Nxivm slave master Allison Mack recorded a conversation she had with her master, Keith Alan Raniere, during a walk they took on January 9, 2016, at 6:59 AM.
The place was Knox Woods in Half Moon, New York where they both lived until late 2017. The topic was branding women.
The branding had just started. Allison herself had been recently branded, as were, it is believed, six other women – the First Line DOS slaves of Raniere’s.
Raniere wanted to perfect the branding ritual and give Allison instructions.
In this tape [see below], you can see the sadistic mind of the lunatic demon.
When Allison and the other women were branded, they were branded by a man who was evidently hired and was practiced in scarification. They kept their underwear on and it was not as painful as the other, future branding sessions would come to be.
Later, Dr. Danielle Roberts, a DOS slave herself, a slave to Allison, would do the branding and make it far more painful, deliberately, as per Raniere’s instructions.
As we study if Raniere could be potentially a murderer, I think this conversation with Mack is revealing and helpful.
It is believed that the recording was provided to the feds by Allison Mack and was played to the jury in the trial against Keith Raniere.
Here is the transcript of the recording.
AM = Allison Mack. KR = Keith Raniere
AM: Keith and Allison, January 9th, 6:59 AM talking about branding on a walk.
KR: You guys did it and you weren’t completely nude. Do you think the person who’s being branded should be completely nude and sort of held to the table like a sort of almost like a sacrifice? I don’t know if that’s a feeling of submission. And the person should ask to be branded.
KR: They should say ‘please brand me it would be an honor’ or something like that. ‘It’s an honor I want to wear for the rest of my life.’
KR: And they should probably say that before they are held down. So it doesn’t seem like they are being coerced.
KR: We know the depth of our love through pain.
KR: There is no other way in the human condition. And also, of course, videoing it gives collateral. Something that they say initially. ‘Although my body may be burned or tortured, my love is stronger.’
This is Raniere’s teachings to the women who trusted him: Brand them with his initials [and as some believe Allison Mack’s initials too].
Make them feel pain. Equate pain to love and them give them lots of pain and delude them into thinking this is how they show love. Pure sadism.
Note the part about videoing the nude branding of women to use potentially as blackmail worthy ‘collateral.”
And some of his defenders say, he is incapable of murder.
The brutal branding of the slaves of DOS evolved, based on Raniere’s instruction to Mack into a 25-40-minute branding session. Dr. Roberts would slowly etch out the brand, stroke by stroke, with a white-hot cauterizing pen on the pubic region of the women. They were permitted no anesthesia.
Because it was so painful, four other nude slaves had to hold down the nude slave to be branded – one holding each limb. Another slave would video the entire session making sure to capture both the face and the vagina of the branded woman, each in turn.
Raniere would be in control of these videos to use as possible blackmail on the women in case they decided to leave or reveal the secrets of DOS.
Oftentimes, I was told, the women, or at least Dr. Roberts, wore a mask because the smell of burning flesh was gag-worthy and the chance of airborne infection was high.
The Fall of Allison Mack
Allison Mack went from a popular TV actress to a cult member to a slave and slave master to an indicted defendant charged with sex trafficking to a convicted racketeer facing years in prison.
For whatever reason, Raniere chose her to lead other women into the branding and blackmailing of women. She might be a victim, but she was certainly a willing and enthusiastic perpetrator.
One point of interest: Note the way Raniere says the word “submission” in the recording. He puts a lot of emphasis on the final syllable of the word. Listen to Allison softly say “OK.”
It seems as if she is hypnotized and Raniere, who is alleged to be a master hypnotist, has her under his complete control and one of his code words for her is “submission.”
This argues towards a theory that Allison is more victim than perpetrator. Although I have often heard it said that one cannot be hypnotized to do something against one’s true nature.
Finally, the plan to brand thousands of women might have worked but for two things. First, Sarah Edmondson was willing to risk having her collateral released [it was released] to bring down this wicked cult. And second, Catherine Oxenberg was upset enough about her daughter India being branded that she came to me to seek public exposure of this monstrous practice.
Had it not been for these two women and the work I did to publicize the brandings, Raniere and company might be still branding and blackmailing women.
When I first started publishing the branding stories, beginning on June 5, 2017, few took notice outside the cult. It caused a sensation within the cult, and women started quitting immediately. But the mainstream media was slow to take notice.
Gradually, they did, starting with the New York Times and then the Albany Times Union.
I feel we are in the same place now.
