post used in an article. Cool too 😀
Now to some nonsense::
“The beat cop making arrests does not care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from these so-called private prisons, LOL, since it has no effect on their own career.
The local prosecutor doesn’t care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from a few private prisons, LOL, since they only care about their own career advancement.
The judges who sentence inmates don’t care one fucking IOTA about ‘corporate profits’ from a few private prisons, LOL, since it doesn’t benefit them in any fashion.”
You assume a whole lot based on very little. Do private jails have sway? Yes, to those in charge. If they are a multi-million-dollar expense on the state or local ledger, by default they have influence on those in charge. Think they got there by the goodness of their heart or the influence they have (usually in monetary support to those that got elected)?
Do you know what chain-of-command is? That chain impacts pretty much everyone in your silly examples. Ever heard of “shit rolls downhill” It’s where the boss makes a decision who passes on a subordinate who passes it on to a subordinate… An example of that could be as simple a command as “Focus on low-level drug sellers, I want to send the message we do not tolerate drug dealing.” or “Focus on prostitutes, I want to send the message that this is a family-friendly city!”. This command filters all the way down to the beat cop. Sometimes that might be done for the common good, sometimes not. Sometimes it’s for jails, sometimes it’s not. I’m not saying the jail system sways all actions but it’s one of many problems that do dictate how resources and means are allocated.
This brings up ambition. Do you think the beat cop doesn’t want to rise in the ranks? That the local prosecutor doesn’t want to move up? That the judge doesn’t have ambition? All of them tend to be politically driven positions (check when you get a chance on how many politicians are ex-lawyers). Do you think it’s an accident that you hear about an area of the city suddenly getting extra police attention during an election year? Or that suddenly the police put extra special effort in going after prostitutes or other “red-light” activity in their city (again during an election year)? The reason is simple – it gets them on TV (sex sells..) discussing how they are tough on crime and care about cleaning up the city. It also has the added benefit of being relatively safe so the guy doesn’t have to be associated with “drug arrest goes wrong!” type story. Do you think the beat cops give two shits about doing that? No, but were they ordered to because their boss and they want to get that promotion.
If there is one consistent problem I have with all the post is you really have no clue the connections of anything. You think everything is an isolated island where domino effects, chain-of-command, greed and more don’t exist. For your idiot analogy about beat cops, local prosecutors, and judges to work, you have to (a) assume they are not ambitious, (b) they don’t get orders from others, (c) they only care about the common good, and (d) thry’re not greedy. Guess what, more than likely they are a mix of some and none of the above.
If you take away anything, it’s that you need to learn to know that there is the ideal way things were work, the way things actually work and recognize that push and pulls that prevent the thing from becoming the ideal. Once you recognize those factors, you can start to maybe come up with ways to move to the ideal. A refusal to see how things are instead of how you wish things would be does no one any favors.
—This brings up ambition. Do you think the beat cop doesn’t want to rise in the ranks?
Clearly, Bangkok didn’t read Serpico. 😂
“If you wanna make a poor attempt at making a foolish point, why bother typing so much stuff into a post that neither makes any sense, nor is humorous?
Try making it shorter next time.
That way, it’s lack of relevance will standout and it’ll quickly be understood as unadulterated crap.”- Bibcock
BTW: Are you Claudia Conway?
Have a great day! 🙂
The Incarcerated Americans chart presents only the absolute numbers, but does not relate them to population trends or population size. A chart that would show the Incarcerated Americans per 100,000 or one million would be better.
Good catch. Here it is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States#/media/File:U.S._incarceration_rates_1925_onwards.png
The rate didn’t quadruple, only doubled; and it was because of advancements in solving crimes.