Two of our most esteemed commenters – the youthful, future curmudgeon, Bangkok and the inestimable, irascible Texan, Scott Johnson – are at odds over a lady that Bangkok has seemingly adored from afar.
Miss Lauren Salzman.
While it does not seem to be true that Bangkok desires his temptress Lauren quite as much as another admirably quixotic commenter, Sultan of Six, does for his lady fair, Kristin Kreuk, Bangkok nevertheless has been Lauren’s staunch defender.
Lauren, 43, still possesses a unique charm and fascination for our young commenter.
However, the Texan sees less to be admired about Lauren – and not long ago, these two gave their opinions on the matter.
Bangkok: With all due respect to the people who think that Lauren Salzman deserves (or will receive) a long jail sentence. Nope! Lauren does not deserve a long jail sentence.
Scott: They should ALL get long prison sentences, but they probably won’t get what they deserve. And it’s PRISON, not jail. Jail is before sentencing, prison is for after sentencing. She does deserve a long prison sentence.
The length [should correspond to the] long period of time the abuse occurred, the large number of people abused, and the extreme severity of the abuse. Short sentences should be reserved for people with opposite factors in their behavior.
Bangkok: The judge will never give Lauren a long sentence. I’m predicting 12-18 months max, with a downward departure from the recommended sentence.
Scott: I agree. The judge probably won’t give her a long prison sentence, because he is known as a “soft” sentencing judge and has guidelines to defend his light sentence.
Bangkok: Lauren is probably among the least culpable players within the NXIVM storyline, especially among the higher-up players.
Scott: Wrong. Salzman was a first-level DOS member who was in charge of keeping a girl confined [Daniela] for about 100 weeks.
Bangkok: Lauren has done FAR MORE to convict Keith than any other human being on planet Earth, especially when compared to her most vocal critics.
Scott: Salzman was FORCED to help in order to save her own a$$ from a longer prison sentence.
Bangkok: Lauren got up on the witness stand and held nothing back, delving into the most emotional testimony that her soul could bear.
Scott: It was part of her plea deal. She either said everything she knew or the deal would have been thrown out.
Bangkok: In fact, people … just sit back and snipe at poor Lauren —- while not having the courage to forgive her.
Scott: Forgiveness doesn’t take courage, it takes faith.
Bangkok: Lauren did NOT remain silent against Keith for 25 years [as others have] — since she wasn’t even with Keith for quite that long. 🙂
Scott: It’s not about counting years as much as it is knowing what is wrong and doing something about it.
Bangkok: Lauren turned against Keith in a shorter period of time…
Scott: Salzman turned on Raniere ONLY to save her own a$$, so the time period doesn’t count.
Bangkok: Also, according to Frank Parlato, Lauren was groomed from an early age (by her MOM) to be compliant with Keith’s every demand. Lauren was groomed — by her mom — to be physical with Keith while wrestling around as a teen — so that sex with Keith would be a logical next step once she became an adult. Lauren’s mom worshiped Keith and groomed HER OWN CHILD to think likewise.
Scott: You got this one right.
Bangkok: That’s a powerful thing. How can you blame a child who was groomed by HER OWN MOM to do precisely what her mom wanted her to do?
Scott: I can blame her after she reaches legal age, that’s how it works.
Bangkok: Nancy Salzman led her daughter Lauren into the mysteries and wonders of Vanguard and Nancy took the first plea deal and got the best deal for herself.
Scott: All of the others could have beaten Nancy Salzman to be the first one to cut a deal. Several months went by before she cut a deal.
Bangkok: It’s no different than blaming an Amish child for choosing to be Amish when they become an adult.
Scott: The Amish are much more isolated than Salzman was, so there are significant differences.
Bangkok: If you’re RAISED to be compliant with a certain ‘religion’ or ‘master’ (by your own MOM), then you’re far more likely to do precisely that when you grow up. That’s why the judge will take pity on Lauren and give her a sentence between 12-18 months IMO (24 months tops).
Scott: The judge will probably follow the guidelines and he’s known for giving light sentences. If that’s your definition of pity, so be it.
Bangkok: Allison Mack, however, was NOT groomed by her parents to worship Keith. Yet Allison still CHOSE to worship Keith even after she was ALREADY a successful actress — with her own independent life & money — when she first met Keith.
Scott: I understand Mack’s parents …supported her getting involved. Mack is the typical Hollyweird insecure actress nutjob, which made her an easy target.
Bangkok: That’s a huge difference [between Lauren and Allison]. This indicates that Allison bears more ‘mental’ responsibility than Lauren. She’s got dirtier hands than Lauren for precisely this reason.
Scott: No, it’s not a huge difference. It may be a “different” difference, but not a huge one. Dirty hands are defined by behaviors, and Salzman has more bad behaviors than Mack.