People read my branding stories and said, “That’s impossible. He’s making this up.”
My writing about the possibility of murder – by Raniere – has been greeted with a similar fate. People are saying “That’s impossible.”
But this time, the mainstream media is quicker to write about it. It was four long months between my breaking the branding story and the NY Times writing their story, four months of being the sole reporter to write about Raniere branding women before the world caught on.
This time, thanks to Investigation Discovery, which took an interest in my investigation into possible murders, the mainstream media is already taking notice.
And the film, “The Lost Women of Nxivm” has not aired yet.
When it does, people will start to take the possibility that Raniere besides being a sex trafficker, a racketeer, a financial criminal, and an abuser of women and girls, may be far more nefarious than previously believed.
He might be a murderer.
Stay tuned…and be sure to watch “The Lost Women of Nxivm” on Investigation Discovery at 9:00 pm on Sunday, December 8th.
Giving yourself an awful lot of credit there, aren’t you Frank?
I offer the utmost respect to everyone who contributes to the downfall of this monster known as Raniere, and hope that he never sets foot outside of a prison again.
With that being said, Frank here has seemingly spent a lot of time jerking himself off for being the first person to write an article about this. Only offering a single small piece of gratitude to the people who provided you with a story.
Not to mention that you’re very clearly and shamelessly plugging your documentary. If he’s a murderer, how about you let the law enforcement investigation uncover that?
You might be right.
“He might be a murderer.”
You also might be wrong.
I’m not going to let your flawed and ineffective marketing strategy sway my opinion into accusing someone of murder. I can perform my own research and formulate my own opinion. Kind of like how I came across your article.
Get over yourself Frank.
How does Raniere deny being the creator of the brand knowing this audio has been revealed?
Yet another Allison Mack article. These kinds of articles about Allison have been going on now every week, sometimes several times a week, FOR A YEAR AND A HALF, UNABATED.
I do not believe the law permits the constant, unrelenting advertising of a persons mis-steps, whether they are a celebrity or not.
I now suspect Frank report is deliberately attempting to provoke a catharsis of some kind with Allison Mack.
Allison and India Oxenberg were reported (by this blog) to have provided the Department of Justice with the recordings of their meetings with Mr. Raniere including the one you are posting.
Is it not inappropriate to continue to abuse her so viciously? (I can already hear Shadows keyboard clicking)
I agree that the Shadow articles were overkill. However, this article was written by Frank. If you skipped over the content of the article, I’d suggest reading it. To me, it was a pro-Allison article. I came away seeing how she just did everything Keith told her. I read that Keith was using hypnosis on her, and read the argument that she is more victim than some think. But, as you noted, my biggest takeaway was that she may have been the one to provide this audio. I’m personally hoping all of these points help the judge go easy on her.
“I came away seeing how she just did everything Keith told her. ”
A lot of the Nazis did everything that Hitler told them.
And they are still as GUILTY AS SIN.
Charles Manson’s followers did everything he told them to do.
And several of them were sentenced to death for just following orders.
“Following Orders” is not a defense to criminal behavior.
Did I miss it, or did somebody say “Following orders is a defense to criminal behavior”. Cause I keep hearing you argue against this imaginary statement.
“I do not believe the law permits the constant, unrelenting advertising of a persons mis-steps, whether they are a celebrity or not.”
Once a person is indicted for serious Federal felonies, they are fair game.
Welcome to the United States of America.
‘Is it not inappropriate to continue to abuse her so viciously?”
When was the First Amendment of the US Constitution repealed?
“[and as some believe Allison Mack’s initials too].”
You made a type : “Some idiots believe…”
“For whatever reason, Raniere chose her to lead other women into the branding and blackmailing of women. She might be a victim, but she was certainly a willing and enthusiastic perpetrator.”
Another mistake…it’s clearly demonstrated that she was absolutely not the lead…first, she was in the same position as every victims.
Second, she was coerced
This record show how much she was “willing” (ok, ok, right”…wow she is so willing and enthusiastic!)
At least, try to avoid the “willing and enthusiastic” when you just posted a proof of the contrary…idiot!
Also, way to swerve,once again, the facts…the coercion, the starving and sleep deprivation.
“This argues towards a theory that Allison is more victim than perpetrator.”
Well it’s not an argument, it’s a FACT…
” Although I have often heard it said that one cannot be hypnotized to do something against one’s true nature.”
By idiots…because if that is true, there is no victims…not even one!
