By Bangkok
I’ll be occasionally posting every couple weeks until I’m back, whenever I find that Frank’s being too one-sided.
With all due respect to the people who think that Lauren Salzman deserves (or will receive) a long jail sentence…
Nope.
Here are the Facts:
1) Lauren does not deserve a long jail sentence.
2) The judge will never give Lauren a long jail sentence. I’m predicting 12-18 months max, with a downward departure from the recommended sentence.
FACT: Lauren is probably among the least culpable players within the NXIVM storyline, especially among the higher-up players.
FACT: Lauren has done FAR MORE to convict Keith than any other human being on planet Earth, especially when compared to her most vocal critics such as Milady Heidi Hutchinson-Manzana.
Lauren got up on the witness stand and held nothing back, delving into the most emotional testimony that her soul could bear.
I have yet to see Heidi do anything similar to that, to bring down Keith.
In fact, people like Heidi just sit back and snipe at poor Lauren – while not having the courage to forgive her.
Heidi did the right thing and finally turned against Keith. For that, she deserves some credit.
However, Heidi remained silent for 25 years (1984 thru 2009) before finally having the courage to turn against Keith publicly. Whereas Lauren did NOT remain silent against Keith for 25 years – since she wasn’t even with Keith for quite that long. 🙂
Thus, Lauren turned against Keith in a shorter period of time than Heidi did. 🙂
Also… According to Frank Parlato, Lauren was groomed from an early age (by her MOM) to be compliant with Keith’s every demand. Lauren was groomed – by her mom – to be physical with Keith while wrestling around as a teen – so that sex with Keith would be a logical next step once she became an adult.
FACT: Lauren’s mom worshiped Keith and groomed HER OWN CHILD to think likewise.
That’s a powerful thing.
How can you blame a child who was groomed by HER OWN MOM to do precisely what her mom wanted her to do?
It’s no different than blaming an Amish child for choosing to be Amish when they become an adult.
If you’re RAISED to be compliant with a certain ‘religion’ or ‘master’ (by your own MOM), then you’re far more likely to do precisely that when you grow up.
That’s why the judge will take pity on Lauren and give her a sentence between 12-18 months IMO (24 months tops).
Whereas Allison was NOT groomed by her parents to worship Keith. Yet Allison still CHOSE to worship Keith even after she was ALREADY a successful actress – with her own independent life & money – when she first met Keith.
That’s a huge difference. This indicates that Allison bears more ‘mental’ responsibility than Lauren. She’s got dirtier hands than Lauren for precisely this reason.
That’s why the judge will likely be giving Allison seven years in prison, thus giving her an ‘upward’ departure from normal sentencing guidelines.
What about forgiveness?
If you’re counting ‘bad deeds’ and feel that Lauren can’t be forgiven for her large number of bad deeds committed…
Well, then why not ask Heidi why she has publicly forgiven women like Kristin Keeffe who performed just as many bad deeds as Lauren, if not more.
Stop being hypocritical.
If you can forgive Keeffe, then you can forgive Lauren too. If not, then it would indicate that you’re harboring a deep resentment towards Lauren for reasons which you’re not admitting.
Lauren has left the dark side of the force. She deserves mercy. But Allison doesn’t.
Allison is a sick and twisted twat just like Nicki Clyne.
PS: Lauren also deserves a free nose job (compliments of Uncle Sam) to fix that ridiculously huge nose of hers. It’s just too big for her to find a suitable husband right now. Frank should start a GoFundMe page for Lauren’s nose job.
[…] it relates to my article yesterday, Bangkok: Lauren Salzman Deserves to Be Forgiven, I feel compelled to […]
It was $8 million, not $3 million. In my opinion, he probably never seriously thought about whether it was an advantage or a disadvantage
to eliminate Cafritz in his own way. Keith Raniere is too driven by his drives and too convinced of himself to think that for a long time. His
goals determine his thinking. And he always tries to achieve his goals with all his might. He wanted Pamela Cafritz’s money, and he wanted
to get rid of her because she was too old and no longer attractive to him. And he wanted to make better use of his dwindling sexual resources
and not waste it on an aging woman. He had also discovered the younger talent, Allison Mack, who was fanatically attached to him. He believed
that he had found his replacement for Cafritz. He could not push Cafritz away because she knew too much about him and his crimes, after all
she was an accomplice. Keith Raniere could not risk pushing her away without posing a threat to him. And with the death of Cafritz, an important
witness to his previous crimes was finally eliminated. From his point of view everything was fine. He believed he had done everything right. But
it was his mistake, by the way one of many….
