By Sherizzy
Suneel, your arguments in the post Suneel Smacks Back at Bangkok, Presses Allegations of FBI Tampering With Cami Child Porn Pics are, again, meritless.
First, you are claiming that you know more than an expert. Not buying it. Sounds like Dunning-Kruger to me, as do all your posts.
Second, the fact that the photos were accessed does not mean that they were significantly tampered with and the dates altered. It is more probable that the explanation is innocuous. As far as planting photos on Raniere’s hard drive and creating a 2005 folder, that is just ridiculous and does not deserve a reply.
Third, the reliability of the photos goes to the weight of the evidence and not admissibility. That means, the jury gets to decide whether they believe, based upon the evidence presented at trial (which includes the cross-examination of the expert), whether the photos are what the prosecution asserts them to be. Here, the jury clearly found that they were genuine.
Fourth, Raniere’s defense team was heavily influenced by his input, if not completely controlled by it.
At trial, Raniere did not dispute that they were from 2005. From what I remember, Raniere’s attorney Marc Agnifilo tried to get them thrown out because they were so old. Also, Agnifilo could have called his own experts at trial to challenge the prosecution’s expert.
I am sure if Raniere believed they were not from 2005, he would have made sure that his lawyers did this, but he did not. That is very telling.
Fifth, Closing arguments are just that, argument. They are not evidence. That means, aside from some basic rules, the prosecutor is permitted to argue what is in evidence. Raniere’s lawyers were free to do the same. Again, closing arguments are not evidence.
Lastly, the fact that the charges involving Cami were added in a superseding indictment three months before trial does not point to nefarious conduct on the part of the government or FBI. Prosecutors only charge what they believe they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt. Perhaps, they believed Cami’s testimony was needed to present their best evidence, and when that didn’t pan out, they decided the photos were sufficient. Remember, the government, in most cases, has one shot at an indictment. Waiting for Cami to cooperate was understandable and wise.
That is why you have lost nearly all credibility on FR.
***
At the sentencing hearing of Keith Alan Raniere, his attorney, Marc Agnifilo, admitted he did not dispute whether Raniere took nude pictures of Cami when she was 15.
Here is what he said:
AGNIFILO: As your Honor knows, he wasn’t charged with or convicted of having sex with Camila. He was charged and convicted of the photographs [of possessing nude photos of Camila when she was allegedly 15.] And if your Honor remembers my trial defense, I didn’t really dispute the photographs all that much.
The way I disputed them is they were never shown to anybody and the jury shouldn’t consider them as either child pornography or as a racketeering predicate because they were photographs that were taken and then for the rest of time they just stayed on a device, they never got sent anywhere, never got shown anywhere.
So, that’s how I dealt with the photographs at the trial. I didn’t say anything one way or another about them. I didn’t say at the trial anything one way or another about Camila at 15 years old.
[…] After Suneel wrote, Suneel Smacks Back at Bangkok, Presses Allegations of FBI Tampering With Cami Child Porn Pics, Sherizzy wrote a comment which I turned into a post, entitled Suneel Is Wrong, Cami, Raniere, Agnifilo; None Disputed Nudes Were of 15 Year Old […]
[…] Sherizzy wrote Suneel Is Wrong, Cami, Raniere, Agnifilo, None Disputed Nudes Were of 15 Year Old […]
Sherizzy,
Great points!!!
Will Suneel respond? I am guessing no.
Sherizzy, you certainly hammered him down.
“Suneel, if you want to make legal arguments, go to law school first.” Yes, this is really why KR did badly at trial too – he thinks he is the smartest man in the world and smarter than his lawyers. Week in week out, I have to tell my own clients that XYZ might be what they think the justice system should do or does do but the reality is ABC – eg you put your best points forward even if there are 100 others. Clients always want to put everything in including the kitchen sink and it is rarely wise. It is hard to explain that to people.
Cami was 15. Not exactly a child. I was 15 when I married my husband. In Delaware, the age of consent was 14 when we married in 1970. We had a great sex life right from the start.
I had two children by the time I was 18 and no, I am not a candidate for Jerry Springer. I come from Delaware. In our culture, a girl is a woman at puberty. You know what, by treating women this way, we act like real women. My husband was 17.
Sure, it is a little creepy that Raniere was so much older than Cami, but for most of human history, girls became marriageable at puberty. You make it out like having sex when someone is 15 is like the crime of the century. My guess is Cami enjoyed it.
Allegany Lady of Class? The moniker is debatable given the nonsense comment you make above. Did you fail to mention that you husband was also your brother?! You can return to the 1800s with your comments and mentality. Plain stupid.
