Barbara Bouchey is coming out swinging and is set to write a series of stories for Frank Report about Nxivm and her inside knowledge of the allegedly criminal self-improvement organization that has been widely viewed as a cult.
A former Nxivm member, Bouchey is one of three people scheduled to speak at the Albany Times Union panel discussion on March 18, which, incidentally, is the same day Keith Raniere and company are due back in court in Brooklyn.
This will be Barbara’s first Albany-based public speaking engagement in 10 years.
Last September, Barbara appeared on Megyn Kelly to discuss Raniere.
She will be introducing her series of articles on Frank Report to help clarify the record, as she sees it, and educate readers on her role and views of Nxivm and Keith Raniere.
Up to this point, many people see the “arc” of the NXIVM “take down” story as:
Toni Natalie is the true heroine having endured 20 years of Keith’s legal attacks and stalking. Because of her bravery in fighting Keith, and her constant, almost guerrilla warfare tactics, she played a significant role in building the foundation that Raniere is a louse and a criminal that all subsequent critics and the media built upon.
She was the pioneer in the fight and kept the fight alive to expose Keith when no one dared to say a word about him. She has been aided and abetted for years by her friend, Joe O’Hara.
In 2017, Frank Parlato’s Frank Report blog broke the branding story that was key in the exposure of Nxivm and break-up of the cult.
Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente are heroes for having led the revolution that got 100s out of NXIVM.
Catherine Oxenberg’s love of her daughter, India, combined with her celebrity, helped get the publicity necessary to get the Brooklyn DOJ investigation opened – starting with the NY Times story, Inside a Secretive Group Where Women Are Branded.
This concerted effort of the above-named people, as the narrative goes, resulted in Keith et al. being arrested. And some have said Barbara Bouchey is nowhere in that story.
Others argue that Barbara is indeed one of the true fighters and heroes who helped bring Keith down and deserves to be credited alongside Natalie, O’Hara, Parlato, Edmondson, Vicente, and Oxenberg.
This is part of the reason why it will be most informative to hear straight from Barbara what her role was during and after her days in Nxivm.
As far as helping to take Raniere down, here are some examples of what she did:
She left boldly and decisively in 2009, bringing eight other major Nxivm women with her. Barbara did not leave quietly but purposefully and demanded restitution from Raniere. She boldly left because of his philandering and unethical behavior and said so – to his face.
She and Susan Dones were responsible for the film where Raniere says he had people killed for his beliefs.
She had a major role in closing down two centers and as many as 100 others exited because of her.
After she left, she endured a half dozen Nxivm/Bronfman lawsuits and a complaint filed against her with her Certified Financial Planners Ethics Board, which was subsequently dropped.
Barbara was dragged into four other lawsuits as a hostile witness, was falsely arrested on computer trespass charges and had her passport taken from her for more than a year. The charges were later dropped when Clare Bronfman was caught lying to authorities.
As far as Barb knows, there were at least five attempts by Bronfman/Nxivm with various law enforcement agencies to have her arrested for extortion, and there are Mexican extortion charges potentially still pending.
Instead of settling the lawsuits and being quiet, she continued to expose the dark side of Raniere. Her court filings contained revelations of NXIVM’s inner world that the media reported. She also repeatedly shared her experiences in direct interviews with the media, most notably with James Odato of the Albany Times Union.
Barbara also made repeated attempts to work with law enforcement, having numerous meetings, and spending her own money to fly back to Albany to meet with several government agencies – including the FBI, NYS Attorney General’s Office, US Attorney General’s Office, Customs, Immigration, IRS and NYS Taxation Dept. Somehow, possibly due to the suspiciously protective of NXIVM nature of Albany law enforcement, she was not immediately successful.
In addition, in June 2010, Joe O’Hara, Barb and their attorneys met the Albany Asst DA to open a RICO case.
Joe then used the same information to try to persuade the NYS AG, writing repeatedly to the NYS AG Office to try to get them interested in stopping Raniere and company before they did something drastic.
Joe and Barb literally laid out much of the same RICO case the DOJ is presently prosecuting Nxivm leaders for, but at the Albany level, it went nowhere.
Too bad. How many women would not have escaped being blackmailed, branded, sex trafficked and other horrors had authorities in Albany been willing to listen to much of the same evidence that the DOJ in Brooklyn is now using to prosecute Raniere.
In February 2011, Barb went to the NYS AG Office. This time they actually opened an investigation. She brought in other witnesses – Susan Dones, Joe O’Hara, Toni Natalie, but, unsurprisingly, again it went nowhere.
In August 2015, Barb got in again to see the AG and after some 12 hours of giving them loads of information about Raniere’s massive crimes, they again decided not to pursue him.
Barb said they told her they had, “bigger fish to fry.”
In October 2017, after the NY Times wrote its now-famous DOS story, Barb tried again.
Barb’s NYC attorney, Pamela Hayes, using some of her law enforcement connections, wrote to Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s special counsel, resulting in a lengthy dialog about how DOS only scratched the surface of Raniere’s crimes and that NXIVM was a RICO organization.
The special counsel referred Pam Hayes to Brooklyn Federal Prosecutor Moira Penza and their conversations may have been the impetus, or at least helped to fuel the fire, for DOJ prosecutors to go full steam ahead and stop Raniere.
Barb also had a hand in bringing in one of the first and most important DOS victim/witnesses to the DOJ through an attorney she persuaded the victim to retain.
Now, the time has come for Barbara to write about her experiences in Nxivm and clarify the record on Frank Report, leading up to her appearance at the TU panel event March 18.
Frank Report is expecting several posts from her, which I am sure readers will enjoy and find informative.
In the past, when I wrote about Barbara, or when she wrote something here, there seems to have been a cadre of anonymous “Barbara haters” who posted negative comments about her.
For these new Barbara’s posts, Frank Report will make a departure from its normal commenting policy to ward off a potential smear campaign.
Our usual policy is to screen comments and allow any that are not too insulting or off-topic to appear. Normally, we allow anonymous commenters to say things that are pretty unruly – and as Scott Johnson points out – it’s easy to be brave when you’re anonymous.
For Barb’s new posts, I am going to ask for civility from anonymous commenters. Especially if anyone plans to make blatant, unprovable attacks on her.
If anyone truly wants to make serious allegations against her character, or conduct, then I am going to request they use their real names and be prepared to prove it, or debate it with Barb, who stands ready to answer questions and defend herself from attacks from those who at least have the courage to do so in their own names.
You can still disagree with the content or the premises Barb makes, anonymously, if you wish – but you must do it respectfully.
As for blatant insults, slurs, innuendos, or downright allegations of wrongdoing, or disputing her veracity, anonymity won’t do. Back it up with facts and your name, please.
I look forward to Barbara’s posts beginning later today.
Does anyone find it interesting that Ms. Bouchey is not answering any of the hard questions? Her response is either no response or I’m too busy today.
She is responding well only to the flattering comments or your tone is rough and I won’t answer your question with such a tone young man/lady. Red flag anyone?
Bravery is facing all sides of a conflict. It’s not just showing up after most of the battle has been fought by others and overlooking the carnage of a war well fought in your Joan of Arc Ebay outfit saying “See what I have done for my people “.
Where are the readers answers Ms Bouchey?
Jim Smith (Scott Johnson),
Why not let Barbara tell her story first before you make your judgement ?
Geewhiz Scott, I wonder why Barbara did not want to go on your radio program? 🙂
That was not my post, but I agree with Jim. Barb could have ignored the minor insults (and some of them weren’t even insults) thrown her way and answered the meat of the questions. I have some bombshell information from a discussion I had with Barb about a year ago. I choose to keep it private for now, but she better start answering the questions or shut up altogether.
It may be your opinion that I should “ignore” what you deem “minor insults. However, in my opinion this is untrue when many are not minor, very insulting, and at times slanderous. Let’s review some of the more illuminating ones? It has been suggested that I committed tax fraud, tax evasion, lack being astute and having prowess as a Financial Adviser, lying, avoiding hard questions, knowing corrupt things but doing nothing about it, harming hundreds of people, not taking responsibility, and most assumed as a Financial Adviser that I directed and supervised NXIVM’s financial matters participating in their corruption – which can only mean that I am corrupt, too.
I am unsure what “bombshell” info you have, but feel free to state it as accurately as possible and I will certainly address it. I have always been consistent in what I say because I am candid, forthcoming, and speak the truth as I recall it both good and bad.
And, I don’t know what your view is on saying “shut up altogether” but in my view that is very rude. But, maybe we have different views on these type of things?
I have spent probably 20 hours so far responding to comments with as many details, explanations, facts and my views this week. It has been a busy and challenging week for me with my already planned meetings, then add in the explosive news about Keith and Nancy making my life like Grand Central Station. And yet, I managed to find the time to respond. Yes, there are some left to respond to, but I cannot create time out of the air, and have gone to great lengths to respond timely, even apologizing when I could not. And, who by the way, would subject themselves to this time of scrutiny, doubt, suspicion, and in effect, be “on trial” to the general public in this way – who in large part does NOT know me, nor my story, nor many of the facts?
One more thing, do you consider what it is like for me this week to be responding to all of this? Do you realize the PSTD I have already endured for ten years since quitting, and the trauma during 9 years as Keith’s girlfriend – and – volunteering at this point in my life to more trauma because with each response written I am reliving this trauma again, and again. And, does it make sense that I am getting more traumatized by the often harsh accusations, presumption of guilt, not taking me at my word and constantly doubting while I need to “prove” myself, or cruel comments made?
I am not aware of any other NXIVM ex-member who has been so viciously attacked as I have been. I am also not aware of any other ex-member who volunteered to go on this blog in an open forum to be questioned and essentially grilled. Did any of the key people open themselves up to this type of thing? Did Toni Natalie? How about Susan Dones? Or, Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente? Do you think they ever will? It may be after reading this post they might not think it was wise?
I have found your comments to be some of the more harsh ones on this post, and they are not minor. But, then again, maybe the readers might want to weigh in on that to give better perspective? I am open to that feedback, are you?
In closing, I do wish that you could be less accusatory and instead be curious in your comments and questions. Perhaps, you might kindly consider that?
You do not need to defend yourself against a vile low life like Scott Johnson.
Scott is not deserving of your time or respect. Scott claims to be trying to help educate people about Amway, but at the same time has never shown an ounce of empathy for anyone.
Barbara your time and energy is best spent elsewhere and not conversing with the very ignorant Scott( Bangkok) Johnson.
Thank you for defending me in this. As I begin to share my story, I would be deeply appreciative of readers giving me a chance, keeping an open mind that what they have heard and or read about me is not the full story nor an accurate portrayal. It would be nice for readers to reconsider and evaluate making judgments after they gather more information about me.
Some reasons I did not want to go on Scot’s radio program was due to his often harsh, prejudicial, judgmental commentary – along with his show focusing on MLMs, which I do not see as the best venue to discuss the topic of NXIVM.
Thanks again, niceguy.
Why do you assume everyone is Scott? Actually, how do we know that you’re not Scott? Or Bangkok? Or even crazy Ben Szemkus?
It’s pointless to keep guessing, but Frank does have the ability to check posters’ IP’s, so he might be able to give you some answers.
Frank doesn’t care, he prefers the chaos.
I spent the entire day and evening Monday answering dozens of comments, many which were hard, requiring lengthy responses so as to give full details. At midnight, I stopped commenting, but mindfully responded to those unanswered that I would respond later. Reason being is I left town 6am Tues. morn for meetings lasting two days. Therefore, it is not accurate to say I avoided hard questions nor made no response. To the best of my ability, I responded to all comments whether they be flattering, accusatory, insulting or other. In only a handful of comments did I mention they were being unkind (which they were) and respectfully requested a more civil way of asking questions. In fact, many thanked me for the my detailed answers, and acknowledged some people were rude.
Is there a Red Flag? I don’t think so. But, I welcome the readers to weigh in on your commentary.
Yes, bravery is facing all sides of a conflict and not just showing up after most of the battle has been fought by others and overlooking the carnage of a war well fought. However, I have a question for you.
Why is it you chose to OMIT the countless efforts made by me, nor MENTION any facts about how I have fought ten years against Keith’s retaliatory, wrongful legal attack dragged into 13 lawsuits; whereby, my voluminous court filings containing revelations exposing much of NXIVM’s inner world and corruption often quoted in media stories, or my being falsely arrested, needing to defend against many govt agencies Keith attempted to have me arrested, my nonstop efforts with 8 govt agencies to start an investigation to stop Keith INCLUDING my NYC attorney successfully initiating the current Brooklyn investigation then my bringing in a key DOS women as a witness, and the severe price I paid in doing so – all helping to build a case having Keith, Nancy, Lauren, Clare, Alison and Kathy arrested, and my ten years speaking constantly to media providing critical information for their stories??
Perhaps, you would like to comment for the readers about why you chose to OMIT all of that, and instead, accuse me of “Joan of Arc Ebay outfit saying “See what I have done for my people “?
Jim, the answer may be that Barb is not permitted to answer questions on certain topics due to the criminal investigation and upcoming trial. So questions that are avoided may indicate that.
Just a guess…
Anyone involved in the current investigation has been asked to not post in the Frank Report. I know this as a fact as I have several friends who are involved in the investigation and are going to be called as witnesses.
If Barbara Bouchey was one of these people she wouldn’t be sharing her story at this time.
So why do you think she didn’t answer some of the questions, including my own question? And I didn’t even ask her a really tough question, such as which girl-guide cookie is the most delicious.
(I wouldn’t be able to answer that one myself.)
I would agree with you, and presently I am not a witness, although in the beginning I was suppose to be.