Great points. Thanks
I’ll be occasionally posting every couple weeks until I’m back, whenever I find that Frank’s being too one-sided. — Bangkok, you’ve lost whatever “touch” you used to have, this is a poorly written story.
With all due respect to the people who think that Lauren Salzman deserves (or will receive) a long jail sentence… — They should ALL get long prison sentences, but they probably won’t get what they deserve. And it’s PRISON, not jail. Jail is before sentencing, prison is for after sentencing.
Nope. — Yep.
Here are the Facts: — These aren’t facts, they are opinions.
1) Lauren does not deserve a long jail sentence. — Opinion, not fact. As described in another comment I made, she does deserve a long prison sentence. The length of long period of time the abuse occurred, the large number of people abused, and the extreme severity of the abuse. Short sentences should be reserved for people with opposite factors in their behavior.
2) The judge will never give Lauren a long jail sentence. I’m predicting 12-18 months max, with a downward departure from the recommended sentence. — Another opinion. The judge probably won’t give her a long prison sentence, because he is known as a “soft” sentencing judge and has guidelines to defend his light sentence.
FACT: Lauren is probably among the least culpable players within the NXIVM story line, especially among the higher-up players. — WRONG. Salzman was a first-level DOS member who was in charge of keeping a girl confined for about 100 weeks.
FACT: Lauren has done FAR MORE to convict Keith than any other human being on planet Earth, especially when compared to her most vocal critics such as Milady Heidi Hutchinson-Manzana. — FALSE. Salzman was FORCED to help in order to save her own a$$ from a longer prison sentence. Hutchinson is useless, she had her chance in 1984 when her underage sister was being f*cked by Raniere and didn’t go to law enforcement and instead tried to convert him to Mormonism. Hutchinson blew another chance when her sister (or someone) blew her brains out and did NOTHING to inform law enforcement about her younger sister’s history with Raniere.
Lauren got up on the witness stand and held nothing back, delving into the most emotional testimony that her soul could bear. — It was part of her plea deal, she either said everything she knew or the deal would have been thrown out.
I have yet to see Heidi do anything similar to that, to bring down Keith. — See above. Hutchinson is USELESS.
In fact, people like Heidi just sit back and snipe at poor Lauren —- while not having the courage to forgive her. — Forgiveness doesn’t take courage, it takes faith.
Heidi did the right thing and finally turned against Keith. For that she deserves some credit. — Very little credit, and because she was so late to the party, we can’t believe anything coming out of her mouth or fingers.
However, Heidi remained silent for 25 years (1984 thru 2009) before finally having the courage to turn against Keith publicly. Whereas Lauren did NOT remain silent against Keith for 25 years — since she wasn’t even with Keith for quite that long. 🙂 — Hutchinson didn’t do much from 2009 to about 2017/18 when she started posting on this website. Besides, it’s not about counting years as much as it is knowing what is wrong and doing something about it.
Thus, Lauren turned against Keith in a shorter period of time than Heidi did. 🙂 — Salzman turned on Raniere ONLY to save her own a$$, so the time period doesn’t count.
Also… According to Frank Parlato, Lauren was groomed from an early age (by her MOM) to be compliant with Keith’s every demand. Lauren was groomed — by her mom — to be physical with Keith while wrestling around as a teen — so that sex with Keith would be a logical next step once she became an adult. — Where did Frank say that?
FACT: Lauren’s mom worshiped Keith and groomed HER OWN CHILD to think likewise. — You got this one right, that makes one in a row.
That’s a powerful thing. — Two in a row.
How can you blame a child who was groomed by HER OWN MOM to do precisely what her mom wanted her to do? — I can blame her after she reaches legal age, that’s how it works. End of getting things right.
Nancy Salzman led her daughter Lauren into the mysteries and wonders of Vanguard and Nancy took the first plea deal and got the best deal for herself. — All of the others could have beaten Salzman to be the first one to cut a deal, several months went by before she cut a deal.
It’s no different than blaming an Amish child for choosing to be Amish when they become an adult. — The Amish are much more isolated than Salzman was, so there are significant differences.
If you’re RAISED to be compliant with a certain ‘religion’ or ‘master’ (by your own MOM) then you’re far more likely to do precisely that when you grow up. — Wrong, see above.
That’s why the judge will take pity on Lauren and give her a sentence between 12-18 months IMO (24 months tops). — The judge will proably follow the guidelines and he’s known as giving light sentences, if that’s your definition of pity, so be it.
