This is in response to Charles Manson’s Girl Groupies Don’t Compare with Raniere’s Nxivm Harem by Heidi Hutchinson.
Dumb article for Frank to publish.
Heidi’s not being logical here and is focusing on the minutiae to distract readers from the bigger picture of the common elements between Keith Raniere and Charles Manson, especially from a psychological perspective.
1) Manson and Raniere both recruited women followers who WORSHIPED them as a living god.
2) Manson and Raniere both recruited young followers to have sex with them.
3) Manson and Raniere both conceived of plans for shaping their own grand vision for the world, while using female followers to assist them.
4) Manson and Raniere both hated society’s rules and went about brainwashing followers to resist society, rules, government and culture norms.
5) Manson and Raniere both offered female recruits something of perceived value in order to brainwash them. You can’t recruit and brainwash somebody without offering them something of perceived value.
What they both offered was a ‘sisterhood’ of living outside of the law and outside of society’s norms.
It was “us against the world”. That’s just cult 101 shit.
Keith promising stardom to followers is no different than Manson promising his own lies about a better society if they joined him. It’s all the same thing, psychologically.
These women wanted something better/different for themselves and both Manson & Keith told them whatever they wanted to hear.
Heidi is pretty much voicing PURE NONSENSE like she always does.
They both had total control of female followers as well as cuck’d male followers too.
The biggest NXIVM news story today isn’t about who changed a date on a photo.
It’s about whether or not alleged tampering in the Raniere case was done in a purposely sloppy way to frame the FBI.
Here are two appropriate mainstream news headlines that won’t be headlines if globalist “powers-that-be” are actually eventually going to destroy our country:
Who Wants to Tarnish America’s FBI? Did Prosecutors in the NXIVM Case Save Lives?
From CieloDrive.com: “… This tape was not marked so I don’t know the names of the doctors, the interviewer or whether he is from LAPD or the District Attorney’s office. The tape was also not dated, but the conversation seems to indicate it took place in December of 1969, shortly after the indictments …”
Here’s part of the recording: “… Hypnosis itself is not a therapy. It’s merely a way of reaching somebody to influence them by means of words. And it’s the words that influence them. The – – the way a situation is structured that gets an individual to accomplish a given goal. It is not the hypnotic state itself …”
Nancy Salzman and Keith Raniere started “NXIVM”. Nancy Salzman “… has had experience with hypnosis and NLP.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Salzman
“… The lawsuit charged that the NXIVM organisation was a pyramid scheme, exploitation of its recruits and conducting illegal human experiments and making it ‘physically and psychologically difficult, and in some cases impossible, to leave the coercive community’ …”
Get this bull shit off this earth now or karma will come back to the asshole who writes this shit
Manson came up with some really interesting spiritual and ethical ideas WHiLE he was in prison though. You can look up his ATWA project. So maybe Keith will develop something even better than NXIVM in prison; he’ll certainly have enough time for research and contemplation.
Those are two terms that I don’t associate with Manson: really interesting spiritual and ethical ideas.
Seriously, if you want to learn anything about Charles Manson and his REAL (if also admittedly somewhat twisted) worldview, I would suggest you read the “Manson File” by Nicolas Schreck or “Manson in his own Words”. Don’t believe all that “Helter Skelter” trash from Bugliosi’s book. Bugliosi with his establishment views was about as biased towards Manson’s ideas as Judge Garaufis is against Keith – both only seek to demonise those that they don’t understand. Now don’t get me wrong, Manson’s crimes were terrible, but they were more an act of terrorism (meaning they wanted to convey a message) than the drug-influenced slayings Bugliosi portrays them as.
Wow your a charmer!!
No wonder you were once in nexium and find the tech so amazing.
So you think the intellectual prowess of psychopathic cult leaders, improves AFTER they’ve been banged up?
You may be right. Perhaps one day you can find out the truth of your contention, for yourself, first hand.
My thoughts exactly. If the police had picked up Manson and his followers for the petty crimes they were committing previous to the Tate/LaBianca murders, the world would never have known the lengths to which some people can be manipulated into carrying out heinous crimes. Who knows how far Raniere would have gone in manipulating his followers (male and female) if he had not been caught.