By way of history, in Oct. 2017 right after Sarah Edmondson was featured in the NY Times, my NYC attorney used her connections used her connections writing Gov. Cumo’s special counsel resulting in her lengthy dialog that DOS only scratched the surface, and NXIVM was a RICO corrupt organization needing to be stopped before something more drastic occurred. The special counsel then referred Pam to Brooklyn Prosecutor Moira Penza – and the investigation got launched – .with her informed I would receive a subpoena. Prior to this, I had numerous dialogs with Attorney Neil Glazer who was inspired by cult expert, Steve Hassan, for a year to study NXIVM believing it could be a landmark case to enact laws about cult abuses. Neil had spoken to most key ex-members, except Sarah Edmondson. He asked if I would speak to her hoping to represent her. I then persuaded Sarah to consider retaining him as counsel, which she did shortly thereafter. Then, Pam and I called Neil informing him so that he could bring Sarah into the investigation, which thankfully, resulted in the arrests of Keith, Nancy, Clare, Lauren, Alison and Kathy were arrested. Fortunately, it appears that the more current ex-members and witnesses was all they needed, and I currently am not being called as a witness.
Barb, then you need to explain why you won’t answer my question from March 12, 2019 at 4:26 am.
Please scroll through my comments of late for I believe your questions have been answered. You can refer to the one I just made under Scott Thompson which should be approved soon. Furthermore, there are still a handful I have yet to get to, so please kindly allow me some time to get to them. My intention has and is to answer all questions or comments. Have I not proven so far to dedicate a lot of time to do this so far?
Just wanted to clarify my previous comment for other silent readers here.
(This comment is not meant for Barbara Bouchey) 🙂
For those who don’t know, the IRS does have rules for making LARGE loans to anybody. This includes LARGE loans made to family members, friends or business clients.
Many people think that giving or loaning money to their kids, parents or friends has no tax rules, but that’s only true if the amount of the loan or gift is below the ‘annual gift exclusion’ amount (which in 2018 was $15,000).
*Not to be confused with the ‘lifetime’ gift exemption of $11 Million dollars.
Basically, the $15k “annual exclusion” means that any gifts which you GIVE above that amount (to any single person) must be ‘reported’ to the IRS each year on a special tax form called a “gift tax return” — which allows the IRS to keep a running tally of the gifts given over your lifetime (which impacts your estate asset transfers when you die, so that less of those assets can be inherited tax-free by your heirs).
*You won’t actually have to PAY taxes on those gifts of course — since the $11 Million Dollar ‘lifetime exemption’ shields you from actually paying taxes on those gifts. However, you must still REPORT those gifts (above $15k) on a gift tax return each year.
Fun fact: The $11 Million Dollar lifetime exemption was only $1 Million just a decade ago, and could easily go down to $1 Million again if the democrats get control of congress and the presidency. 🙂
Getting back to the subject again…
If you make any LOANS above $15k then the IRS will want to know whether it’s REALLY a loan or a gift in disguise, regardless of what you ‘claim’ it is.
To find out whether it’s REALLY a gift or a loan, they apply certain ‘guidelines’ which are common for real loans.
1) Is interest being charged?
2) Are the repayment terms agreed to in writing and signed by both parties?
3) Are periodic loan payments being made ever?
4) If the debtor can’t make their periodic payments due to hardships, has the lender officially sent out ‘notices’ for every loan default and at least attempted to recover that money?
These aren’t specific rules from a checklist. They’re just examples of “general guidelines” that the IRS will use to determine if it’s REALLY a loan in their eyes, during an audit.
That’s why larger loans require certain loan rules to be respected, else the IRS can reclassify those loans as either unreported gifts (from the lender) or unreported income (to the recipient), depending on the particular facts of each case.
That’s why for larger loans you cannot make them “interest-free” and “informal” with no repayment terms officially written down or agreed to in writing.
This is true because ‘informal’ large loans can be a source of tax evasion, money laundering or illegal financial transfers from illegal activities.
That’s why the IRS would ‘laugh’ if you attempted to claim that you loaned $1 million to somebody informally with no signed contract and no deposits into a bank account bearing their own Social Security Number.
I think the subject of Barbara Bouchey has officially, proudly and deservingly topped the comment record here on FR at 110 and counting! AND Barbara has yet — if ever — to discuss anything close to any salicious personal details of any sort concerning her former clients or lover(s).
Barbara’s a legit, class act. (Until she says something good about KAR or Nancy’s “well-intended” work being preservable as a helpful tool toward human growth —then she knows I’m out — but she, of course, still has her right to “her” beliefs that way, if so.
Niceguy’s right. Most if not all NX survivors do have PTSD, speaking for myself anyway. 🙂. It does effect interpersonal relationships and NX tries to strain those. Even on here: Alleged Anon’s, Bangkok’s, Burke’s try to pit survivors against each other — declaring me & Frank vs. IDK what they are even talking about — like there’s supposedly some in-fighting teams squared off. NOT. Too huevenille.
I’m just a grouchy old man but even the younger me bowed out of anything spiritual or enlightening before I graduated high school. (I almost married a hippie flower child, !) I never put others down for it. Different approaches for different people. So I can understand what Barbara is saying. I wouldn’t give Keith credit though. Most of what is taught by gurus can be done / concluded by a person themselves given time, experience and thoughtfulness
I commented once before about the over use of words like joy and ethics and disintegrations. Those videos of Allison are just sad, pathetic and frustrating
Bangkok is not your enemy. 🙂
It’s just that you seem to lob verbal grenades at everybody with very little provocation, just like candy being handed out on Halloween.
Then you act surprised that so many people aren’t nice to you.
If a person is making comments about the price of tea in China (i.e. comments unrelated to you) but you decide to lob a verbal grenade at him while trying to use a machete to cut his balls off, it kinda guarantees that they’re not gonna be very nice to you in return, LOL.
I think you’re probably not even aware of your TRULY abrasive personality.
BTW: I really hope that you’re not gonna be called as a witness to help the prosecution’s case, because the defense team would have a FIELD DAY by pointing out your wacky posts on FrankReport (about Dennis Burke being various people) which would destroy your credibility and make the prosecution look insane.
What you have yet to learn is that people who criticize you are mostly guided by your abrasive personality rather than by a ‘NXIVM conspiracy’.
Truth is, your past history with NXIVM is from so long ago that you’re a ‘dinosaur’ to Keith and Clare now.
You’re akin to that Japanese soldier from WWII who was discovered in the 1970’s (on an island) who didn’t yet realize that the war was over, LOL
Keith and Clare are focused on their upcoming trial. They’re just not focused on the Jurassic period of NXIVM’s past, back when Heidi Hutchinson was relevant (eons ago).
Thank for some of your nice comments. Regarding my being a “legit, class act” which appears conditional as long as I NEVER say something good about KAR or Nancy’s “well-intended” work, you have your right to your opinion. The only difference between us is this:
Opinion Definition is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge”
Yes, you have a right to your “opinion.” However, when it comes to possessing fact and knowledge FIRST HAND regarding the inner world of NXIVM, the 1000 two-hour modules, EMs, being a coach, part of the inner circle within NXIVM, belonging to the community, being friends with Nancy Salzman 30 years, and a girlfriend of Keith Raniere 9 years – YOU do not possess personal, first-hand facts or knowledge as to the best of my recollection during my 9 years there – I never saw or met you, there were no classes taken by you, and you did not belong within the community, etc.
Therefore, at best, your “opinion” is just a view and judgment as you see it – and not based on fact or knowledge.
My “opinion” on the other hand, is based on fact and knowledge because I was – in fact – there.
And with all due respect, I will “accept” your opinion as one that you seemingly are wed to, and hope that you will accept mine as well without the commentary claiming some unkind things about me gotten from third-parties, and or, what you have read. Let’s also mention that “some” of those third-parties are known to propagate false things about me.
One more thing, the readers should know that you and I spent time together in Malibu last summer, and had a long talk. Since that time, in my “opinion” you have taken what I said and on this blog not stated it accurately, enhanced it with things you assume, and have made some false accusations against me such as: Barbara admitted on Megyn Kelly that she was instrumental in NXIVM’s infrastructure, and suggesting that I somehow participated in a corrupt operation. When, what I stated to you, and meant on Megyn’s show is that: I helped put in infrastructure in an organizational sense with setting up committee meetings, follow through, a more professional way to do things, etc. You also claim that I would like to be in charge or own the NXIVM curriculum and launch my next career with it. When, that is not what I said at all. I will remind you of what I told you: That someday it would be nice if a group of personal growth experts and psychologists could take the curriculum and go through it with a fine tooth comb to remove the garbage and maintain some of the good parts. There are other examples I could give of our talk that was not accurately depicted by you, but I don’t have time right now and it is does not really merit going into.
In closing, I continue to welcome yours, and others, comments and questions while doing my best to answer them.
I don’t think trying to find a few flecks of gold in a turd is a good idea. Better to start with another source(s), or from scratch.
Thanks so much for your time and personal insights. Respectfully, I think it’s time we addressed the elephant in the room. Don’t you?
What is your favorite Girl Scout cookie:
Peanut Butter Patties?
Dear Girl Scout,
You are most welcome! Yes, how about that elephant – My fav is the thin chocolate mint cookies!
I’m sure you saw the news that Nancy Salzman plead guilty today? It’s a game changer.
Have a great night!
I hope you are aware that on social internet/media networks generally an individual will always receive more negative feedback than positive unless the individual is a celebrity. I believe the vast majority people when they read or hear your story will come to the same conclusion I did that your a good person that fell for n love with the wrong man; and that you have suffered more than you deserve.
Ps for the record thin mints do rule!
Keith “cry baby jane” has herpes on his limp penis. All you dumb ass people gave your money for infinite wisdom. You are all like so super smart
Barbara, I truly admire your rags to riches story and how you became a successful Financial Advisor. As a fellow Financial Advisor, I know just how difficult it can be and would love some pointers someday since I live in the area where you had your business. How did you allow KR to invest in the Commodities Market, all “eggs in one basket” mindset? How did you choose to remain with KR when you discovered that he had a harem and that you were one of many? What was your mindset? You also made some, even though very little commissions with NXIVM, did you report on your U4 that you were working with them? Just curious. Also, you mentioned in one of your comments that you lived in one state, had your car registered in another and had your income deposited in the account of another, isn’t that illegal? I do wish you well and hopefully you can move forward from this nightmare.
Busy day today but will try to respond late tonight.
PS: Nancy Salzman just plead guilty and appears in court tomorrow! It’s a game changer.
Thank you Barbara! Looking forward to your response. Hopefully Nancy sings like a canary!
She has to either sing or not get much out of the plea deal. Which would you do?
Thought I would be able to respond to you tonight, but I can barely keep my eyes open! So more tomorrow :0
I understand. Get some rest.
I have finally found some time to respond to your comments and questions – again – sorry for the delay.
Thank you for admiring my rags to riches story and becoming a successful Financial Advisor. Perhaps, someday we might meet and I’m happy to share pointers.
As for allowing KR to invest in the Commodities Market, all “eggs in one basket” mindset. I have a post ready for Frank to put up that will take the readers through every step of the way regarding my commodity account since there is so much interest in it – and – so much false information regarding it. In short, I did not ever have an “eggs in one basket mindset.” On the contrary, I only committed and invested $25,000 being told that was my only investment and could only lose that much. At the time my net worth was $5.0 million, and this $25,000 represented less than 5% of my net worth. Certainly, not an investment with “eggs in one basket.” So, be on the watch out for that posting soon as it will most likely address this further, and any others questions you might have.
As for why did I choose to remain with KR when you discovered that he had a harem (I didn’t think of it as a harem nor did I know about all the women), but after a year of dating him became aware of three other women. Two who were described as students of a guru who only had sex with him a couple times a year (that kundalini thing), and one was told was a lesbian. I would kindly ask you to read my new post that went up today explaining why, what, when and how I decided to remain involved with Keith when I “did” discover these few other women.
As for my little commissions NXIVM and did I report them on my U4. Yes, I did. NXIVM was an executive coaching program wherein I was a coach, and reporting said commissions was not anything unusual for me to report – nor any kind of no-no to be doing as it did not conflict with any regulations.
Yes, I did mention that my car is registered in a state of which I do not live in. After learning of the kidnap plot to throw me in a dark prison in Mexico, having proof that NXIVM was following me, hacking into my accounts, having private investigators harass me, and being viciously sued, arrested, and attempts to have me arrested for extortion – all of which was malicious, wrong and downright unethical – I was advised by counsel that my “safety” and “whereabouts” was more important than the state I registered my car in. And, if questioned about it, could have my attorney defend me appropriately as to the valid reasons I was frightened for my life at times. IN the grand scheme of things, having a car erroneously registered is not a big deal.
Yes, I did mention my income was deposited in the account of another. NO IT WAS NOT ILLEGAL. Reason being is it was a legitimate paycheck issued from my corporation with a W2 at the end of the year so that I could appropriately declare and pay the taxes. This paycheck was then deposited into a “joint” account with a friend in a non-interest-bearing checking account. I then used a debit card to pay for my everyday expenses, and kept meticulous documentation, bank statements, and deposits to record all of it.
I hope that answers your questions? And, consulted with my CPA and Attorney regarding all of it to be sure I did it a proper way.
I am curious though – why would you only ask questions that seemingly casts doubt upon my integrity or intent, or point out things that might be illegal, or foolish that I did – especially if you admire me? It makes me wonder if you “thought” I was doing something illegal and ask to cast suspicion upon me? I also am curious why you did appear to have any understanding nor empathy why I would feel the need to protect myself from Keith who was terrorizing, stalking, meant to do me serious harm, and wrongfully sued/arrested me for many years.
In closing, thank you for wishing me well and hoping I can move forward from this nightmare. I believe the worst is over, at least as it concerns Keith and his group from further harming me. As for the ten year long backlash, and false portrayals of me – well, that does not appear to be over and continuing. However, I hope that will change in time, too.
Thanks for answering everyone’s questions so thoroughly and intelligently.
The only question I have is during your time at NXIVM did you notice that Keith had any strong political affiliations or motivations? The only reason I ask is because recently it seems this blog has concentrated on politics and has made a point of repeatedly featuring stories about political figures that have some NXIVM connections.
As for Vaed’s question, do you think anyone who joined NXIVM would have actually told people that they had “joined some kinda cult?” Did anyone realize it WAS a cult at the time they joined?