Frenchie, you still can’t explain why Mack remained as Raniere’s right hand henchwoman when she had several extended periods away from the “the coercion, the starving and sleep deprivation” – just the sort of breaks, and opportunities for reflection, that caused others to leave.
Mack had some unique deficit, if not depravity, such that she was put in a position above all the others, and did things others did not or would not do. Perhaps hers is even the sort of banal evil that Hannah Arendt described in her reporting and book about Nazi holocaust functionary Adolph Eichman’s trial in Jerusalem.
that’s your opinion AnonyMaker, in this blog, frank had already published a list of several of the women in DOS and surprise, surprise several of them were in the same condition as Allison being able to travel and take breaks away from Albany, but still they did not abandon the cult, in fact many of the women are known to have just left the DOS group, just because Frank began to publish their names and not because of the guarantees, so your argument falls under its own weight and proves that you have not read all the stories that Frank published about the DOS group, a clear example of women who traveled are: Nicki Clyne, Michele Hatchette, VANESSA HUBER, Diana Lim, Rosalaura junco, and just to mention some of the names most known by blog readers .
Words of a human piece of shit:
KR: They should say ‘please brand me it would be an honor’ or something like that. ‘It’s an honor I want to wear for the rest of my life.’
Do we know WHY AM taped it?
Did KR know he was being taped?
That guy is a BASTARD. “We know love through pain. They need to ask for it. It’s an F’ING HONOR” to wear his initials.
I hope that bastard gets life. F— HIM. Imagine if that was YOUR daughter.
To me, the tape shows how NXIVM’s “rational inquiry” method was really just a line of leading questioning, delivered to people willing or conditioned to accept the indoctrination behind it. Despite the nominal format of the exchange, Mack never responds with anything more than an obedient “OK.”
But Mack isn’t resolved of responsibility for her part in carrying things out, which at times definitely involved initiative on her part, such as when she was on her own in California for an extended period doing a play, and yet berated Lauren Salzman for not being tough enough on slaves. It’s also not entirely ruled out that she initiated the branding idea, as claimed in her New York Times interview; it’s possible that it grew out of her manipulative and reportedly abusive relationship with her early fiancee, where the body art that both got were were part of the dysfunctional dynamic, and when she might even have been first exposed to scarification.
While it’s indeed the longstanding conventional wisdom that hypnotized people won’t do anything they wouldn’t do normally, I think a number of cases such as that of the attorney in Ohio who sexually abused clients, and the experiments of Darren Brown, suggest that it may be possible to get people do things against their principles, and even against their own best interests. And particularly when hypnotism and related influence techniques such as NLP are used on people over an extended period in settings in which there is social reinforcement and control as well, it appears that a high degree of undue influence over individual behavior is possible; Scientology is an example of that.
And I don’t think that branding would have worked more than one or two levels down in the pyramid from the leader driving everything, past the size of approximately 100 people at which it did in fact fall apart. It comes down to the charisma and aura of the leader, and it shows that Raniere was ultimately delusional in thinking that he could create a big branding pyramid, when NXIVM had only even approached having 20,000 people take its introductory courses over 2 decades, and probably never had more than a tenth that number of active members, severely eroded by the bad publicity and scandals Raniere’s behavior created first in 2003, then in 2012 and finally in 2018.
Let’s set the law straight for everyone.
If you are in a criminal gang and your boss tells you to commit a crime and you commit it, then you are as guilty as the boss.
“I was just following orders” is never a defense to a criminal charge.
Example: the many murders ordered by Charles Manson.
Manson’s demented followers, including Tex Watson, Susan Atkins, Patricia Krenwinkel and Leslie Van Houten were all convicted and sentenced to death for just following orders.
The boss Manson was also sentenced to death.
The death sentences were commuted to life in 1972 when the California Supreme Court ruled the death penalty, as then applied in California, was unconstitutional.
Illegal Orders are never “OK”.
ALLISON MACK IS AS GUILTY AS SIN.
I am stoked to be watching Frank’s exposé The Lost Women of Nxivm!
…….Meanwhile, Shadowstate is busy cooking up some jambalaya, settings up the hors-d’oeuvre table with fine offerings and deciding on the night’s libations.
Tonight will be bigger than the Super Bowl in the Shadow household and only second to Allison Mack’s sentencing date.
“…….Meanwhile, Shadowstate is busy cooking up some jambalaya, settings up the hors-d’oeuvre table with fine offerings and deciding on the night’s libations.”