Whereas Allison was NOT groomed by her parents to worship Keith. Yet Allison still CHOSE to worship Keith even after she was ALREADY a successful actress — with her own independent life & money — when she first met Keith. — I understand Mack’s parents were exposed to NXIVM before she was and supported her getting involved. Mack is the typical Hollyweird insecure actress nutjob, which made her an easy target.
That’s a huge difference. This indicates that Allison bears more ‘mental’ responsibility than Lauren. She’s got dirtier hands than Lauren for precisely this reason. — No, it’s not a huge difference. It may be a “different” difference, but not a huge one. Dirty hands are defined by behaviors, and Salzman has more bad behaviors than Mack.
That’s why the judge will likely be giving Allison seven years in prison, thus giving her an ‘upward’ departure from normal sentencing guidelines. — Although Mr. Shadow would consider seven years to be inadequate, i doubt Mack’s sentence will be anywhere near that long, unless he gives Salzman even more time.
What about forgiveness? — Let the victims forgive Salzman if they want to, I’m not involved, so there is nothing for me to forgive.
If you’re counting ‘bad deeds’ and feel that Lauren can’t be forgiven for her large number of bad deeds committed… — Salzman can be forgiven, but that’s the victims’ job, not anybody else.
Well, then why not ask Heidi why she has publicly forgiven women like Kristin Keeffe who performed just as many bad deeds as Lauren, if not more. — Hutchinson has no role in forgiving anybody, she wasn’t victimized.
Stop being hypocritical. — Stop being wrong.
If you forgive Keeffe then you can forgive Lauren too. If not, then it would indicate that you’re harboring a deep resentment towards Lauren for reasons which you’re not admitting. — See above, only victims have a role in forgiving those who took advantage of them.
Lauren has left the dark side of the force. She deserves mercy. But Allison doesn’t. — None of them deserve mercy, in this life or the next.
Allison is a sick and twisted twat just like Nicki Clyne. — There are a LOT of sick and twisted twats in NXIVM, male and female.
Message to the sycophants who kiss Heidi’s butt in every thread…
If Heidi reserves the right to trash other people and castigate them whenever she wants, without Frank intervening, then it’s a bit hypocritical for Heidi to expect her own hypocrisy to go unmentioned. Fair is fair.
If you wanna pucker up and kiss Heidi’s butt (like Niceguy and his unnatural crush on Heidi) then be my guest.
That’s your Constitutional right to be a sycophant. But it sure doesn’t command much respect. 🙂
I’ve said this before many times…
It’s been obvious to me that Niceguy’s wife has been wearing the pants in their marriage for years.
It’s also obvious to me that ‘Niceguy’ is NOT just a fake persona, as he’s trying to claim now. He wears his heart on his sleeve and everybody here can see that.
I could tell from day #1 that if wifey says jump, Niceguy is airborne within 2 seconds flat.
I also know that Niceguy likely washes the family clothing every week, while wifey is the main breadwinner.
If the kiddies need a booger stain removed from their shirt, it’ll be Niceguy who fetches the bleach (not wifey).
That kind of life will slowly take the manhood away from a dude.
Have a nice day. 🙂
Bangkoks,
The only sycophant is you with your silver tongue trying to spark Lauren Salzman’s interest…..
Addendum to my above post:
Although Heidi Manzana never ‘officially’ joined NXIVM and although she never became romantic with Keith, she was still an ENABLER of Keith just like everybody else who witnessed Keith’s aberrant behavior for years and didn’t report it to authorities or at least publicly condemn Keith among his peers.
I’m too lazy to re-read Heidi’s articles from last year LOL, but if memory serves, Heidi admitted to the following things:
1) She admits to witnessing Keith cheat on an IQ test that he later used to recruit female followers, while remaining silent until 2009 about this DEVIOUS shit.
Thus, she enabled Keith to use that fake IQ test score to ‘recruit’ people for many years.
As for her claim that she didn’t know Keith was using that fake IQ test score to recruit people for years, my reply is
“Yeah Sure, and rain travels up instead of down”.
2) She admits to catching Keith leaving her sister’s window, but is now trying to claim that she didn’t know they were having sex on that occasion. Yeah sure. Common sense tells me that Heidi knew GOD DAMN WELL that her sister and Keith weren’t just playing Scrabble before she walked in. LOL. Common sense would tell her that they weren’t just watching HBO together.
Yet she remained silent for many years —- but likes to shit on OTHERS for not standing up to Keith sooner. WTF?
3) She admits to receiving a $10,000 payment from Keith as payment for a slogan that she created which Keith wanted to use for NXIVM. Granted, Keith allegedly sent her this payment without her asking for it. However, to the best of my knowledge, Heidi kept the money and didn’t give it back. If that’s really true, it would mean that she accepted money from a guy who allegedly committed statutory rape on a family member years earlier.