Busy day today but will try to respond late tonight. Thank for your comments.
PS: Nancy Salzman just plead guilty and appears in court tomorrow! It’s a game changer.
She innocently said that to her father . No one thought anything of it till 7 years later when it was discovered she was friends with NXVIM members in Facebook. They just want to know where she is. Odd you seems so dismissive of the idea that someone could go missing due to the affiliation with NXVIM and sad u dismissed the entire “do you know her” question. And honestly yes, after all the reports of what happened at those meetings , the rules, the sex, the teachings .. I would guess lots of people would realize it’s a cult.
To Vaed -save yourself some energy. Please ignore Flowers. She doesn’t play well with others but will insert herself into any and all conversations at the sniff of a conspiracy theory. She has no NXIVM connection.
I believe someone will reconginze Faith’s name if she had anything to do with NXIVM. Great idea to post here and I hope you receive some sort of clue.
Vaed, I’m not sure if I understand your comment. How was I dismissive of the idea of her going missing because of a cult? I never said that.
What I said is that people don’t knowingly join a cult. People who became NXIVM members thought they were joining a self-help group, not a cult. Does Faith’s family think she became involved in NXIVM and then later realized it was a cult and tried to get away?
I apologize. I mistook what i read. My bad.
Nutjob- you’re the one who inserted yourself into the conversation (which wasn’t about you) I was answering Vaed’s post.
I thought I might get to respond to your questions tonight as I had intended, but I can’t keep my eyes open as it’s 1:00 AM, but I will responded tomorrow.
I finally have some time to respond, and again, sorry for the delay.
Did I notice any political affiliations or motivations? Yes, I did. I first noticed it when Keith and Nancy hired a consultant, Joe O’Hara (an author and commentary on this blog), who from what I understood had a degree in law and was a political lobbyist of some sort in around 2004. The reason for this was a year earlier, Rick Ross, a cult deprogrammer had placed on his website some pages out of a NXIVM student workbook, had a couple of psychiatrists give their views that NXIVM had characteristics of a cult. NXIVM then launched a lawsuit against him for copyright, trademark, slander, defamation and financial damages from what I recall. And so, they hired Joe to connect them with political, prominent law firms and PR firms in order to defend against the negative, controversial media that began. Joe consulted with them about two years from what I recall, and did connect them with some very powerful entities – some that stayed with them a long time, maybe even still today.
Along the way, to continue to minimize image controversy, they also got connected with NYS Senator Bruno, political expert Roger Stone, and President Clinton adviser, Richard Mays. Towards the end they also hired NYS Senator DiFonzo. I recall that Senator Bruno flew on the Bronfman’s plane to a few events. – one I think was to Donald Trump’s home in West Palm Beach. Also, around 2007? they donated to Hillary Clinton’s campaign ( and encouraged members to donate the limit of $2500 as well), and I believe Nancy Salzman and Sara Bronfman attended a dinner with other people at Hillary’s home in Connecticut.
The interest was to do damage control then, and any anticipated in the future, along with having allies in the legal court against Rick Ross. The Judge in that NJ case was someone who went to college (buddies) with the lawyer of one of their top NJ firms.
Outside of that, I am not aware of other things from my recollection. I have read on this blog the tales of a far more connected political relationship and agenda, but from what I know and having been there – it’s a lot of hot air. Just drives traffic to the blog from what I can tell.
As for did anyone who was a member of NXIVM tell others they were in a cult, or realize we were in a cult? Absolutely not. Never did I ever think I was in a cult, even when the media controversary began claiming as such, and observers as well. I, for one, am not the “type” to join a cult, along with the rest of us. General misconception is those who join a cult are not successful, stupid, just looking for someone to follow, have low self-esteem, a void in their life, are in a tragic state being vulnerable, and just plain idiotic. Well, I, for one did not fall into any of those categories. In fact, I was like the poster child as an example of someone that would “never” join or belong in a cult. WE all just found claims we were in a cult to be ridiculous.
When did I discover I was in a cult? One month AFTER I quit. I recall the day when one of the NXIVM 9 sent me an email with a link and description of a “megalomanic” and realized – “OMG, that fits Keith to a tee!” That is when I began to realize that I had been in a cult, and then did further research. Also, then contacted cult experts on the topic. What I will say is this, now that I am far more educated on the topic, that the majority of the 17,000 that came through the doors including: thought leaders, CEO of Fortune 500, Nobel Prize Winners, a former Surgeon General, CEO of Enron, celebrities and just plain everyday people is that THEY did not join a cult, nor would they think they did. Where is had cult-like characteristics was in the smaller, close-knit group of coaches and those committed. That is where the abuse existed in large part. In addition, a lot of cults are religious based, churches, communes or living in an area just with themselves, or selling some kind of Amway product. NXIVM offered executive coaching programs to a pretty affluent clientele and the topic of God, religion, church were not part of the curriculum when thousands of people came in to do a 5 or 16 day training. And so, it doesn’t fit into the typical commune group of people, but it does fit in the many categories of undue influence, coercion, manipulation, lack of transparency, and of course, the leader using means to sexually abuse some of its members.
Barb – Thank you for all of the insite that you’ve already provided. It doesn’t make much sense to me that you and Toni don’t have a very good relationship. Why do you think that is?
Yes, it would seem that we should have a supportive relationship, however, we do not. There was a time a couple months after I quit NXIVM when I first talked to Toni, and we became very close for about a year. On and off over the years we have talked and met. But, there are various reasons why that relationship has some tension and broke down which I will shed further insight later as my time is short right now.
Thank you for asking.
Dear Barbara, I would like you to answer a couple of questions if it does not bother you.
1-one of the stories that have been said in this blog and other media about allison mack comes from a friend of his who was a roommate in Vancouver the story says “Barbara bouchey tube much to do with the spell on allison, during three years I had to hear about how wonderful Barbara Bouchey was and how she wanted to be a tough business woman like Barbara ”
So I ask you how was your relationship with her in those first years, was she your client? You witnessed the bombing of love in his first encounter with Nancy’s gang.
2-What did you think about the group of actresses who were recruited to be NXIVM’s image.
I’m sorry to not have responded yet, but it has been a busy few days. It’s after 1:00 AM and I’m going to sleep after posting many comments tonight. I will respond tomorrow though.
Hey Barb.. I been trying to contact you online. Do you know if this person was ever a member? https://frankreport.com/2019/03/02/missing-woman-faith-prescott-disappeared-from-clifton-park-7-years-ago-was-facebook-friends-with-nxians/
I fear she joined and the worst happened to her. She’s from Clifton park and i guess i’m now hearing one of the last things she said to her dad was “i joined some kinda cult..” read the article atleast and see if she rings a bell, please 🙂
Barb left NXIVM several years before your friend disappeared.
I do not recognize this person’s name and am sorry that I cannot offer any insight. Hopefully, she is alright and it was not NXIVM she joined.
Posted Faith’s info on my FB Page, Vaed, FYI. Anything else you want to add like other new places or faces she started hanging with? Anything, just post here and I’ll add, keep you updated. Did she ever get to Woodstock Monastary? Go to any of the Ashrams? KAR sent the girls there for years for Harem training, etc. That’d be a big clue.
I’ll find out thank you.
Vaed, are there any old newspaper articles on her disappearance? Maybe if you can find those, Frank could publish them?
Barg, about how many hours have you spent with the FBI/DOJ since Raniere was arrested?
Given the nature of any investigations, I am advised it is best to not speak of the details as the case in still ongoing. After the trial is over and everything is resolved will be the time to discuss any specifics of this.
Please explain that answer with respect to Jim Smith’s March 14, 2019 at 7:21 pm comment, above.
The kindest regards,
Okay Frank, I’ll honor your wishes and limit my comments to respectfully worded criticisms which are factual.
As much as I want to believe Barbara’s story, I find some parts of her NXIVM story unbelievable.
For instance, Barbara claims to have ‘loaned’ around $2 million dollars (of her personal savings) to Keith in order to help him fund a commodity investment idea.
However, this ‘loan’ transaction sounds implausible and resembles more of a ‘gift’ for several reasons:
1) Barbara supposedly made this multi-million dollar loan ‘verbally’ to Keith, which just isn’t logical regardless of her personal affection for him (boyfriends/girlfriends are not excluded from IRS loan rules and a certified financial planner would have known that making a multi-million dollar loan would need documentation for IRS purposes — in order to prove it wasn’t “new taxable income” when Keith repaid that money back to her in the future).
*Or… If she was trying to hide Keith’s ownership of that ‘loan’ money (by not transferring it to Keith’s own trading account) then that’s just not a legal loan. That would be very nefarious financial activity IF it happened like that (I’m not saying it happened like that).
She didn’t even get Keith to write his ‘initials’ on a kitchen napkin to confirm what the repayment terms and time frame would be. Legally speaking, that’s just not a real loan and Barbara would have known that (as a financial planner).
2) If it was a real ‘loan’ then IRS rules would have required her to charge interest using a legit ‘market rate’ (which she didn’t charge). Also, IRS rules would have required her to receive periodic payments of interest and/or principal from Keith, as outlined in the LOAN agreement which Barbara ‘claims’ Keith agreed to. She apparently did NONE of these things which tells me it was most likely a gift from a woman who loved her Vanguard more than anything (rather than a ‘loan’ from a professional financial planner who truly intended it as a loan from the start).
3) The fact that Barbara immediately asked for ALL of this money back the MOMENT she decided to break up with Keith (for cheating on her) paints a picture of an angry girlfriend asking for a gift back when the relationship went south.
If it was a real ‘loan’ then she wouldn’t have WAITED until breaking up with him before demanding that he pay any of that money back. Otherwise, this ‘loan’ could have continued for 50 years if they never broke up (i.e. it’s clear she would have never asked for that money back had Barbara not caught Keith cheating on her). That’s not a loan, it’s a gift.
*If I’m mistaken about any of those details, feel free to correct me since I only know what Frank wrote in previous articles. This is just my opinion based upon the details that I’ve read from Frank’s articles.
I am considering addressing your comments to clarify things for you, but before deciding, I have some observations:
~I am surprised Frank allowed your comments as your “real name” is required if mean, insulting or defamatory, which in my opinion yours is. This suggests to me that you and Frank may know each other and he granted you this liberty?
~You say wanting to believe me, but this seems unbelievable. It appears you are more intent on disbelieving
~Yes, your comments are “criticisms” and furthermore, they are done in an insulting, demeaning and even defamatory way.
In my opinion, you are more intent on:
~making it seem as if I’m lying
~making it appear that I might not have properly reported or recorded my commodity account implying tax fraud
~demeaning by saying I “loved my Vanguard” when in this context he was my boyfriend, not a Vanguard, making it also disrespectful
~Many of your statements are not “facts” but rather assumptions, which are false
~Clearly, you did not research nor read everything – or – perhaps you are just saying that to hide who you really are or may have an agenda to discredit me?
Because I asked for the commodity loss money Keith owed many times over the years. Plus, I’ve maintained learning of three women in the early years (maybe said in this post too?)
~Insulting stating I’d only ask to be paid back because Keith was “cheating on me” and “angry the relationship went south” (which is false) versus Keith lost my life savings and I have a good reason to want and ask for it back.
~You lack empathy for the fact that I grew up poor, put myself through college, worked hard, managed to save that $1.7 million Keith lost – and – you lack sympathy for the fact that Keith was a con-artist who lost my life savings never paying me back stringing me along – and – when I quit asking again (in writing) he knowingly lied claiming extortion trying to have me arrested. Where is your ridicule towards Keith?
~Yes, you are “mistaken” and made lots of assumptions (not facts) if you think everything on this blog is true or accurate, which it is not
~Yes, this is your “opinion” and a rather jaded one in “my opinion” – not to mention – disheartening since you don’t allow for any benefit of doubt, nor are you curious, or just simply directly ask me questions versus harsh criticisms designed to make me look bad
~Okay, I don’t agree you honoured Frank wishes, and more importantly, you didn’t honour mine
And so, Bangkok, since you seem to want the true facts, would it not be better for us, and our readers, to have a genuine true exchange by starting with your real name?
And, I am curious about a couple things:
~Why the need for a commentary that is jaded and intent on proving me discreditable?
~If we don’t know each other with your having some personal issue, then why so much pessimism and negativity towards me?
I look forward to possibly addressing things further and would actually like to provide clarification. But, let’s see how you think about what I shared. Maybe the readers can weigh in as well?
I second that Bangkok – why not let us know your real name?
Thank you Frank for supporting me in this dialog with Bangkok.
The person posting most currently as “Bangkok” has regularly attacked other posters without reason. He claims to have no NXIVM connections, yet fails to explain his interest in this forum (an interest which seems too obsessive to be explained away as idle curiousity.)
As for Scott’s comment that Bangkok’s remarks to you were not rude, I would have to disagree. Bangkok’s method of questioning is to attack with unfounded accusations and assumptions – he does not act in good faith. As is usual for him (or perhaps “her”).
Clearly Scott is Bangkok. It all makes sense now. Frank slipped and posted Bangkok’s (Scott’s comments)comments by accident.
Let’s see if this comment gets posted. LOL
There were plenty of valid questions in Bangkok’s post, regarding the loan terms, etc. Quit dodging the salient questions and misusing the “rude” criteria. Bangkok was more than fair, especially if you consider his previous comments.
Let’s assume the questions are valid. Of all people, why does Scott “Tex” Johnson have a problem with Bancock being asked to provide some context of where he/she is coming from?
Since day 1 of her arrival, Bangcock asks very pointed and aggressive questions – yet has refused to give anyone a hint of her background or currentground with NXIVM. Who is you, Bangocky? Or at the least what rock did you crawl out from under?
Bangkok crawled out from under Scooter’s nuts. Bangkok IS SCHLOCK — aka Scott Tex Johnson — on a 2nd or 3rd device — making comments so assinine even Schlock won’t take cred but agrees with everything Bangschlock says nonetheless. (It gets really spooky when they rarely don’t agree — a rare and intense form of insanity.)