It was against the law there. With cults most of their wrongs are not crimes so you have to find a crime and this was one. Also he was a lot older. It is vastly different for a 15 year old girl to have sex with her 16 ear old boyfriend than someone older than her father exploiting her.
it does not have to be the crime of the century. it just has to be a crime and I suspect there were others even younger. That 12 year old for example.
Allgeany,
Cami testified at the trial about her experiences. If you haven’t read that, you might want to. Enjoyed it is not how I would describe it. Also keep in mind that she had to keep this “relationship” a secret, her address was a secret from everyone in the community, she was put on a restrictive diet, subject to emotional abuse from Raniere, and had her immigration status used against her. She was self-harming and at times suicidal. So, not only was she a minor, she was abused and isolated and controlled. And in the state of NY, 15 is below the age of consent.
Two issues. Firstly, just because you didn’t feel like it impacted you at fifteen does not mean all girls at fifteen feel that way. A family member did something sexual to me when I was sixteen. It devastated me. Not all girls feel the way you did.
Secondly, it’s not even close to the same thing to enter a sexual relationship as a 15 and a 17 year old and as a 15 and 45 year old, say nothing of a 15 and a 45 year old where the 45 year old is the idolized leader of a philosophical movement that everyone around you believes is the next closest thing to god. To compare your life experience, where both you and your husband were still teenagers, to a scenario where a grown man with a harem of sycophants was systematically grooming a girl he first met as a middle-schooler, is absurd. It’s more than “a little creepy,” it’s child exploitation and legally rape.
In court, Cami said she did not enjoy it. Nxvim robbed her of a normal high school and university experience. Her family is upper middle class.
Without Nxivm, she likely would have a college degree and a high-paying job. Older traditions enslaved women. Their brain is not even fully developed.
I’m curious why you think a girl would enjoy being with a man who is also fuckin her sisters and isolating her from her family 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
Sure thing, NXIVM acolyte. We really believe you. We do.
Lady,
Customs change…
In Ancient Rome, a father could legally kill his son.
Lady, your marriage was 1/2 a century ago.
A 1/2 a century, before you were married, blacks couldn’t use the same bathroom as whites. In many states, interracial marriage was illegal. A 1/2 century ago people of Italian descent were actually being discriminated against for some white collar jobs.
What’s your point?
Keith never married Cami. She did not have children with Keith. Instead Cami had an abortion that Keith the father of her baby let Cami a teenager go thru alone. In a foreign country. Keith also was sexually involved with both of Cami’s sisters. And a whole pack of other women he had branded on their pussies with his initials.
Keith also had threesomes. Including attempting one with 2 sisters he made cry. He blindfolded a woman and had Camilla perform oral sex on this woman who was tied down.
Keith was cruel, manipulative and verbally abusive to Cami.
Does any of that remind you of your relationship with your husband?
The age of consent in Delaware is 16 now. It would not help Keith even today. And the good people of Delaware do not appreciate you lumping all of them in with your “culture”.
15 is exactly a child. 18 is exactly an adult. It is a matter of law, not opinion. If you disagree with it, work to change the law.
You don’t have to guess at how Camilla “enjoyed” it. She has made it very clear that she did not. Nor did she enjoy being a victim of child pornography. Which is also very clearly against the law.
I hope that you protect any female children in your care diligently. You seem very cavalier about childhood sexual abuse which can and does ruin so many lives.
Why won’t the remaining followers address the negative aspects of KR? I’m referring to his texts that revealed him wanting a DOS member to be recruited for the sole purpose of pleasing him sexually. Crime or not.. that’s messed up.
Yes, it surprises me they never comment on all the other stuff. They cherry-pick — which makes them even less likely to be believed.
“Furious judge blasts Justice Department ‘morons’ for the ‘inhuman’ conditions of federal prisons in NYC – which she says make it impossible to give a fair sentence to immates.”
https://mol.im/a/9555909
I googled around a bit about editing EXIF data because I work in IT and find that stuff interesting generally. Here’s my take on it:
EXIF data can absolutely be altered, there are tools for this on every major platform (windows, mac, iOS, Android, etc…). Some of these tools seem geared toward the owner of a photo wanting to protect their own privacy. But let’s be really clear about one thing: we’re talking about deliberate attempts to alter EXIF data, not someone doing it by accident. Suneel isn’t claiming negligence by the FBI, but rather a dedicated attempt to frame Keith. I’m not buying it, personally. If they wanted to frame him, they could have done better.