Yet she shits on OTHERS for accepting money from Keith and his shady activities. WTF?
4) She admits that Keith had influence (or was somehow involved) in her own divorce from Mr. Manzana, which seems rather odd since Keith was the same guy who allegedly committed statutory rape years earlier.
To put it another way, why would an INTELLIGENT PERSON seek marital advice from the same bastard who allegedly committed ‘statutory’ rape many years earlier?
…and then she comes HERE to shit on Lauren for not being perfect? WTF? 🙂
IMPORTANT: I’m not condemning Heidi for these things.
Heidi was clearly confused or mentally mixed-up back then.
She’s human, just like Lauren.
However, I’m simply making the point that it’s HYPOCRITICAL for Heidi to condemn Lauren Salzman (and other people) when women like Karen U, Kristin Keeffe and even Heidi herself remained equally silent for many years before finally seeing the light.
Pot meet Kettle. 🙂
=====================
PS — If my ‘memory’ didn’t serve me perfectly (and some of my data is not correct) then Heidi can correct me for the record. As I said earlier, I’m just writing what I ‘remember’ from articles she wrote last year. But I’m pretty sure that everything written is accurate though. 🙂
Let’s ask Sarah Edmondson, who was tortured by Lauren Salzman with a hot iron for 30 minutes, whether Lauren Salzman should be forgiven.
The only reason Bangkok wants Lauren Salzman to be forgiven is that Bangkok wants to bang his cock in Lauren Salzman.
A recent article stated the actual burning takes only a few minutes, not 30, which is FAR more logical of a timeframe for a 2″X2″ mark. One has to add some squirming and screaming time, as well as an occasional turning away from the fumes of burning flesh, but a few minutes is still plenty of time to get the job done, especially after a couple of practice “volunteers.” Also, Salzman recruited Edmondson, she did NOT cauterize her. I think Bangkok wants Salzman to get the nose job before he bangs her.
Scott – You are not as retarded as I previously believed.
“A recent article stated the actual burning takes only a few minutes, not 30, which is FAR more logical of a timeframe for a 2″X2″ mark.”
NiceGuy’s alter ego salutes you!
Now, if you just could just come to understand literate people with internet connections do not need your help.
You are more retarded than I previously believed, because MLMs would have collapsed a long time ago if what you claim about literate people with internet connections were true. LOL
I know a lot of Bangkok’s writing is satire. But still, I want to say that Lauren does not need to surgically alter her appearance to be attractive. I saw her in court, and she is a pretty woman, albeit in an unconventional way.
Salzman is pretty in an unconventional way, pretty disgusting. The huge beak doesn’t help, either.
Diane,
RE Lauren Salzman Attractive
Diane, is this what you consider attractive?
http://images.wikia.com/muppet/images/9/93/SamSeason2.jpg.
…..To each his/her own, I guess.
Let’s seek the opinion of the Mexican woman who was locked up in a room for eighteen months by Lauren Salzman whether Lauren should be forgiven.
Shadowstate,
Exactly!!!!!! Thank for reminding everyone including myself of Dani’s hellish existence for 1 1/2 years!!
People should think of what the experience of being held in a room and completely isolated for over 500 days is like.
Lauren deserves 3-5 years. She lucked out and skirted the kidnaping charges she deserved, for assisting in the confinement of Dani. The judge felt bad for Lauren but guess what?………[He better not give Lauren 2 years!]
Everybody says they are sorry when they get caught!!!!
Bangkok will just have to wait a few years, salivating, for those succulent tender meat curtains. In the meantime Bangkok can always smell the “Flowers”:
I feel that if Pam had been alive Lauren would never have turned on keith. if all the women kept saying the branding was their idea; that It was something they wanted to do as part of their sorority; Keith would be free. Pam was very good at keeping everyone happy with Rainer. Once she died. Rainer lost that. he was not able to maintain order. People started talking.
I think he never realized how much Pam helped him. Were 3 million dollars from her estate worth his freedom?
Pam is probably in hell for being his enabler. But she really was the one that kept everyone in check for him. I think she would have convinced Lauren that things were OK.
The cauterizing may not have started if Cafritz was still alive. Salzman did think everything was okay, up until the point the Mexican law enforcement guns were pointing at her head. It still took Salzman several months to cop a plea. Cafritz would have had little to no influence on Salzman after she was arrested.