Nutjob, where did I state I had a problem with Bangkok being asked to provide some context of where he/she is coming from? I didn’t. However, like many other people who comment here, Bangkok would likely make up an identity, so it’s a waste of time and effort.
I agree. Bangkok and Scott have almost identical personalities.
After Frank posted Bangkok’s rude comments, and then Barbara very intelligently came to the conclusion that Frank knows Bangkok, I realized Scott is Bangkok. I wrongly had started thinking Bangkok was a high school kid.
I guess this means Scott has a crush on you and that is why he always craves even negative attention from you, just like his alias Bangkok. They both try to drag you into confrontations to converse with you. Now that is creepy.
I can appreciate your view, and I hope you can appreciate mine as well.
I personally found Bangkok’s comments (and some in the past) to come from a pessimistic, doubting and accusatory fashion. Believe it or not, I really want to address his comments, and firmly believe he won’t be so harsh after realizing just how many “mistakes” he has assumed and made. But I first would like Bangkok to be more civil, curious, and answer questions too. I am not dodging his comments and very feel confident the readers will enjoy my clarifications.
Perhaps, we should take a poll from the readers and get their take on whether Bangkok is being harsh, accusatory and discrediting me through his criticism facts? I’m open to feedback, are you?
And, this is the type of thing that I believe is harmful and a way to cast doubt anonymously on myself – and others. It also causes people to be afraid to comment or use their name. I think we can all agree that most times someone defends me they are viciously attacked. It is my wish to see anyone attack another on this blog. Is it not possible to simply remain curious, open minded, and ask questions without coming from a negative, critical, skeptical place?
Scott, I think you are doing that too right now by suggesting I’m “dodging” by claiming Bangkok is rude?
If I’m willing to put my name behind my facts – then why should not Bangkok? After all, revealing their name does not subject “them” to harm on asking questions about my commodity account – does it?
In closing, I may respond to Bangkok even if they do not reveal their name, but will do so after they respond to why the degree of negativity towards me. Does that not seem fair? And I have not shied away from any other question thus far, and have given well rounded answers with facts as I know them. In fact, I have a post ready to go specifically about my commodity account with supporting documentation.
I surmise given the thorough reading and research Bangkok states doing regarding my commodity account, and the degree of thought in their comments that they very much want some answers from me. Therefore, I am hoping it is worth being civil with me in order to receive them.
So, Bangkok, the ball is in your court. I hope and look forward to a toss back.
Barb, you need to shorten your responses. You don’t deserve the time it takes to read your mini-novels. The more I read your comments, the more it reminds me of Raniere word salad.
Scott you joined Amway to get rich. Barbara fell in love with the wrong man and stayed in NXIVM because she thought she was helping people. Barbara was already rich.
Scott you are f*cking tool who cares for no one but yourself. No one is fooled by you pretending to help educate the public about Amway. Scott you have never expressed empathy in any of your posts for anyone.
Frank pleas for the love of God muzzle that sewer rat.
Most people want to get rich. I would have been satisfied with a nice supplement to my income, but instead I (and 10s of millions of others) got scammed by Amway and other MLM scams.
Barb did FAR more than fall in love with the wrong man. Remember, I talked with Barb a couple of times. I know more about her motivations than you do.
Why would I spend the time and effort that I do warning others about Amway and other MLM scams if all I cared about was myself? That describes YOU and the others commenting her, not me.
Do you want to be hand-held like a little child? It’s not going to come from me, I assume others are adults and make them look like children when they react as you do.
Frank pleas [sic] for the love of God post every comment to further expose this sewer rat.
Are you Bangkok?
Sorry for the delay in responding as it’s been a very busy week.
Yes, what I would agree with is the notion that most people “would” like to get or be rich. Who would not? Given my 34 career as a Financial Adviser I help counsel and advice clients how to become more financially secure. If someone became rich, then I say “congratulations” but if they only want to be rich so as to use that money to have power over people causing harm – well that is not good. If one was rich does it not provide more comfort, security and peace of mind in raising a family, pursuing dreams, goals and use some money to help others? Well, I certainly think so.
I am sorry to hear that you and others got scammed by Amway and other MLM scams.
Yes, I did FAR more than fall in love with the wrong man. And I will expand upon that in this comment.
As for your talking to me twice: I find it puzzling, and even incredulous, that you could claim from that “knowing more about my motivations than niceguy.” We’ve never met, you don’t know my background, history, or side of things during my time before and after NXIVM -nor during our talks. How can anyone truly “know” a person and or their motivations with two calls? Because your comments and questions are filled with doubt and false accusations – it proves that you clearly do NOT know me – nor – my motivation. But, you want to infer you do and suggest it is not good.
You ask, “Why would I spend time warning others about MLM scams if all I cared about was myself?” In my opinion, if you warn others then you do care. Why is it when it’s a provable fact I warned others (i.e. two centers closed and 100 left from my warnings when resigning) you do not give me credit? Not only did I warn ten years never stopping, but I went far beyond warning (see other posts) at great risk, loss, cost and harm to myself with the mafia-like tactics of Keith.
Scott, after all you have read, how is it possible to state that “all I care about is myself?”
As for saying niceguy “only cares for himself” – I cannot speak to that as I do not know niceguy. However, what I do know is niceguy has been “nice” to me and defended me against things “not nice” coming from you.
And, I concur with your asking “Frank pleas [sic] for the love of God post every comment to further expose” but with the distinction of what defines a “sewer rat” which I have not observed in this post niceguy to do, but have observed others possibly fall into this category.
I thought Frank put you on a leash ?
It’s a long leash.
Scott you are Bangkok!!! LOL
Barbara, I would think you have read the comments here on Frank report in the past. If you are just starting to read the comments, you will quickly learn which comments are a waste of time and simply skip over them.
The majority of the commenters here had nothing to do with NXVIM, and know absolutely nothing other then what they have read and believe to be true based on there own interpretation.
As opposed to those who were in NXIVM and claim they didn’t know what was going on, like Barb.
Scott- this thing wouldn’t have lasted for 20 yrs if everyone was in on every secret. It was a need to know basis. Everyone was tested using baby steps in order to find out who could be trusted/given more leash. It was a self improvement company on the outside. In order to be a self improvement company, the vast vast vast majority of the people working for the company were doing self improvementy shit. There were no weekend seminars to tell 16 thousand minions to dodge taxes and ask for volunteers to be money mules.
That’s why it was such a big deal when Kristen Keefe vanished. That’s why Nancy chirping is huge. That’s why Karen U being mia is interesting. They are some of the few who know a lot.
The 9 confronted Keith over stuff like him sleeping around. If they knew what you seem to think they did, would they really have cared so much about him dipping his disease ridden bump into the peanut gallery?
It seems to me that no matter what I say, that it will never be enough, nor do you appear to be intent on believing anything I say. Therefore, at some point I may not respond to your comments anymore as it doesn’t seem to make any difference. I am guilty before proven innocent in your eyes. And, you do not know me, nor were you ever a part of NXIVM, and to be frank about it, you don’t know the “reality” of what people did know or not. It is unfortunate that you continue to dismiss, deny, refute what I say – and insult me. But, that is your choice, and I will accept that reality.
My Dearest Barbara,
My comment wasn’t directed at you, it was directed to the above alcoholic. They were essentially claiming I didn’t know what I was talking about, but the reason I’m here is because when I tripped over Frank’s website about a year ago, it appeared Raniere took his script right out of the Amway scam playbook, which I am extremely familiar with. I then confirmed he started his MLM scam career with Amway. You need to read the story of why I’m here: https://frankreport.com/2018/07/29/scott-johnson-explains-why-im-here/ I may not be familiar with specific details that only a person who had direct contact with NXIVM would have, but that doesn’t mean I don’t understand how NXIVM worked in the broader sense. NXIVM is small potatoes compared to Amway and other MLM scams. I never said I didn’t believe you, but I also don’t accept your statements without question, either. If that damages your tender ego, then ignore me, I love to get in the last word. I contacted you because I thought you may have been f*cking Keith when he was in Amway and wanted to get some insight from you. I told you on the phone that it was “weird” that he was having multiple sexual partners and you didn’t have a problem with that. At all. You claimed a lot of cultures around the world support multiple sex partners/wives, and I found that even weirder. We live in the USA, and that is not normal. You shouldn’t be surprised when that type of activity is connected to everything else Raniere & Co. are accused of doing.
Most highly and kindestly regards,
Dear Gin an Juice,
I apologize for the delayed response. As I have mentioned to some others, it has been a jammed pack few days. However, I intend on answering every person who comments as best that I can, although it may take awhile. And, it takes me awhile to write the responses has it seems necessary to add in backstory and details to address the comments, questions, and accusations.
Yes, I do read all the comments here on FrankReport, as well as, I did when Saratoga in Decline by John Tighe was around. There are reasons for that.
First, back in early 2010 is when Tighe started writing a lot about NXIVM, and in Feb. 2010 was when the first lawsuit was filed against me by the Bronfmans in California falsely accusing me as their Financial Adviser of “revealing their private, confidential financial information in order to embarrass them so as to seek revenge against my ex-boyfriend” which is against my code of ethics – and would have my license removed if proven true. What predicated this was three weeks earlier the Albany Times Union ran it’s first real headlines breaking story wherein they quoted from a public deposition I had given.
The Bronfmans two years earlier had sued their California real estate developer, Yuri Plyam, and one month after I quit NXIVM they subpoenaed me for a deposition and documents. During the day long deposition, the Bronfman’s attorney threatened, falsely accused me of all sorts of salacious things. When under oath, I am required to speak the truth of what I know and had to answer many questions about the Bronfmans financials. This is NOT a violation against my code of ethics. The Plyams later that year replaced their attorney with a renowed cult attorney, Ford Greene, and he filed on behalf of the Plyams a counterclaim against Keith Raniere and Nancy Salzman including many exhibits. One which was 16 pages of my deposition, which was totally legal for them to do – and none of it was filed under seal. Which means that anyone could have access to those public court documents, which reporter Odato did. In Odato’s article, he quoted verbatim from this public court document. Three weeks later the Bronfmans launched their lawsuit claiming falsely that I had “given an interview revealing their financials” and hence; the lawsuit was birthed.
Shortly after that, Tighe was putting up a lot of info on NXIVM, and some of it regarding the Bronfmans that other people provided, some of it gained through confidential meetings (yes, I do know who you are). What started happening is I got accused nonstop of being the “source” and Bronfmans claimed I was in breach and should be held in contempt of court. It was a frigging nightmare. And so, I needed to read, download, and preserve every single post and comment so that I might know what next they would accuse me of, and be prepared. Over the following years and 13 lawsuits they dragged me into this false narrative continued. They expanded their false narrative falsely claiming I was conspiring and colluding with all their adversaries in all their lawsuits, their attorneys, and the media while illegally providing confidential information to destroy them. IT WAS A LIVING HELL TO DEFEND MYSELF. That habit never stopped, which is why I read everything. Plus, the blogs have been informative at times and that was critical to me in my defense as well. So to some reading the blogs might be a waste of time as it is riddled with inaccuracies and also salacious accusations against me – BUT for me it was a way to survive and defend myself.
Yes, I do agree the majority of the comments here had nothing to do with NXVIM, know absolutely nothing believing everything that is written here – including the enormous amount of false crap about me. These blogs have been one of the most difficult things I have had to deal with, and the many harsh, cruel, false accusations, and people that seemingly just hate me, which has caused me great pain. There are no words to describe what is has been like for ten years to be portrayed so negatively by the general public who knows nothing about my story in large part. And, no matter how much one tells themselves to pay ignore it – this is not so easy to do.
Thankfully, due to a circle of loving, supportive friends who DO KNOW the whole story, and KNOW ME WELL, I have been able to remain strong and weather through it. Although I will say there has been many a dark, lonely, scary night when I wondered if I could make it through another day. I only hope that speaking more that people will begin to realize things are not what they appear, facts inconsistent,and re-evaluate what they think. Once I give birth to my story, then I will feel that I have done everything in my power to educate and foster a better understanding, compassion, empathy and forgiveness for all parties involved. Then, it will be done, and I will feel free to move on – and let it just be.
Given the overall story of Barbara and Nxvim; Why are you so hung up on such a trivial piece of the story? Given the overall arc of events that have occurred you are focusing in on minutia.
Bangkok is either around the age of high school student or Scott Johnson.
The grammar and writing styles are different but they share almost the exact same perspective of life and lack of understanding of even the most basic human emotions and behavior.
I am quite sure that Bangkok opened a fictitious Twitter account and has been trying to promote the fact that it is Sultan of Six’s account. He is a kid trying to play mind games and troll.
I know I’m not posting as Bangkok and I think he’s older than high school age, there’s too much legal knowledge in his comments. But you are consistent…consistently wrong. LOL
That’s great to have you aboard, Barbara, to help steer some of these hooligans straight. Jk. Seriously, we don’t always agree but you know I hold you in the highest esteem!
Thank you for saying so, and I hope to help straighten out the hooligans, too.
Barbara, I’m interested in what you thought when you first heard Keith was the “man with the highest IQ in the world” Judo champ at 12yo, and ran the fastest 10 yard dash, spoke full sentences at 1 etc.. and where you placed that in ranking your opinion of him. Truthfully when I first heard these things I thought what a load of crap and who cares if you won the 10 yard dash. It reeks of a preteen boast. I assume you are a very critical thinker being a successful financial planner dealing in facts. What gives?
Thank you for your interest in what I thought.
When I first became involved it was back in March 2000. I had known the President, Nancy Salzman, for 12 years who was a well-respected therapist in my area. I admired and respected her tremendously. She knew of my so called rags to riches story having come from humble beginnings and was self-made. Six months prior to taking my first workshop, she began trying to convince me to take some of their classes. However, at the time my husband and I had been in marriage counseling for two years, and I had no interest. My best childhood friend had committed suicide, and then I had asked for a divorce, and that is when she finally convinced me that the workshop saying it would help me in that transition and grief.