Suneel also claimed that there were extra files in the folders that show that photoshopped happened (residual files) I could not find any other source that said that happened (that they found residual photoshop files in Keith’s folder, thus suggesting that the FBI altered the pics and Keith was framed). Have you seen this?
Clarification: I do not think I was very clear regarding my weight of the evidence point.
It should have read that after the foundational requirements had been met in Raniere’s case, the credibility, not reliability, of the photos was an issue that went to the weight of the evidence.
What do cult members do when their cult implodes and their mentor, their noble leader, the man they bowed down to turns out to be a fraud, and the cult a criminal racket? Do they just walk away embarrassed and feeling like a fool? Or do they double down, deny the evidence staring them in the face, reject reality and continue to believe, concocting absurd theories to justify their beliefs?
Some will do the latter. Double down, reject the evidence, and argue absurdities. These people are usually the core, the most committed, the inner circle.
All this was demonstrated by social psychologist Leon Festinger in the 1950s in his classic work, When Prophecy Fails. It was Festinger who gave us the term “cognitive dissonance”, for what happens when our most cherished and deeply held beliefs come into collision with conflicting reality.
What happens when the alien mothership fails to appear on December 21, 1954 as confidently predicted? What to do when December 22nd dawns? Festinger describes in academic detail the behavior of a UFO cult in suburban Chicago that believed, and how the most committed of them continued to believe long after. He draws an analogy to the Millerite cult in the mid-19th century, who believed (and set a precise date for) the Second Coming of Christ and the end of the world.
For a less academic and much more entertaining account of this cult phenomenon of Deny and Double Down, here’s Bill Maher on the Millerites and Nxivm: https://youtu.be/WYbteM7KLhI
The Great Disappointment indeed.
Suneel and the Nxivm dead-enders will argue the ears off a dead dog defending Raniere and Nxivm. They devoted years of their lives, gave up careers and life savings to the man who currently languished in Federal Prison Tucson on much-deserved sex trafficking and racketeering convictions. They can’t and they won’t accept the plain and obvious truth, which is why engaging with them is pointless.
Yes, it is such a waste for them. They should leave it all behind at least in public and get on with their lives. (Although I respect their right of free speech and it is rare to get someone in a cult to talk to outsiders so a nice opportunity)
Great post.
I agree that with each post Suneel loses his credibility. If you search for his name in Google, only Frank Report appears and his medical dad in India. I doubt future clients will want to collaborate with such a person
Mexican Lady, couldn’t agree more! Don’t know who this Suneel character is; however, he appears destined to work for one of those “Scam Call Centers” in India as he has very little sense.
You know Suneel would do very well in one of those India call centers for he has a very fine voice. He is wonderfully articulate and has no trace of an Indian accent. That may be because he was born in the USA and is an American.
How about leaving the prejudicial statements about call centers out of your arguments here, folks.
Dear ‘Wok’ Anonymous,
How’s about you go back to slinging Slurpees…
I bet you rupees-to-donuts you’re Suneel or dollars-to-donuts if you’re not Suneel.
Did you mean to write “woke” and failed spellcheck? I’m not Suneel. I’m not even pro-NXIVM. I just happen to be able to make arguments without resorting to ethnic slurs.
A very senior academic having a long-term association with “Ivy League” colleges expressed his concern at rampant plagiarism throughout all these learning institutions, enabled by varied online means.
Once upon a time, the educational calibre of such graduates was outstanding. Nowadays, however, Suneel’s capacity to discern to any meaningful extent his immediate surrounding environment points out the results of the government confusing education with business!
Suneel’s intelligence and academic performance have nothing to do with his capacity to be manipulated in this context. Many highly intelligent people become ensnared by high control groups precisely because of their ability to question and have an open mind.
Can you share the names of highly intelligent people who joined cults, please?
Emiliano Salinas with his alleged Ph.D. from Harvard is not one of them. I say alleged because it would not surprise me to learn he paid someone to do his Ph.D. thesis. It’s surprising that after graduation, Emiliano does nothing remotely similar to his Ph.D. degree from an Ivy League university
Here are a few articles on the topic.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1993/05/04/the-lure-of-a-cult/64ae0a11-7b16-4e41-b8bd-084bb76c4115/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-xpm-1993-06-06-1993157053-story,amp.html
https://www.csueastbay.edu/philosophy/reflections/2010/contents/kayl-teix.html
I think he;’s fairly bright and many of this kind of cult attract those people – the orange people. Rajneesh my sibling was in for a while was similar. However, we certainly need to stop plagiarism. I have two student sons – they would never do it. They know I would rather they failed than cheated. The institutions also run software to catch people which works to an extent.