Good points . Thanks
I agree she was groomed but wasn’t that in her twenties? I would like Lauren to admit her mother is one of the worst but I doubt that would happen. As it stands she would be still under her corrupt, evil mother’s influence. That’s still something of a worry. The judge should do Lauren a favour and sentence her to a long prison stint where she may free from the evils of her mother for a while
I think Salzman’s mom talked up Raniere before she left college. With them recently photographed getting along in the roadside coffee shop, I don’t think she will admit her mom is one of the worst. All of them should get long prison sentences, based on the number of people abused, the length of time, and extreme nature of the abuse.
I agree Scott. Let’s hope that happens but I have my doubts
Bangkok,
“FACT: Lauren is probably among the least culpable players within the NXIVM story line, especially among the higher-up players.”-Bangkok
FACT: You just want to drape Lauren’s giant purple labia over your face like an oxygen mask; While you perform cunnilingus….
…..If lauren so happens to have vaginosis at the time you might asphyxiate on the fumes.
FACT: Lauren could use her “giant beak” to vilolate your sh*t locker and tear your asshole into two halves, like dry firewood. She could even use that giant beak to skull f*ck the brains out of you and give you a lobotomy.
FACT: You are so retarded you actually believe that by writing this dog sh*t pile of an article defending Lauren; She will reward you, by taking your pitiful ass to bed.
FACT: If you are a spoiled rich kid, career-less and jobless Lauren Salzman will see your sorry ass as a meal ticket, and let you f*cking knock her up, so she can collect the child support. Fact there is no other way you will ever be getting laid; So go for it!!!! You might as well procreate with Lauren Salzman. I bet Bangkok junior will be even be more retarded than the original.
Good night you little dipshit! 🙂
Don’t hold back now nice guy 😂
“Lauren’s giant purple labia over your face like an oxygen mask; While you perform cunnilingus” WOW you just described the one time in band camp that….you get the picture.
Band Camp?
American Pie is a classic!!!!
Lauren Salzman wasn’t groomed by her mom as a child to be with Keith Raniere. It wasn’t like she grew up in the cult and was promised to Raniere at birth.
Lauren Salzman had graduated college and was spending the summer in Europe when Nancy Salzman and Keith Raniere hooked up and went into business together.
When Lauren returned she had as many options opened to her as any other college graduate. Lauren decided to go to work for her mom.
Lauren could have had as easily gone to work for her dad who had a successful medical practice. He would have found her a place in his business.
Lauren Salzman had one of the top paying positions in NXIVM working for her mother. She could easily make 80,000 in a month.
Being an adult woman, she had a choice to say no to Keith Raniere sexual relations.
As with her mom and many other women, Lauren found something attractive about Raniere and was willing to go along with him having other lovers.
Yes, in the end, when her ass was on the line, Lauren did what was right for her. She took the stand against Raniere. Not to uphold “the right thing to do”. It was to save her own ass.
Lauren did a lot of mind bending for her mon and Raniere. Lauren left a lot of emotional scares to thousands of people
Most of those scars were not branded into the flesh. People have to live with that damage for the rest of their lives.
Forgiveness is not for anyone other than oneself. No one can forgive Lauren other than herself. Hopefully she will have a good long sentence to consider all the damage she did to people.
Lauren can’t forgive herself for the wrongs she perpetrated on others. That’s not how forgiveness works.
“Whereas Allison was NOT groomed by her parents to worship Keith”
No, she was groomed by Lauren and her mother…so yeaaaah let’s forgive the “brainwasher”
“That’s a huge difference. This indicates that Allison bears more ‘mental’ responsibility than Lauren”
Humm no…Allison was down when Lauren jumped on her, it’s just as bad.
Allison had poor confidence and Lauren used it against her
Lauren was always a little Raniere ,contrary to Allison…but once again, let’s forgive her!
Bangkok, i know you don’t need to hear it because you hear it a lot and you probably are aware of it, but you are an absolute idiot!
BTW, Garaufis is not known to be a rude punisher…he tend not to believe in long jail time so i doubt he would raise the guideling when it is already WAY over the time Allison is supposed to get…
Also he stand by the proof and proofs show that Allison did nothing but collect collateral.
I suspect you were trolling to rage those who support Allison but since i’m not worried about that part, it’s a fail(for me, at least).
If “Lauren was always a little Raniere” then it’s quite possible that Mack was, too – there had to have been reasons that Raniere chose her as his henchwoman, and that she was the perfect fit to unfailing carry out her role as DOS head mistress and enforcer.
Unacceptable. You said you wouldn’t post until spring. Be gone.
Nutjob,
You didn’t actually take Bangkok at his word did you?