For six months leading up to my first workshop, she told me all about Keith, including his Guinness World Record High IQ, his tremendous success with Consumers Buyline, etc., but it didn’t matter to me, cause I still wasn’t going to take the workshop. Although I had no reason to doubt her. Shortly after my first workshop, Keith showed me his copy of the Guiness Book (he had 10 copies). I also met his father, Jim who told me of Keith’s athelitic abilities as Judo, how they had him test when age 7 discovering his intellect, and how they could not keep up with education to meet his mind. And so, there were no red flags going off thinking these things were an exaggeration.
What did impress me though was when I took my workshop (22 days long). It was truly profound and life changing. The topics explored, awareness gained, and the material content in my opinion was truly extraordinary. I had been around the block over the years taking personal growth programs, coached by some of the financial industry top people, even Tony Robbins. In comparison, this was like a master’s degree vs the others as grade school. My critical thinking was applied into evaluating the program, results, philosophy, coaches, and overall outcome of my own personal development.
It was true that many promoted Keith’s accolades, but from my perspective, the true mustard was taking the workshop and results achieved personally. During my time there, 10,000 people came through the doors. Since I oversaw the Field Trainers and Sales & Marketing, I knew if someone wanted to leave the workshop. Very rarely did anybody want to leave a five day intensive.
Thanks for answering. It helps to better understand how you first got involved with these vile human beings and how anyone can get swept in. I’m curious to know if you’re worried about damaging the prosecution’s case by speaking out now. I think it’s safe to assume you’re a witness.
Busy day today but will try to respond late tonight. Thank for your comments.
PS: Nancy Salzman just plead guilty and appears in court tomorrow! It’s a game changer.
You are most welcome! And, sorry for the delayed response. I had a busy schedule last few days, and add in the current notable events.
My first attorney was the renowned attorney, Gloria Allred back in 2009. Her partner of 35 years, Nathan Goldberg. Our first meeting lasted 10 hours, and that was BEFORE the first lawsuit was launched, and before I and many others even had a clue about Keith’s corruption and ways. But, I recall what Nathan said to me after the 10 hours which was, “Barbara, you are a smart, savvy, sophisticated lady, and no man’s fool. Keith by all means should NOT have been able to lure you in, but he did. He demonstrates just how much he was a master at manipulation and cont-artist. And, it means that if he could get you, he can get just about anyone!”
In short, it is true. Most like to believe only stupid, foolish, idiotic, low self-esteem, voids in their life, and blind followers ONLY get involved in a cult. However, studies show that this is not true. In fact, most people who joined NXIVM were the opposite, and joined because they wanted to make positive changes in their life, and make a difference in the world by helping others. Because there were so many good people there and good things, it makes it even more difficult discern where and what the bad is. And yes, I agree with Nathan Goldberg that many good, smart, successful, caring people CAN be swept in.
No, I am not worried about damaging the prosecution’s case by speaking out. I could write a book about the wrongful manipulation, coercion, peer pressure, undue influence, using your weaknesses against you, and plain old fashion shame, guilt tactics used by Keith and his inner circle. Just ask, and I will tell you. I don’t believe I have said anything thus far that would be some reason at this point for Keith to get off the hook. I have been told, and heard, that most think WE should never speak of any of the good at NXIVM, because then Keith can get off the hook. I beg to differ. I believe until the WHOLE story both good and bad is told that the general public may never be truly educated about groups like this, and how precisely they use the good to take advantage of innocent people. And, it is my goal to share it, explain it, and try to fully inform people so that they do not fall prey to groups like this.
As for being a witness, I’d rather not say right now.
I met Jim (Keith’s dad) and Sydney his wife a recruiter in NYC. Jim told me ”my son is crazy.”
Nancy’s parents were also In attendance that evening. I remember seeing the humiliation in their faces as Keith chose to discuss his views on sex in detail and talked about sexual organs being no different than an elbow or a knee.
It was obvious that his intent was to embarrass and humiliate their parents.
Keith is a cruel person devoid of feelings, a sociopath.
Barb, I think the problem many have toward you is that after all your “suffering” at the hand of Keith, you still believe in Nxium and the plagiarized modules he and Nancy passed off as propriety information.
The sooner you come to terms with the reality that ESP/NXIUM is a complete scam, the sooner you will heal and move on from this pack of criminals.
Find yourself a good therapist and enjoy the rest of your life.
It has been a very busy few days for me, especially with the current riveting events. I apologize for my delayed response. I was able to get to a few more tonight, more tomorrow. As you may notice, my responses are not just one liners, or quick this is the way it is. I try to mindfully explain as best I can to give a better understanding. Unfortunately, when people comment or ask questions, they are wide sweeping generalized, versus being specific, requiring me to explain more. So it takes me a while to respond fully.
I met Keith’s dad, Jim, and stepmother Sydney many times along with socializing with them. I don’t recall his Dad saying Keith was crazy though. Yes, they did attend many trainngs in the early years, and from my experience of being there, they enjoyed them and got a lot of benefit. Keith also in the early years would come in once or twice during a 16 day training. The way it went is people would ask Keith questions, and he would answer them. I do recall at times his being asked about sex, and it’s quite possible you were in a training where that occurred. I don’t recall that time you are speaking of, but do recall his asking people at what point on the skin is it intimate, sexual, considered inappropriate or other. It is a fair statement to say that Keith had liberal views on the topic, and clearly we now know he is a sexual predator, an abuser of women, and a pedophile. So, as we look back on things he may have said in a forum, there were subtleties of this. For the most part, his sexual views were expressed more within his inner circle of people.
As for wanting to humiliate his parents, I did not witness him do that either during a training, or in social settings. However, I did become aware years later that he and his Dad disagreed on things. Not a surprise, huh? They may have had tension or words between them, but I was not present to hear them. I further recall Keith having Nancy work with his Dad regarding his so called “ethical breach” and from then on Jim was not around much. I strongly suspect it was a load of crap, just like the alleged “ethical breach” I had with Keith cause I would confront him, hold him accountable, and broke up with him a year before I quit. Yup, when Keith didn’t get his way suddenly you had an ethical breach, which was just plain BS.
Yes, Keith can be a cruel person, and in my opinion, got crueler as the years went by – most especially – after I quit as an enormous amount of cruelty was directed at me. I would agree that Keith is either a sociopath or even a psychopath. I met and have had many a dialog with one of the world’s foremost leading expert on the topic over the years, who is a neurologist and scientist. He helped me understand these types of people better. In fact, he met Keith in the early years when I was around as they wanted to enroll him in a training, and could share his views. What I understood from what he told me is that a sociopath is not devoid of all feelings, what they are missing is the gene for empathy. That means that they don’t feel regret, remorse for what they’ve done because they can’t “try you on” and “empathize” with you. However, they do have feelings of joy, sadness, love, and grief like everyone else. Sociopaths do know the difference between right and wrong having a moral compass, however, they are insensitive to those they hurt lacking empathy to get what they want, and are able to justify it. Generally, they are narcissistic.
If Keith is a psychopath, then that is a different story. They, too, lack the gene for empathy. But, the big distinction is they do not have a moral compass. They suffer from delusions of grandeur, megalomaniac tendencies, and think “they” know better than others feeling a superiority. They think “their” moral compass is the right which is how they can justify just about any cruel, evil act.
Which one is Keith? We are not sure. I did observe Keith be very kind, compassionate, caring, joyous, sad, fearful, help others, coach people in music, singing, sports, how to overcome things or be inspired. It’s why I was involved with him and NXIVM. To suggest that Keith was always cruel, bad, devoid of feelings, and did no good – is to suggest that those of us who stayed within NXIVM for years, and were around him, were okay with that. Or, you might be inferring we were bad, cruel and didn’t care? Or, we observed him always being cruel and turned a blind eye?
What I can say is that I am not a bad person, nor observed the majority of members to be bad either. That does not mean I didn’t observe any bad things, for I did. But, not to the point for years that would cause me to leave. Eventually, when I figured out how cleverly Keith manipulated, lied, deceived, concealed and other things – I resigned.
Yes, many say the problem with me is that I am one of the only people willing to say there was any good at NXIVM, or that I witnessed Keith or Nancy do any good. Yes, I suffered in many ways when involved with NXIVM, and being his girlfriend. Yes, I suffered even more in the nine years following at the hands of Keith as he terrorized me, and tried to destroy my life. But, that does not mean that during my nine years at NXIVM there was no good. It begs the simple answer why did I stay, and hundreds of others? Were we all bad, doing bad things, and being bad to everyone? What the “real problem” in my opinion is most people don’t like to distinguish between what was good, and what was bad. If they dare speak of any good they then get ridiculed, insulted, accused, and land-basted pretty much. The general public is far more sympathetic if you just say you were brainwashed, didn’t know what you were doing or involved in, made a grave mistake, and woke up finally leaving. That is a far easier road to journey. Well, I have never been one to take the easy road or way out, but rather, not shy away from things and speak the truth as I know it, and accept the consequences thereof.
For example, if you are married for ten years, have a husband who is a good dad, responsible, great job, caretaker, fun times, but he drinks every few months then beats the crap out of you – do you divorce him? You begin weighing the pros of the majority of the marriage is good, with the con of that occasional night he beat you up. Soon, that smaller percentage of bad is not worth staying for the majority of the good. So, you get a divorce. In fact, during my first marriage, I experienced something like that, and I divorced him. However, if someone were to ask me about my ex-husband, no matter how much I suffered on those nights he beat me, I can still say what was good, what I liked or loved about him, along with what was bad. I do recognize a lot of people don’t do that though. Typically, many people when they get divorced just say their ex was a scumbag. Well, that is not my way of speaking.
As I saw it, the majority of the people at NXIVM were good people, who did the majority of the work, coaching, teaching which was good, did good within the community, and interfaced with those coming through the doors, who also seemed like good people. The majority of members were unaware of Keith’s inner circle world for they were not there, nor in it. Most didn’t even live in Albany.
A metaphor that I like to use is this, Most of US were the good people, who did most of the work and we did a lot of good. WE were the unknowing “sheep’s clothing” that Keith the “wolf” used to hide behind. WE the good people were unaware we were being used, or the corrupt things behind the scenes that Keith and his inner circle were doing. But, some of us ten years ago saw enough glimmers of the wolf to confront him. That’s when WE the NXIVM 9 saw more of the wolf – and immediately resigned.
As for plagiarized modules that you believe Keith and Nancy did. Were you there to know that? Did you take the 1000 two-hour classes? Well, I was there, and I did take those classes many times. And, I was around to observe Keith and Nancy develop a lot of the curriculum. So, in my opinion, it was not all stolen from Scientology. Yes, there are common elements or themes that similar, but it’s very different. What I think is Keith and Nancy created material that unique in its own way and had some positive benefits. The bad part is they then used those same tools to wrongfully manipulate, coerce, pressure and abuse people.
Yes, I agree that there were many elements of NXIVM that was bad, corrupt, and a scam – but – I do not agree that it was all bad, corrupt and WE the people scamming others. What I can say is that I left ten years ago knowing only a smidgen of what is known today, or how much worse it got after leaving.
As for therapy, I’m sure you can imagine that the PSTD someone like me experienced from the Wolf Keith terrorizing me for ten years was like – and so – and I have sought trauma therapy over the years.
And yes, I do plan on enjoying the rest of your life, which will be much easier now that Keith is in jail.
Well said, Barbara. I agree that there was a lot of good in the teachings. For those saying the curriculum was all plagiarized, do you think they would plagiarize good material or bad material?
Still, the most valuable things I took from the courses where the ones teaching about Keith himself. Keith was good about helping us recognize parasites, shifters etc. He’d then act out the role in front of our noses.
There is no 10 yard dash. 100.
Guess what Tex…when I was 10y.o
there certainly was a 10yard dash and Im in Keiths age group. So piss off.
Please be careful, Barbara. My gut feeling is even if they are convicted, and imprisoned, they will not stop.
I wish you all good luck.
I appreciate your concerns. No one knows better than I about Keith’s mafia-like ways and ability to terrorize and stalk his detractors.
Three years ago, I hired a consultant to help me become not so easily found. Reason being is I had for 7 years been stalked, followed, private investigators harassing me and those I knew, people pretending to be clients calling FINRA saying I stole their money, they hacked into my banking/emails/phone records to trace me, and even learned they were plotting to kidnap me to throw me in a dark prison in Mexico never to be seen again. And so, I now live in a location across the country where my address is not listed anywhere, my car is licensed in a state and my driver’s license in another state while I don’t live in either, my utilities and such are in others name, my phone in a friend’s name, and my paycheck gets deposited into a friend’s account where I use a debit so they can’t see where I am. It’s not foolproof, but better than living under the nose.
I, too, worry that if Keith et al are not convicted that based on their history of retaliation that I will be on the short list to harass. But, this has been going on for ten years now, and it NEVER stopped me from fighting and trying to stop them. I have had to learn to live under these types of circumstances, and to keep my attitude positive and spirits bright. I’ve become someone who is very “present” in my life taking in all around me and enjoying what I can. Today, I wake up grateful to not fear looking at my emails for another 400 pg bombshell filing by them accusing me of salacious things; or when my phone rings wondering what court crisis occurred, or constantly looking over my shoulder worried.
Today, I wake up, make my eggs, sip my tea, watch the birdies, and have deep gratitude for my life, and all I have learned. And, experience the most enormous relief knowing he is in jail, and am very happy that those of us who fought hard to stop him finally won – even if for a little while. People around me not knowing my story ask if I am in love saying I look ten years younger. I tell them, “No, I am not in love, but my ex-boyfriend who stalked me for ten years is in jail, and that would take ten years off anyone’s life!” And so, although I do sleep more soundly at night, I am not totally safe until the outcome of the trial is known. I will cross that bridge when it happens, and evaluate what is best to protect myself should they not be convicted. Thank you for asking and I hope this answers your questions.