Raniere & Co. were wimps compared to Manson and his women. Raniere fought in the courts with Bronfmans’ money.
I think I’ve seen reports that assassins, were one of the “crafts” Raniere hoped to cultivate. And Dr. Roberts’ strange experiments would seem to be about the sort of desensitization that would help with such an attempt, somewhat similar to the “creepy crawly” missions that Manson used to get his followers accustomed into breaking into homes prior to the murders.
If Manson were busted a year earlier, and Raniere a year later, their examples might appear very different, relatively.
[…] Keith Raniere and Charles Manson Were Kindred Spirits […]
Both apparently borrowed from their exposure to Scientology, the gift that keeps on giving. Raniere also borrowed from his time as an Amway distributor, the largest MLM scam in the world and copied by many other MLM scams.
One significant difference: Manson’s women were loyal to him, Raniere’s women turned tail and pleaded guilty.
“I’ve had people killed because of my beliefs — or because of their beliefs.”
The people killed were the ones in Mexico who followed Raniere’s “peace plan.” The drug/people smugglers didn’t think much of that plan or the people who followed it, so they did what they normally did, they killed them.
Still carrying Marco’s bags, Dennis?
The plane to Mexico leaving again soon…
Dennis it’s not too late to come clean. It ain’t over until the fat woman sings. Sings like a canary. I thinks it’s time we meet at the usual spot. @12 8/17 blue sky
More Dennis is Bangkok suspicion by Bangkok himself…
In my opinion, this is SPOT on. Interestingly , the Manson girls thought they were helping the world with Manson’s green initiative. Murder someone, help the environment.
In my opinion, the parallels are tremendous as far as indoctrination. Obviously, Vanguard, that I know of, never engaged in the murderous barbarity.
But analogies do appear in indoctrination and certain philosophies.
We need to hear from the Vanguard girls, as the Manson girls now have extensive interviews out there. Perhaps we will get them in time.
Another similarity: Ranieri tried to influence people thru his tech and NLP—In prison Manson took a Dale Carnegie course in “how to win friends and influence people.”
There’s more than that – Manson became highly trained in Scientology techniques in prison, spending more time at them than even most of that group’s members get to nowadays, while Raniere deliberately took ideas and practices from Scientology, apparently through some people who had direct experience of it as well as reading about it. Scientology’s founder Hubbard was adept at stage hypnosis including its theoretical basis and used it in developing those Scientology techniques, while NXIVM (principally through Nancy Salzman) also incorporate techniques from Ericksonian hypnosis and its derivative NLP.
I’m pretty sure that they both used (or didn’t use) the same shampoo.
Personal hygiene wasn’t high on their list of personal priorities.
They were alike, but I think that Manson had the greater charisma.
Manson was a tough guy who’d lived a tough life. He’s stick a knife in you without a second thought.
Raniere is a pure and unadulterated coward.
Funnily enough, at the time of their arrests, Raniere his in a closet, and Manson hid in a bathroom cabinet.
So at least in that, they were alike.
From accounts of those who interacted with them, both had an unusual charisma that is not at all evident from looking at photos of them. Both were also reported by women to be (or to seem to be) particularly sensitive sexual partners. Based on what I’ve read, I find it hard to judge which might have been more or less charismatic.
Manson may have acted tough, but he almost always had others commit the actual violence, so I think it’s open to debate just how tough he really was.
Cant help but wonder if the ‘unusual charisma’ shown by these two men was actually just a willingness to go down on girls and women who maybe never experienced such a thing before.
Both these warped men elevated that act to some sort of holy ritual. Perhaps a precondition for these victims is that they be trapped developmentally at the Oral Stage? The profile, even if you don’t accept Freud, seems accurate.
That may have been part of it, though reports sound as if it was more general.
I think it comes from the psychopath’s honed, uncanny ability to read people, and then manipulate them while giving the impression that they are acting genuinely.
Anonymaker, remember: Hitler always had someone else do the dirty work, as well. Also charismatic.
Fool Me Not,
You can add Mao and Stalin to your list of evill megalomaniacs keeping their hands clean and delegating the dirty work to others.