Bangkok: That’s why the judge will likely be giving Allison seven years in prison, thus giving her an ‘upward’ departure from normal sentencing guidelines.
Scott: Although Mr. Shadow would consider seven years to be inadequate, I doubt Mack’s sentence will be anywhere near that long, unless he gives Salzman even more time.
Bangkok: What about forgiveness? If you forgive [other inner circle members who were not charged], then you can forgive Lauren too. If not, then it would indicate that you’re harboring a deep resentment towards Lauren for reasons which you’re not admitting.
Scott: Let the victims forgive Lauren Salzman if they want to. I’m not involved, so there is nothing for me to forgive. Only victims have a role in forgiving those who took advantage of them.
Bangkok: Lauren has left the dark side of the force. She deserves mercy. But Allison doesn’t.
Scott: None of them deserve mercy, in this life or the next.
Bangkok: Allison is a sick and twisted twat just like Nicki Clyne.
Scott: There are a LOT of sick and twisted twats in NXIVM, male and female.
That photo in which Allison has a red blouse was taken by Michael Chemerinsky in acapella innovation, you can see in Lauren the typical fake smile of NXIVM, while Allison still has a natural smile. I remember that in the early years of Frank Report, a very common story told by some former NXIVM members was how Allison idolized Lauren as if she were her older sister and she was a little girl.
To Anonymous 3:52 pm
You must mean Michel Chernitzky.
Allison Mack and Lauren Salzman are the Bobbsey Twins of Sado-Masochism and sex trafficking.
Bobbsey Twins, shadow? I would have guessed you were a Happy Holister kid.
Lauren’s hot! How tall is she btw? it’s like a part of her that’s an enigma.
Man vs boy…..Wrong vs Right….
….Good vs Evil….. Ying vs Yang….
Virile dude vs a sterile dude…
…….There is nothing like [pussy] too bring out the best in men. If [pussy] didn’t exist we would still be furry monkey men hanging from trees, eating bananas and flinging our crap at each other. Thank you [pussy]!
Women don’t realize it but they are the ones who rule the world….
Male patriarchal society? More like a bunch guys who just want too get laid and worship women.
Who has the real power?
Ps Lauren Salzman was too short for Bangkok’s high-standards. He has moved on to Lana Brooke.
NiceGuy is correct.
While I do find Lauren to be far more attractive than Allison, once I learned about her height deficiency (she’s reportedly only 5′ tall) I just cannot tolerate women that short.
I had always assumed that she was relatively tall or at least normal height.
I had no idea that she was such a shorty until fairly recently, when I saw her and Allison standing next to each other.
Allison’s cankles make her masculine looking and unattractive IMO (incapable of giving men ‘ample’ wood).
Thus, I can’t give Keith much credit for banging that whore —– cuz her body is far less attractive than 90% of women at most any bar during happy hour.
Allison’s tits are almost non existent. Her legs are like those of a male wrestler. She’s stocky looking. She sure as fuck ain’t no swimsuit model. Yuck.
I’m not sure what Keith saw in Allison —– cuz most men would need extra strength Viagra just to get adequate wood to bang that slut. How did she get a starring role when there are thousands of better looking gals, without cankles, in the acting world.
There are times in life that call for soul searching. You are a redacted for making me realize I share similar tastes with Bangcock.
Whatever. All lies, misinformation, disinformation, on both sides. Frank, don’t you have bigger [redacted] to circle?
The media is all over the President of the United States for quoting Bangkok on “Kung Flu.” They’re saying it’s a racial slur.
Bangkok’s got some explaining to do on that count without adding another one such as impersonating Dennis Burke and/or [redacted] who may have disappeared Scott Johnson and most definitely [redacted].
What say you, Banger? Where’d you pick up “Kung Flu” and how did Trump get it?
I doubt that Bangkok is Dennis Burke.
I didn’t say Bangkok is Dennis Burke, I joked that Bangkok is *impersonating* Dennis Burke.
And, to clarify, it was not I who claimed Bangkok is Burke. He was in the running once long ago due to comments made by “FRIEND OF THE GOOD GUYS.”
As we’ve discussed, Frank — when you vehemently denied that YOU are Bangkok and I believed you — the top Bangkok suspects on my guess list are my ex-husband, Jeff Apple, and/or Jeffrey Peterson.
(That’s due, in part, to the alleged Bangcock V[redacted] and personal info Bangkok shared on FR regarding my whereabouts, etc. that only could have been shared by Jeff Apple or another real-life stalker.)
I don’t appreciate ANY of your or ANYONE’s on-going attempts to pin any of this Bangcockery on me by inference or otherwise.
You’re also dodging the simple question. Where did the clever but racist term “Kung Flu” originate?
It’s the Kung Flu because it originated from a lab in Wuhan China.
Donald Trump spoke the truth.
Senile Joe Biden is a puppet of Communist China.