I’m sure you probably have some level of Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder PTSD. Seriously.
I do not see how Frank, Toni, Heidi,Sarah Edmonson or yourself could not have some level of PTSD.
I cannot fathom being attacked my an entire cult headed by a mad man. How could anyone not have PTSD on some level.
Yes, I have had an enormous level of PSTD, and still do. If there was just one event trauma, then you have PSTD from that and eventually it subsides. However, from April 2009 until 2017, there were new events causing trauma sometimes daily and weekly with each one building on the previous one, and re-triggering everything. It was a nonstop daily battle in court with NXIVM and the Bronfmans. Yes, there were periods here and there where there was less filings and crisis going on – but – not long enough to have it subside. And, it was never completely over. And so, it’s an accumulation of unspeakable mafia-like tactics that Keith incorporated to constantly cause one to be threatened, harassed, sued, arrested, followed, hacked into, propaganda, private investigators, and so on. The velocity of constantly needing to protect, defend and manage it all has been unbelievable. A few years ago after learning of the kidnap plot to toss me in a dark prison somewhere, I thought “holy cow” Keith is out of control and anything could happen. That’s when I was advised to conceal where I lived and to be extra cautious where I went. Imagine living under those type of circumstances for years? Well, I assure you it has not been fun. Anyways, thank you for saying this is hard on people like me – as well as – many of us who left NXIVM or Keith. I appreciate reading your comments and any supportive, encouraging words you offer. It is a really “nice” thing from the guy.
If Barb pushed back while they were not in jail or arrested and indicted, what makes you think she should be more scared now? All you’re doing is fueling the fear train. Stop it. NOW.
G & Frank
As long as Barbara does not go to Mexico she will be fine.
PS Frank if you ever go to Mexico after all of this you have fucking rocks in your head. No offense. Not even Baja Mexico despite the nice resorts. Seriously.
Frank you have insulted one of Mexico’s most prominent and powerful families. Salinas a former Mexican President had a place of honor at George Bushes’s funeral. Salinas sat next to Angela Merkel and one other world leader. Frank you pissed off the Amigo.
I’m hoping now the Frank report can get back to how it was when I first discovered it a year ago. Frank, I don’t think the majority of readers would mind if you censored all nasty,rude and hateful comments whether they are directed to Barbara or not. If people can’t engage in a civilized conversation and respect different opinions then they don’t deserve to be part of the Frank report. This report has provided so much critical information that it is widely read from people from all different social, economical and educational backgrounds. Let’s all elevate this report to where it rightly belongs. I look forward to hearing from Barbara and the spirited healthy debates that follow.
You need to get a grip. NXIVM is nasty and some of the discussions are also rightly nasty. All your “nicey-nice” encouragement does is cover up the truth, just as Raniere was able to cover up the truth about NXIVM for many years. Stop it. NOW.
Before people write a critique maybe they should read the above article that Frank wrote.
There are no victims in Nxium!
You either knew and chose to stay 9 years or you must be dumb as rocks.
Or maybe the money was too good!
Please kindly go back to your troll cave whence you came.
@Niceguy I can see why you have taken up this name :-)) “kindly go back to your troll cave… “
Thank you for your comments, although I will say they are harsh. Frank was very mindful by telling me he would not post comments that had cruel commentary, and reviewed your comment with me thinking it fell into that category. However, I told him to post it anyways, and that I would like to respond.
Let’s start with the easiest comments:
Was I in it for the money? Absolutely not. I addressed this in detail on this post to Anonymous at 9:14 PM if you could kindly read that. In summary, I was grossing $1.0 million in my own business, and could have grossed $2.0 annually within 5 years had I devoted my time to building it versus building NXIVM. The majority of the jobs I performed at NXIVM – I was NOT paid for. Yes, I earned some commissions, but it was a pittance compared to what I earned in my own company. The percentage of NXIVM earnings over my years there was an average of less than 10% of what I was earning in my company.
Am I “dumb as rocks?” No, I am not. I find myself to be an intelligent, astute, perceptive, mindful, honest, straightforward and gracious person. My career as a Financial Planner spanning over 34 years demonstrates my capabilities in being a successful business person, and my clients (and those who know me well) find me to be trustworthy, responsible, reliable and integrous. With that being said, I am human, make bad decisions and mistakes, have had many failures and try to do my best to learn from them. No matter how smart someone is, we all can fall prey to those around us who are not honest, and take advantage of us. I, too, have had many experiences of that. And, if along the way I have harmed someone, I try to make amends.
“There are no victims in NXIVM” you state. Well, I guess that depends on how you define a victim? If someone knowingly lies, deceives, cons, coerces, withholds critical information from you to influence your decision-making, steals money from you all of which then causes you harm, loss or pain – has that person been victimized? Perhaps, you think not, but I do. If by leaving NXIVM, Keith then subjects you to a malicious, legal attack when you are innocent lasting for years because of his power, influence and ability to wrongfully use the court system and authorities as a weapon to threaten, harass, stalk, abuse and cause you unspeakable pain and losses – has that person been victimized? Perhaps, you think not, but I do.
It may be that we have different views of what a victim is. I will respectfully accept yours, and hope that you might do the same with me.
Should you want to comment further, that is welcomed. However, if your comments are insulting, then Frank may not post it, and I might not respond. I kindly request of you to do so in a more respectful way. In this world there are two ways to ask a question or convey your thoughts. One, to say it in a mean, punishing way. Or, two, to say it in a nice way. I have found that it is much better to be nice. Kindness and graciousness are good traits, and I hope that both of us can try to do that as best we can.
There were TONS of victims in NXIUM [sic]. Just look at the list of crimes the DOJ said were committed and the stories on this website. You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about.
Anyone who stood up to the NXIVM Lawsuit Terrorism of the Bronfmans, Nancy Salzman and Raniere is a hero.
I appreciate and value your saying that shadowstate1958. When those of us who went into battle with NXIVM or the Bronfmans, we went up against 22 of their attorneys from 7 prominent law firms. Based on my experience of being dragged into 13 lawsuits, their court filings were filled with salacious, false accusations, lies, fraud, deceit and as much mud they could throw at a wall to make you “appear” guilty and attempt to prejudice the court against you. Further, many of those lawyers knowingly spoke untrue facts, and fudged the line often in court. Even with such outlandish false accusations that I stole the Bronfman’s money. It took an act of courage on behalf of those of us who unfortunately got sued to fight them in court, and an inner strength to keep fighting for the truth. Eventually, almost every lawsuit brought was dismissed. This Judge in Brooklyn court, however, appears to not be falling for any of their shenanigans, and is not giving them an inch, while holding them accountable. I have great confidence he will oversee the trial in the same manner. Let’s hope that more truth keeps emerging, and that Keith et are held accountable with prison time, and justice is finally served.
Frank wrote, “If anyone truly wants to make serious allegations against her character, or conduct, then I am going to request they use their real names”
That sounds fair, but how will you know if my name is really say Brooke Wilson, Jason Stout, or Jeremy Casper?
It’s true that someone may use a fictitious name, however, should someone want to accuse, blame, refute, or state a different version of facts than mine – then if I know “who” they are, I will be better able to gage if they are real and could even know what they are talking about. I knew many people at NXIVM, and they would need to be someone I knew in order to make certain claims or accusations against me. If it is not a name that I know, then I will begin to ask questions as to who, how, and when they know or their source. Often, things are propagated from one person to another – and they assume it’s true. There is a lot of hearsay, rumours, and false things propagated anonymously on this blog. It is my belief that some of the more harsh, false, slanderous comments about me are done by people I actually know who may want to discredit, diminish and portray me in a negative light. I even welcome their questions and comments, however, let’s do it in an honest, open, straightforward way and have a genuine dialog of the facts. I am also open to them sending a message privately as long as they reveal their name.
Besides having the decency to simply man (or woman) up, which admitedly is grossly lacking on this website, Frank could ask for an established social media account (not a newly created one), websites you own or have commented on, other online evidence regarding your name, ask you for your address/phone number, etc. I’m sure Frank has other methods in mind as well.
Barbara, I am eager to hear your side of the story. Thank you for coming here.
Thank you Somebody! It helps to know that people do want to hear my side of the story. I appreciate your encouragement!
I think Barbara is indicative of most of the people that joined NXIVM; They were all good people trying to do good and Keith Raniere lead them down a pernicious path to hell.
I am glad Frank is not going to allow anyone to cowardly attack Barbara when she shares her story.
I appreciate your saying so niceguy! Yes, I agree and know from being there that most were “good” people while Keith and his inner circle cleverly concealed many things and critical facts from us. Some of us knowing far less than what has emerged today, left years ago causing Keith to be even more strategic in how they operated. I, too, am glad that Frank is going to put in place a process where people like me can share our stories, without being cruelly attacked. Many of us have paid a dear price from having been involved. As for myself, I have endured a malicious legal attack, being terrorized, stalked, followed, threatened and cruelly harassed directed by Keith. I have endured an enormous amount of losses, trauma and public humiliation spanning ten years. Most are not aware that for years before leaving I confronted Keith and his inner circle, boycotted, stepped down from the board, stopped enrolling all in an effort to address what I could “see” of the abuses going on. Further, my efforts to help support members who left, to fight, and help bring Keith down never stopped. As a leader, I felt responsible for having enrolled many and to build NXIVM. Because of that, I have continued as best I can to make amends and help stop Keith from harming more people. My penance if you will for my years of involvement has been large. But, my silver lining and gift are the many lessons learned, and has made me a far better person today possessing a greater depth of compassion, forgiveness, empathy and love for all the victims of NXIVM, and elsewhere in the world having endured pain at the hands of those who manipulate.
Thank you for your words of encouragement and support!
Just wondering how your cousin Krissie is doing? I hope someone with her handicap
did not suffer financially at the hand of Keith!
Barb how many people did you enroll into ESP/Nxium?
Barb how much did you earn from your 9 years with Nxium?
Barb did you pay taxes on your income from Nxium?
Barb, since you are in a tell all mode, those of us not in the inner circle, on the board of directors, or part of the harem; would all like honest answers to these questions.
Respectfully awaiting honest answers
Dear Inquiring Mind,
I would like to respond “honestly” to your questions, however, I don’t have time to do so right now, but will do so tomorrow. Btw, my cousin’s name is Chrissy, and not Krissie. As for how she is doing, she passed away in 2008. More tomorrow. Have a good night.
Dear Inquiring Mind,
Thank you for asking about my cousin Chrissy, who was my best friend, and passed away in 2008. I miss her presence, love, friendship and guidance dearly – everyday. She took her first NXIVM workshop two months after I did mine. We both became apprentice coaches at the same time. Chrissy was a high ranking coach teaching many Ethos classes and loved the community. She also was fully aware of my intimate with Keith from day one. Yes, she did have a muscular handicap with severe scoliosis and muscles atrophied to the point she was having seizures. One occurred while she was driving causing her car to flip, which severed her spinal cord. She left NXIVM a few years before me and tried to convince me to leave as well. A year before I quit, she was optimistic I might leave soon, because I had been contemplating it quite awhile. Sadly, she died 6 months before I quit. But, I know she would be relieved and happy I left, and proud that I never stopped helping others to leave while fighting Keith hoping to bring him down. If she was alive, I believe she’d be right alongside of me helping, too.
Did she suffer financially at the hands of Keith? No, not that I know of. Chrissy was a smart, successful owner of a mortgage brokerage co. leaving a large estate when she died. She did lend a sizeable amount of money to Keith and Nancy, which was paid off in full two years later including 12% annual interest. By financial standards, that’s a great return. So, I guess you could say she profited handsomely at the hands of Keith in that regard. I will say that the coaches were not paid appropriately, and in that regard she lost. Although, she ran her company full time while and her NXIVM involvement was part-time.
How many people did you I enroll? I believe my organization when I left was about 700? Of that, my guess is directly enrolled few hundred, and indirectly assisting others the remainder? I did weekly #800 intro calls where anyone could listen, so I may have had an impact there. And, if someone asked me to help them enroll a person they knew, I would always assist.
How much did I earn from my 9 years with NXIVM and did I pay taxes? My Quickbooks shows $650,000 commissions earned (I was not paid for any other work performed), which also was reported on my tax returns paying tax. An average of $72,000 a year. In the early years it was higher but later years far less as I stopped enrolling to boycott thinking it would give me leverage for issues to be addressed.
Yes, I am, and have always been, in an “honest” tell all mode. Starting today, I am telling it on a blog with a larger audience.
As for your “part of the harem” comment, in my opinion it’s unkind. You are welcome to ask more “inquiring” questions and I will do my best to answer truthfully, however, I would respectfully request that you leave out unkind comments.
Thank you for taking the time to share your story. I do not believe most of your critics understand the hell you went through between the civil and criminal courts; and everything else you endured. Whatever punishment/penalty your critics believe you deserve you have no doubt paid it and then some. Barbara you chose to stand up and fight instead of walking away. You are a strong woman and good person. I wish you the best.
Wow, that was really nice!
Thank you for taking the time to read my comments. Yes, most do not know the degree of “hell” and the nightmare I have endured almost ten years now. And, the little I have shared thus far, or what is out there in the media, does not convey all that they did. These were no normal lawsuits, or people attacking you. Their tactics were mafia-like, threatening, stalking, terrorizing, and painful daily, nonstop for years. I would bore you if I provided the details of all that they did or overwhelm you with how dark it truly was. For years I could not make ends meet frightened I could not afford attorneys, and forced to write legal briefs, filings and memos of law in order to stay in the game defending myself. Many times I could not find attorneys to represent me given NXIVM’s reputation was well known. Or, attorneys I did get were not the best nor a match for the unethical conduct of their attorneys – some of them real pit-bulls.