I don’t eat Cajun cooking.
I would be celebrating more if the leaders of NXIVM displayed some backbone and said a firm “NO!” to the many illegal orders they received over the years.
..But what would you drink? What does the Shadow drink to relax?
I am curious. My go to is beer; Budweiser or German Jever pilsner. Most good German beers ironically taste like Bud.
What’s your poison Shadow?
“Most good German beers ironically taste like Bud.” Nice Guy
Budweiser was first brewed by the Anheuser-Busch family. A German family.
The Germans have very strict Purity Laws for beer limiting the ingredients.
These laws, with modifications, date back to 1516.
As for me, I generally do not drink alcohol except on rare occasions.
Shadowstate, sadly, Budweiser beer has rice in it and, therefore, does not conform to the German purity laws.
Actually Nice Guy, the German Purity Law has been modified to allow other grains in beer.
“The revised Vorläufiges Biergesetz (Provisional Beer Law) of 1993, which replaced the earlier regulations, is a slightly expanded version of the Reinheitsgebot, stipulating that only water, malted barley, hops and yeast be used for any bottom-fermented beer brewed in Germany. In addition, the law allows the use of powdered or ground hops and hop extracts, as well as stabilization and fining agents such as PVPP. Top-fermented beer is subject to the same rules, with the addition that a wider variety of malted grains can be used, as well as pure sugars for flavor and coloring.”
“Exceptions to the current rules can be sought, and have been granted to allow gluten-free beer to be labeled as beer despite the use of different ingredients”
No arguing. She pleaded guilty.
Shadow’s got a boner, Shadow’s got a boner, Shadow’s got a boner
Does your brain ever think about any subject over the belt?
The music suggests it’s a clip from a documentary. “The Lost Women of Nxivm”?
Correct, we used the clip in “The Lost Women of Nxivm”.
I’m wondering why Keith didn’t take his own advice when he says we know love thru pain.
So…if the brand is the 4 elements….where is his brand on him? Hmmm?
Silly me! Lol
It’s not the 4 elements. It’s his initials KAR!
Why didn’t anyone of his minions ask him where his brand was? His collateral?????
Pretty simple. Keith’s collateral, in his mind, was his precious semen.
I wonder who made that recording, Alison or Keith? It seems to be the only piece of “collateral” on KR
” It seems to be the only piece of “collateral” on KR”
There is another piece of collateral on Keith Raniere and that is the video of Raniere having sex with the 15 year old girl.
A video that was filmed in 2005 or 2006.
That was the video that forced all of Raniere’s co-defendants to plead guilty to avoid child sex trafficking charges.
Where is Chet Hardin’s TV show? On Tony’s Twitter, it says that Chet Hardin is a groundbreaking investigative journalist that brought down the cult.
Didn’t “Jane” the DOS slave say Allison Mack was not branded? That she had a tattoo or something?
Frank, what do you think of this Sir?
What do you think of the old Rolling Stone article quoting Allison Mack about tattoos vs. branding flesh? There she seemed not only proud of her branding input, but she was bragging about it. She seemed non-hypnotized and effervescent, whilst patting herself on the back for recommending something more meaningful than mere tattoos, specifically accrediting herself with the branding “inspiration.”
So sometimes Mack was wack and hypnotized, and other times she was a jolly elf from smallville? She had cue-words from her personal Hitler/Rasputin, such as sub: mission? Did she eat at Subway the same as a Subway perv? Between group brandings and blowjobs?
She even said that she had two tattoos herself and like, big whoop. Hers were nothing. So like, yeah. Branding was something she endorsed, like Mr. Ed, the talking horse, or the horse’s patootie. Allison Mack, too cool for school, but there is always Victorville. Like yeah, right next to Apple Valley.
Speaking of the satanic mutualism, who was that “masked man” who branded the firstline slaves? Was he the one who taught Danielle how to devil dog it with the cauterizing pen? Maybe she has new business in Mexico? So, where is the branding professional now, still have a clinic in Albany?
Hearing Raniere instruct Mack how to further his sadistic viewing pleasure, one hopes that the jury for Raniere’s trial heard this audio, too. Someone who has hijacked a phone in Flabturd’s jailhouse just might happen to hear it tonight. You never can be sure what’s popping in Brooklyn’s MDC, where Keithie-Weethie’s somnambulant, hypnotic atonality could bring on a big-ass protest. It could be a long haul before January eighth, 2020, and nobody wants to check Raniere’s stinking crystal balls. Not without a euthanasia garbage bag or at least a machete.