Donald Trump can attract 12,000 people to watch his speech in person and 12 million to watch it on internet livestream.
Joe Biden can barely fill a high school gym halfway.
Donald Trump can give a speech that lasts an hour and forty minutes.
Joe Biden does not recall if he’s running for Senator from Delaware or President.
The Kung Flu term has been around for a long time. LOL
Perhaps Bangkok is Mike Pence. LOL
“With all due respect to the people who think that Lauren Salzman deserves (or will receive) a long jail sentence. Nope! Lauren does not deserve a long jail sentence.”
Oh but she does…she was connected to EVERY crime for around 20 years…She was the violent one, the one with no remorse, the one who had little to no excuses…
Because while she had coercive material collected, she was already practicing criminal action BEFORE the coercion.
“Lauren is probably among the least culpable players within the NXIVM storyline, especially among the higher-up players.”
It’s the absolute opposite…
“Allison Mack, however, was NOT groomed by her parents to worship Keith. Yet Allison still CHOSE to worship Keith even after she was ALREADY a successful actress — with her own independent life & money — when she first met Keith.”
Way to change history…but you are partly right, it’s not her parents…it’s Lauren and her mom.
Lauren is such an adorable person.
How many lives did she destroy in 20 years? (and she was in for 20 years, like it or not)
“That’s a huge difference [between Lauren and Allison]. This indicates that Allison bears more ‘mental’ responsibility than Lauren. She’s got dirtier hands than Lauren for precisely this reason.”
Righhhhht…you make so much sense
Lauren was not under any kind of particular treatment by Raniere…but she bears no mental responsibilities. Better yet, she did this kind of things for decades
No starvation(at least not as far as others), no sleep deprivation, no drugging, and she is the one who gave the EMs, not Allison
Allison was clearly manipulated mentally but the same can’t be said for Lauren…
Lauren never did one thing right or for the good of anyone…It’s not a case of “she believed in the good of the program”, she was behind the program with Raniere and her mother.
She knew EVERYTHING and continued fully, without thinking once about leaving.
“Lauren has left the dark side of the force. She deserves mercy. But Allison doesn’t.”
Lauren left nothing…if Nxivm still existed, she would still support it discreetly.
Allison left, it’s a fact…and she was mentally tempered by Lauren, her mom, and Raniere…just like all their victims.
This plus the abuse, I don’t know in which world you live but whatever you take is strong…
Scott, you are, as usual, some good, some bad but not too accurate
Bangkok, you usually are better at arguing but this is just ridiculous…if sometimes you might sound like a guy who’s not a complete idiot.
This time, you sound like a bad troll (not a good one, like you used us to see)
BTW, Franky, You think it’s clever to actually give an article to those two los…gentlemen who know nothing about the case?
While Scott is at least close enough (but still far from the reality), you give a voice to an obvious troll…
This is going to bite YOU back.
How can people take seriously anything you say when any nutj…inspired by fantasy people can post whatever they want?
What about the facts, the journalistic news…
Even average blogs don’t give voice to trolls…you feed the troll
And how about stop using Allison’s name to make click…except a few here, most will ignore those article so the purpose is lost.
And after giving us an “I believe she is a victim”, you victimize her further by allowing this kind of idiotic article…
This isn’t even interesting! a pseudo philosophic dispute on a subject they don’t know, don’t really care about, or ignore the facts.
This is comment material, not first-page material.
Scott knows more about NXIVM than you will ever realize – he came here originally because of how similar NXIVM is to what Scott personally experienced for a dozen years while he was in Amway (where Raniere got his MLM scam basic training) since 1993 and has been researching since 2005. LOL
Salzman will probably get a break since she gave testimony against Raniere and broke down during her testimony – the judge even stopped questioning and he has a soft spot for big noses blubbering on the witness stand. LOL
Speaking of Lauren’s testimony, Frank are we ever going to get to read the questions leading up to her climactic performance?
Yes. I intend to publish them.
This was no debate, Bangkok put out his [redacted] and Scott [redacted] LOL
—Bangkok put out his [redacted] and Scott [redacted] LOLA
So, Bangkok put out his [redacted]? And Scott [redacted]. LOLA
Now that’s a mouthful of [words]. LOLA
That’s an oldie but good from months ago. LOL
Salzman could start a windstorm if she turned her head fast enough with that beak of hers. LOL
Bangkok is STILL too [redacted] to come on Scott’s show after DEMANDING that Scott answer 11 questions and then some additional questions. LOL
Then Bangkok had the [redacted] to think he could DEMAND conditions before he came on Scott’s show. LOL
Scott thinks Bangkok would fit in very well with [redacted]. LOL
Scott thinks Bangkok would fit in very well? LOLA
I like the [redacted] more than I do the original words. LOL
Trying to fill in the redacted words is interesting to say the least.