I could have gone quiet into the night when leaving NXIVM, but I chose not to. As a leader, I felt responsible for enrolling people and cared for their well-being. And so, I started the first revolution and have never given up, never surrendered. Yes, I do believe if people really knew all that I endured, the losses incurred, pain and suffering, years of nightly anxiety attacks, costs I have paid, my business reputation and clients leaving, and being so traumatized for years that I moved thousands of miles away to a city not knowing a single soul to start my life over – gain distance – not walk down a street where people thought I was the evil banker from the dark side. I do believe the price I have paid over these ten years, and my efforts to stop Keith, is penance enough. I am grateful that my adverse childhood gave me tools to navigate challenges, and built within me an inner strength to survive, and keep fighting.
Thank you for your lovely words of encouragement and support. It means a lot to me, and I draw strength from you.
How can we be assured Ms. Bouchey’s information is accurate?
That is a good question. What I can say is this: Those who “know me well” state that I very upfront, straightforward, honest and tries to speak objectively, and as best I can tell both the good and bad. Often, I am ridiculed and judged for saying there was any good within NXIVM. However, there was and it is why so many good people came through the doors, and many stayed for years. There is an extraordinary amount of information, facts and evidence I have provided through the 13 lawsuits dragged into by NXIVM & Bronfmans – and – provided when I could legally to media stemming 10 years. My relationship with the Albany Times Union reporters spans 10 years. One of the reasons I agreed to be on their upcoming panel discussion is because they stated to me, “Barbara, our long standing relationship with you has found you to be always be honest, straightforward and your facts consistent provided.” The TU reporters are looking to investigate, report true facts, and verify information provided. I can tell you that I will do my best to portray the facts as I recall them truthfully. Should there be a particular question you want to ask, then I will respond. If I have evidence to support my facts, then I will provide them. Thank you for your comment, and I look forward to providing what I know.
You say those that know you say your very upfront, straightforward, honest. How are we to believe that when you covered up for you lover for almost a decade?
Did you know from the beginning that Mr. Raniere was having multiple girlfriends before you became sexually involved with him?
If not, why would you stay with a man would lie to you about having a monogamous relationship with you and become part of his harem?
Ms. Bouchey, why pretend he was an honest, ethical man to the hundreds, maybe thousands who came through the doors of NXIVM during your tenure of being a girlfriend-executive board member after he proved he was a liar on such a personal level?
I’ve read some of your court documents that have been posted and stories. Raniere promised to pay you back the millions he lost in the commodities market, for years he never did. Why did you let him get away with that?
Do you ever wonder of the thousands you could have saved from this abusive group by being honest, truthful and straightforward about his lies and immorality within the first couple of years?
How are we to trust you now? I don’t live in the Albany area, it’s too much of a drive for me to come. If your going to use the Frank Report as an outlet, it seems fair to answer questions from those of use who cant make the drive.
Busy day today but will try to respond late tonight. Thank for your comments.
PS: Nancy Salzman just plead guilty and appears in court tomorrow! It’s a game changer.
Sorry for the delay as I’ve been out of town since late Monday with lots of meetings unable to respond.
Yes, in general I am very straightforward and honest. That doesn’t mean there are not times that I lied, fibbed, exaggerated or withheld things – for I have. Haven’t we all at? Some might “say” they know me well or cast doubt – so I say – give specifics where I knowingly lied to cover up wrongdoing at NXIVM and I’ll be happy to address it.
Even Keith and his inner circle “knew” how honest I was. In quoting his inner closest confidante girlfriend, Kristin Keeffe, who after she left NXIVM said, “Keith always told us that Barbara is strong and will tell the truth and go down with the ship to do so!”
Did I cover up for my lover (Keith) for almost a decade? If you mean by “cover up” my “intimate relationship” then based on its definition of: “put something such as a cloth or lid on top of or in front of in order to protect or conceal” – then NO – because I didn’t need tput anything into place as no one in the community ever asked me. If “your” definition of cover up is to not voluntarily offer I was having a relationship with Keith -then yes – that would be true.
I do recall once after being involved with Keith about 8 mos, a coach I had known briefly asked while in my home and after Keith had just left. if we “had a thing going on?” I was at a loss, didn’t yet know of Keith’s other intimate relationships, and unsure if I should say yes. So, I shrugged my shoulders indicating “no.” It was not an honest answer, which I felt awful about, and she never asked again.
I will share that this aspect of not speaking of my intimate relationship tormented me – because I am so straightforward. I had more EMs and inner circle feedback on this than you can imagine. But, they persuaded me to believe my relationship was no one’s business, they worried it might subject me to others being jealous and envious, or would not bode well for Keith. On a deep level, I did not agree, felt compelled to tell the community, which is why it tormented me. Knowing what I know now, if I had it to do over again, I would not have gone along with it. I am deeply sorry that I did not for my own well-being and others. This is an example of my not being true to myself, and is also how Keith with his inner circle could cleverly manipulate.
No, I did not know from the beginning, and not until a year after meeting Keith already in an intimate sexual relationship with him that he had multiple girlfriends.
Once I did learn of a few, I was already in love with him, thought he was my soul mate, and it was destiny to work together to help others and make a difference in the world. Plus, I loved the community and work we were doing. By this time, I had subscribed to the philosophy of “committing to evolve my soul” to root out areas of: anger; being unkind; mean; punishing; condescending; overly judgemental; lack of forgiveness; jealousy or envy, etc. (You get the drift). An area causing much stress, anger, grief, fear and jealousy was finding out Keith didn’t reveal and was having his multiple intimacy with a few others. EVERY CELL IN MY BODY WANTED TO END THINGS AND LEAVE.
Keith and his inner circle’s response to not telling me was: they feared if I “knew” that I might never get intimately involved with Keith (totally true); like a parent not telling a child something thinking “they knew best what was good for them” was used (I don’t agree). Didn’t I want to evolve my soul to root out the biggest area causing anger? (True). Did I want to give up all the good and purposeful work over sex? (Not really but wanted to). Didn’t I know this area is one of the hardest issues and attachments we humans face? (Yeah, some truth there). Would it not be great to be free if it? (For sure). Are there not many polyamorous relationships in the world and many fine, happy with it? (Yup, but I’m not one of them). Keith loves you believing you are his soul mate – please stay. His having sex with these other women is not as meaningful as you make it nor as significant as you are in his life (unsure).
And so, it took a lot of deep thinking to evaluate this and how I felt. Have you ever had a loved one not tell you or lie about something believing it was best, or for your own good, or to protect or spare you harm – and then – you forgave them?
Well, Jusjus, you get the drift?
So yes, I forgave him and decided to give it the Girl Scout try to evolve my soul, hope to get rid of that anger, continue to be a part of an extraordinary group, help others empower themselves, and make a difference in the world.
Yes, this was a lie, but the only one I knew of. I decided at the time it made sense, forgave him, and did not “assume” it meant he would lie in other areas. And so, there was “no pretending” needed nor don by me during my 9 years involved, because I found and believed Keith to be an honest, ethical man.
How many of us had a loved one, family member or spouse tell a lie, or betray us, or had an affair they lied about? How many of us forgave them continuing the relationship? Or give them another chance? If someone lies to you once, does that mean they are just a big fat liar in all things, and we call it quit or end things?
You have the choice to stand in judgment of my decision to stay involved. You can choose to not believe that I did not observe him from that day forward be dishonest. That is until the last year about a few things. It wasn’t until my last week at NXIVM when the NXIVM 9 confronted him for 10.5 hours did I WITNESS him repeatedly lie, deny, be deceitful, accuse of me “beguiling” “misleading” “giving false data” to the other 8 women. WE IMMEDIATELY RESIGNED, influenced two centres to close, told as many as we could causing 100 to leave. I have continued to help save others and stop Keith, and paid a severe price for my having been masterfully conned by Keith and his inner circle.
Yes, I did wonder, and care, about the well-being of thousands of people. I have gone to extraordinary lengths for ten years to keep trying to save people ofrom this abusive group with being honest, truthful and straightforward about what I learned of Keith’s lies and immorality.
If you doubt this, I can provide 800 court filings containing thousands of pages, affidavits, deposition transcripts (many in public circulation and used countless times by the media). I spoke with countless media, 8 judges, authorities, 8 govt agencies, and helped to get the current investigation opened resulting in Keith’s arrest. And, I have suffered unspeakable losses, trauma, accusations, blame and humiliated by many – INCLUDING YOURS.
Yes, Raniere and Salzman promised to pay back the millions he lost in the commodities market. For years, I asked him to do so, but there was always a reason it wasn’t a good time and did want to be selfish since I still earned a lot of money, or why put them in a financial predicament, or didn’t I care about the good work we were doing or more about my money? You get the drift. The last year I really started pressuring and both he and Nancy got uncomfortable, and said they were working on it but always procrastinating. And lastly, I was grossing lots of money in my company, loved him and the community, assumed I’d get it back, and am not the type who is only driven by money – and have been very generous with my money to help others.
When I resigned, I officially put it in writing they owed me this money, but he then lied about it being not owed and it was blackmail and extortion.
Jusjus, I wonder how you’d feel losing your life savings? Or incurring $700,000 defending yourself against Keith’s wrongful legal attack that took you 7 years to pay off? Or, how about losing 2/3rds of your clients and revenue from NXIVM controversial headline news stores?
I wonder – why you don’t mention anything about that? Or, if you feel I’ve paid a big enough price yet for having been a part of NXIVM? I don’t believe anyone deserves the hell I have lived the last ten years being stalked by Keith.
How are any of you to trust me now? Guess all I can do is leave that up to each person to decide. My hope is that by sharing my story and answering questions that a trust can be built, and that I’m no longer blamed, ridiculed, defamed, and public humiliated anymore. And, that someday you might trust me more, or at least think ten years of hell is enough.
Anonymous: You ask, “How can we be assured Ms. Bouchey’s information is accurate?”
These days, we often have no assurance that information is accurate. That holds true whether it is on a blog or on mainstream media or even in the ‘newspaper of record’, The NY Times. We just have to make our own best decision. As for me, I’m inclined to Ms. Bouchey the benefit of the doubt.
Yes, I agree there are not always assurances if information is accurate. We can only do our best to listen, research, verify, evaluate and decide what seems true for each of us.
Often, when I read the media/blog stories, I know of the many inaccuracies cited. It is far more than you ever imagine. Personally, I find most media stories focus on the dark, bizarre, and abusive elements – and – rarely ever tell any of the good. What this does is not portray an accurate depiction of the inner world of NXIVM and its community. Nor, what was good there about the people, the curriculum, coaching, activities and community good will. This only causes people to make assumptions it was ALL bad, people were brainwashed, fools, stupid, blind followers, and bad.
However, in my opinion from being an integral part of that community and being one who helped build it – that is not true. The only way to truly inform and educate people about the dangers of groups like this is to tell the WHOLE STORY both good and bad. Only then will people come to learn, understand and know what to look for. It is my heartfelt wish to help foster that understanding – and be a voice (although rare these days) who can objectively speak to both the good and bad. For, there was a lot of good there, which is why good people came and stayed.
And, thank you for giving me the “benefit of the doubt” as that is all I hope for. In time as I speak more of what I know, I hope that more people grant me that, too.
I’m inclined to doubt her, as I do everybody until I get more confidence in what they’re saying, such as being consistent with what they say over a period of time, consistent with others, etc. Also, if they selectively answer some questions and not others, that’s a red flag.
Well, that’s fair. I am fine with your having doubts, and encourage you to ask questions so that I might clarify the doubts you have. I believe you will find me to be very consistent as I try to write objectively, truthfully, and have a great memory – and mind for details. I guess that helped me in becoming a good financial planner. I don’t believe I have selectively answered some questions and not others. It is taking me awhile though to respond to every comment especially given the last few days have been extremely busy. Frank thinks that so many of my comments are worthy of their own posts, that he asked if we don’t put them here, but in a separate post. However, I requested of him of him to post all my responses here first, that way everyone directly gets a response and knows where to find it. And, anyone who might read this post will see an answer to each comment. Frank and I might decide to take some of my comments using them for future posts, which I might add in more details if it seems to make it more understandable.
By the way, should you deem something I have written raises a red flag, then by all means let me know so that I can clarify or address further.
Good move on forcing people to use their real names, Frank.
I agree wholeheartedly! One of my concerns was that I am often attacked negatively by annonymous comments, and that makes if very difficult to respond or address their concerns, accusations, or questions. By knowing “who” the person is it will help me understand better where their comments and or facts are coming from. Sometimes people repeat heresay or may blame without any real knowledge or facts. My request of Frank is that if I move forward to post, and do my best to respond to questions, that it would be better to have the “real name” of the person should they want to refute my facts, accuse or blame me. Frank graciously agreed to this which is what provides me some degree of comfort in finally speaking after ten years. It is my wish to answer questions and respond. Frank further stated he would censor annonymous comments aid to slander, defame and accuse me of some kind of wrongdoing – which sadly, is done often. I have read comments accusing me of criminal actions that are completely untrue. Thank you for your comment tex2.
I appreciate your support and encouragement in finally making some posts on your blog. I do so with trepidation given the many negative comments when any posts are written about me. But, I am taking a deep breath, and mustering up my courage to brave this new domain to begin sharing my story, and I appreciate your providing me a platform to do so.
After ten years since leaving NXIVM, I finally feel it is “safer” now for me to post given the last lawsuit against me was finally dismissed in 2017, and more significant, that Keith, Nancy, Clare, Lauren, Alison and Kathy were arrested in 2018 now awaiting a trial.
Recently, I was made aware by reliable sources that for over a year there has been a concerted effort by certain people to propagate a smear campaign to discredit me and diminish my role in the “arc” of the NXIVM take down story. I was suspicious this existed given the velocity of negative postings and comments on Frank’s blog, and horrified to discover it was much worse than I thought. I shared this “arc” to Frank, which he reported in this post with examples of that “arc.” This is not a true and accurate depiction of the “arc” of the NXIVM take down story.
I have refrained from speaking publicly (or in interviews) of things unfavorable about those who left NXIVM believing we are all “victims” of Keith not wanting to add further pain. I believed the focus was to keep my eye on the ball to fight and and bring Keith down. However, it appears being silent is no longer a good thing, nor the accumulating false accusations (many completely false, salacious, and slanderous) over ten years against me without my defending myself. This smear campaign and others items as brought me to a place that I feel it is incumbent upon me to no longer remain silent, defend myself, and share what I know.