Well, there is one gargoyle who might help him not kill himself, but one has heard she’s considering running for POTUS, rather gleefully. On the other hand, she could use some of Raniere’s chopped word salad as presidential material.
Wasn’t the Rolling Stone article just quoting the interview that Vanessa Gregoriadis did for the New York Times?
If I recall correctly, the first brandings were done by a professional body artist, I think in Brooklyn, with Roberts watching so that she could learn the technique. A professional like that would not have allowed a client to be nude – and would have obtained proper written consent – because of the protocols they follow in large part to avoid any legal problems. Some tattoo and piercing parlors also perform scarification or branding by various methods, including using medical cautery pens.
You may have been there being a Brooklyn NXIVM member
Anyone who believes Anonymaker is/was a NXIVM member is actually mentally retarded, unlike Kim Snyder who isn’t.
Did you find the Vanessa Gregoriadis misleading or a Nxivm “fluff” piece?
When I initially read the article by Gregoriadis, I felt the takeaway was that the Nxivm branding scandal was a story of women making decisions based on free will. Gregoriadis even said she believed Nxivm was not a cult. Her article seemed to explain away the entire branding story as free will. I honestly thought after reading the story by Gregoriadis that the initial branding story, as well as The Frank Report, were bullshit; no offense to Frank. At the time I started to think Frank was an angry man with an ax to grind, again no offense to Frank.
I now take great umbrage with Gregoriadis’s article. She was incredibly irresponsible to do no research and ask no pointed questions.
She has never published anything further on Nxivm…..Embarrassment perhaps?
Anonymaker, objectively to you agree with me or do you think my perspective is wrong. I am curious about how you see things. I am sure you read the article.
I am not much of an “its all fake news” type guy but Gregoriadis’s article seems like a “fake news” piece.
NiceGuy, I agree that Gregoriadis’ article was disturbingly sympathetic to NXIVM. My initial impression is that she was trying to see things from the perspective of those involved, and consider their stated idea of female empowerment, but missed the bigger picture of a high control group and its hothouse inner circle.
Having more recently seen pictures here of her outside Apropos, where she apparently did one or more courses, suggests to me that she got too close to her subject to be objective – though if she hadn’t gotten their trust, she might not have gotten the story. Perhaps NXIVM succeeded in unduly influencing her.
I probably should re-read the article and see what I think of it at this point, but I don’t have time time right now, and wanted to be sure to get off at least some sort of response to you.
Also, if I recall, Dianne reported that Grigoriadis was present for at least part of the NXIVM trial, so apparently she was continuing to follow the evolving story, even if she hasn’t reported about it – yet.
Gregoriadis is a free-lancer who writes articles “on spec” – and then hopes to sell them to some media outlet. Occasionally, such writers take on paid assignments from people (or groups) who are looking to get a positive story about themselves published somewhere. I’m not saying that’s what happened here but her story definitely fits the pattern.
Do we know the circumstances of her recording him? Did he know he was being recorded?
She was probably recording because she wanted to remember exactly what he said to please him (she was that brainwashed), just like journalists often record interviews or students record lectures to know what was exactly said instead of relying on memory which isn’t as reliable. I don’t think it’s anymore significant than that.
What I recall from testimony is that Raniere had almost all of his conversations recorded, as a record of his greatness. The exception was when he met with his housemate Kristin Keeffe, then NXIVM’s legal liaison, to discuss legal matters. That was when Daniela had to turn the recording device off.
“Raniere had almost all of his conversations recorded, as a record of his greatness.” Diane Lipson
Smart criminals record and write down Nothing!
Wow another informative article. I am sure it will give shadowboy, niceguy, anonymaker, and Scooter Johnson boners.
“I am sure it will give shadowboy, niceguy, anonymaker, and Scooter Johnson boners.”
Speaking for myself I don’t get off on branding women like cattle.
Perhaps you do, Sultan ahmed.
The thought of your beloved Allison nekkid sent you into a spank frenzy that you probably developed priapism
If one wants to see naked women just go on Google and type in the words and you will find only two billion photos.
And all of the women are consenting.
That’s why Playboy is no longer a big deal.
And only a juvenile delinquent like Keith Raniere would get excited over those photos.
All those women in Playboy, yet none are the naked image of the object of your obsession….Allison C Mack
I am sure long before your infatuation for Mack your mother found the sticky pages of Playboy hidden in your room.