I believe that I am uniquely qualified to share knowledge possessing such things as:
~20-year history due to my intimate relationship with Keith of 9 yrs
~Being a part of his inner circle
~Instrumental in helping to build NXIVM knowing much of its history
~Being Clare and Sara Bronfman’s Investment Adviser of 5 yrss
~Maintaining meticulous records I refused to give up or sign Keith’s gag orders (those 17 boxes and 5000 emails)
~Knowledge of many members and consultants who left and being dragged into their lawsuits
~Surviving 9 yrs. of litigation learning Keith’s corrupt legal tactics with its fraud by suing innocent people. Keith is a terrorist by its definition, and has employed a terrorist campaign designed to threaten, harass, falsely accuse, arrest all in attempt to silence detractors from sharing what they know by his misuse of courts and authorities as a weapon,
~8 govt agencies I gained access into and why most investigations went nowhere
~An overall general understanding and perspective.
It is my hope to inform, educate, clarify, and share my knowledge in order to foster a further understanding, compassion, empathy, and forgiveness for all parties involved. And shed light on why 17,000 people around the world took NXIVM workshops stating they received positive benefits, why so many good people like Sarah Edmondson, Mark Vicente and myself stayed for years, what caused good people to leave, and how Keith and his inner circle cleverly used many methods of manipulation, secrets, lack of transparency, undue influence and led members down their primrose path. I have my theory on why I think Keith got more narcissistic while his actions more corrupt (and evil) believing he was untouchable leading to his creating the DOS Women’s Secret Society with its horrific abuses.
My wish is that people remain open to what I might share, and that I can add to the body of knowledge to educate others so they do not fall prey to groups like NXIVM.
This is a brave thing to do, I applaud you! I applaud Frank as well for setting boundaries. (The trolling on this site, particularly against you, has been shocking, cruel, and unnecessary.) I hope everyone harmed by Nxivm can support each other. It’s in the best interest of all. Proud of you Barbara!
Thank you for being one of the brave ones who will comment in order to provide clarification, support and or to defend me. I know you have at times been viciously attacked, along with others, and am grateful for your willingness and courage to keep commenting in spite of it. It is my wish also to foster an environment where by ex-members are supported, and can support each other. I hope to foster more understanding, compassion and empathy with those never involved with NXIVM as they seek to understand better why so many good people were involved, and more of the inner world of NXIVM. My wish is to inspire more forgiveness for everyone. NO ONE KNOWING JOINS A CULT. And, neither did I. I recall it was one month after I left NXIVM that I realized that “OMG, I was in a cult!” after doing some research on the topic. Thank you for being one of my greatest supporters over the years and helping me to traverse the challenging events and trauma.
The one image I have burned in my mind was the day you went to court (after the monumental legal fees had bankrupted you) and you could no longer afford an attorney. You had to represent yourself in courtroom against a room full of vicious, unethical superattorneys – AND THEY STILL. COULD. NOT. BEAT. YOU!! You are a hero just for surviving girlfriend!!
Welcome! It will be nice to have some true insights.
Thank you for the kind words! I am looking forward to sharing as many true insights as possible. Stay tuned.
“Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente are heroes for having led the revolution that got 100s out of NXIVM.”
Not heroes. Both ignored things for years. Sarah Edmondson knew she would face some repercussions for leaving two months after realising whose initials were branded on her flesh and went to the press to save herself. Mark Vicente also. They were top NXIVM people and leaving in protest would of meant punishment of some sort. They stayed in for years and must of known about crimes. Both Mark Vicente and his own mother were named in Joe O’Hara’s lawsuit and John Tighe said Vicente’s mother was involved with the PO Box money laundering from Mexico. This is not a heroic act. You don’t spend over fifteen years in NXIVM at a high level, know nothing, ignore bad stuff, profit from bad stuff and then play the hero “whistleblower” card. What would Sarah Edmondson have done if she was not branded? Look at Mark Vicentes twitter page. He is a virtue signaller and likes to shit on Trump and others to feel morally righteous.
All of these “heros” better be ready to fall on their sword when it comes to admitting what they were taught, such as not paying taxes, and then telling the truth about whether they followed the teaching, and what they did immediately after hearing illegal things being promoted. Otherwise, they are “zeros, not “heros” in my book.
It sounds like you believe many of us did not pay taxes? I have been accused on this blog of not reporting 1099 commissions and not paying taxes. This is untrue and I reported paying my taxes every year. But, I will share a few things. Somewhere in my second year while on a walk with Keith, he offered to not have a 1099 issued for what I recall was $10,000 in commissions earned that year. I was surprised asking how was that possible and it’s illegal. He said that he could arrange for it. At the time, I thought he was only offering because I was his girlfriend and somehow wanted to do that for me. I emphatically said NO. My career as a Certified Financial Planner and Investment Adviser was one where I advised people with their finances. What would it say about me to not appropriately report commissions? And, I was grossing $1.0 million at the time from my asset mgmt company (long before I ever met Keith) and how stupid would that be to risk not reporting $10,000 when I was earning far more? I had no idea if he made that offer to others. What I do know is there was a book called Jekyll of Creature Island and a movie out by Michael Moore talking about how one could choose to not file a tax return. Keith wanted to experiment and I learned that Dawn Morrison (one of his inner circle) who was earning very little money, started to not file tax returns. I am aware that Keith thought our government was corrupt and did a lousy job of handling it’s budget and taxpayer monies. I am not aware during the time I was involved nor in the workshops, where it was “taught” to not pay taxes. It wasn’t until years later after quitting NXIVM, that Kristin Keeffe (inner circle who oversaw all the lawsuits for Keith & Bronfmans) had left NXIVM. She revealed to me just how much corruption was going on within the inner operations of NXIVM, money coming over the Mexican border, NXIVM not filing tax returns, double sets of books in some of the other companies Keith created. I was shocked to learn this, and that it was going on while I was involved! There is a court filing containing a 2.5 hour dialog between Kristin Keeffe and myself in March 2015 when she wanted to make me the “steward” of the corruption knowledge she possessed believing I was the most creditable person who could get into a govt agency with this information. Which by the way, I did. And so, what I can say is it is often propagated Keith was teaching everyone to not pay taxes, and there is a big misconception by readers of this blog is was rampant. However, it was not. It appears based on what Keeffe revealed to me it was going on in a smaller domain of people within Keith’s fold. Thank you for your question and I hope this might clarify things a little more for you.
About what year was the stroll with Raniere when he made the offer? I’ve tried reading the transcript of your discussion with Keeffe, I keep falling asleep. I’ll try again. Is there an audio recording? The fact that you didn’t try to straighten out the tax discussion before is a huge disservice to this website’s effort in going after Raniere & Co. You allowed a lot of energy to be expended that shouldn’t have been, if you’re telling the truth.
There you have it, folks. Barb said not paying taxes wasn’t taught in NXIVM courses. If you claim it was, provide evidence, including what year you were taught. Just because you were taught this after Barb left doesn’t equal that she is lying. It also doesn’t mean she isn’t lying, it means we need more facts. By the way, I changed my ID to Scott Johnson on this account to minimize confusion.
Scott – There was not a class about not paying taxes. Keith talked to people about not paying taxes and was a proponent of not paying. Members then shared this “wisdom” with others. The Laurens and Dawns of the world who were ride or die with Keith didn’t pay taxes as a natural progression of bad advice from their pants burning guru.
It’s been 19 years since I first joined NXIVM, and my recollection is it was early on – maybe the second year?
The transcript discussion with Keeffe was in March 2015, one year after she left NXIVM. Sorry if you keep falling asleep and please do try again. Also, you might take note that throughout the discussion as Kristin informed me of all the corruption going on that I was totally shocked, and clueless it was happening during the years I was involved. And, Kristin states this as well in case you are still in disbelief that I was not aware of the corruption. Please try not to fall asleep during those critical parts, ok? Yes, there is an audio recording.
How could I straighten out the tax discussion when I didn’t know anything about it when I was involved? You might recall in a comment in this post somewhere saying Keith never asked me again if I might not want to receive a 1099, and I was not aware there might be others he had offered the same thing to. I just assumed he wanted to be a nice boyfriend, but I wasn’t interested in that nice thing. And, after I quit, within one month I met with the FBI, US Attorney General’s Office, Customs, IRS and Immigration to share what little I did know hoping they might investigate and discover more. Some people go to bed with a Danielle Steele novel, but what I did is go to bed reading through the 17 boxes and 5 thousand emails stored in my office I had never gone through before to see if there was anything fishy going on, and when I found anything I also tried to properly, and legally, get it before the authorities.
And so, I did a huge service over ten years trying to get an investigation opened and Keith to be stopped. Therefore, there was extraordinary energy spent on my part nonstop. Please also refer to another comment in this post where I explained all the efforts I did make and the enormous cost to me in order to do so. And yes, I told the truth back then, throughout the years, and am doing so now.
You wrote, “Barb said not paying taxes wasn’t taught in NXIVM courses.” Yes, that is my recollection, I don’t recall seeing in any specific module a teaching of “not paying your taxes.” But, in another comment on this post, I did share Keith had Dawn Morrison not file a tax return and some other items. Perhaps, you might find it and read? It is quite possible that a module was created after I left teaching students or coaches to not pay taxes. Maybe someone who was there after 2009 might choose to answer that question for you.
It seems to me that you assume members ignored and or knew of the corruption within NXIVM? I cannot speak for what Sarah Edmondson or Mark Vicente knew or may have become aware of in the 10 years since I left – but – I can speak for the 9 years I was involved.
I, along with most members, did NOT know of the inner operations containing corruption. I was never even allowed in their financial office nor to see financial statements or privy to their operations. Many believe given my career as a Financial Planner and Keith’s girlfriend, that I was aware or participated, however, I did not. You see, Keith knew how to boundary test people’s morality and ethics, and only brought into his fold those who would go along with his “way” of doing things. The majority of members stayed because WE did the majority of the work, taking workshops, teaching, and enrollments which based on our experience was very positive. WE believed in the overall philosophy that the workshops helped people, empowered them, resolved conflicts, developed better relationships, removed fears and limitations – all to make a positive difference in our lives and those of others. In effect, WE the good people with good intentions doing the good work were the “sheep’s clothing” disguising unknowingly the “wolf” Keith Raniere.
As in any marriage, friendship, relationship, business, job, and organization there are good and bad things. One continually evaluates the pros and cons to either stay – or – decide the cons outweigh the pros ending the relationship. And, so be true within NXIVM. When I left, I influenced 8 key women (The NXIVM 9) to leave with me shutting down two centers and causing 100 people to leave while opening up Pandora’s Box of NXIVM. This was after I gathered them together so we could collectively share what we could “see” were abuses, punishment, favoritism, unethical conduct and what we deemed was Keith’s abuse of leadership, power and authority. WE met with Keith for 10.5 hours to address our concerns with solutions we thought could remedy the issues. However, for the first time WE got to witness Keith in a way most had never been able to. WE observed him deny, refute, lie and blame me for filling these 8 women with false data, misleading them, and trying to destroy the company wrongfully. It was then that our eyes were “open” to this other dark side of Keith. WE immediately resigned, closed our centers, and began a campaign to inform and educate as many as we could to the reasons we were resigning. Many of us continued in that campaign to help others “wake up” lasting to this day.
Yes, we were ignorant to this darker, insidious side of Keith and his inner circle because they cleverly concealed it. Yes, we were denied critical facts in order to make well-informed decisions about our association with NXIVM. But, WE did not know at that time the degrees of hidden abuse and corruption within NXIVM.
Is Sarah, Mark or I heroes? Some say we are, and some share a similar view as you. However, I strongly believe if you “knew” all that we “knew” at the time, your view might be different. It is my hope that with further knowledge that maybe you, along with others, might become better informed as to how NXIVM could last as long as it did, and how many of us were involved for so long for what we perceived were good reasons. Hopefully, you might remain open, reserve judgment, and re-evaluate your views after more of the NXIVM story comes out.
Thank you for your response,
I imagine the Dalai Lama’s appearance in 2009 for NXIVM helped convince some doubtful members that NXIVM was an ethical organization and you defectors were just disgruntled and jealous. After all – it’s the Dalai Lama
There is an interesting backstory to the Dalai Lama Event, which on a later post I will share more as I am intimately familiar with it.
Needless to say, it was a few weeks before the Dalai Lama’s appearance in Albany that I invited 22 NXIVM members to participate in a forum at my house to openly, collectively discuss issues within the organization. I knew most were coming in for the event, and thought it was a good time to gather them together.
Eventually, it came down to nine women, who have since been called the NXIVM 9. I knew this event was critical to Keith and his belief that it would put him on a world stage seen as an ethical leader of the likes of the Dalai Lama. I had one foot out the door, and Keith knew he was on tenacious ground with me fearing that if I left – that I could potentially bring the whole organization down. And so, I was able to persuade him to meet with the NXIVM 9. We held 10.5 hours of meetings with Keith (all filmed by the way which I keep protected), that resulted in us observing his behavior, manipulation, lies, denial and abnegation of responsibility – that we then concluded he was “crazy” and would “never change” and was “the problem.” WE immediately resigned on April 24, 2009. He feared I would disrupt the upcoming Dalai Lama event, and set about with drastic measures to stop me serving me legal papers within 18 hours of resigning threatening civil and criminal actions for bogus extortion and to destroy his company. Within 36 hours he brought the community together weaving a fantastical tale about my being a criminal, a suppressive (aka sociopath) and that I “beguiled” and “mislead” the other 8 women – and to uphold a principle I needed to be arrested. Little did I know that Keith had carefully conspired 2-3 years earlier with a smear campaign against me portraying me as a suppressive trying to destroy the company, and had enrolled others to believe it was true like Mark Vicente. When I resigned, he kicked into high gear and the dominoes crumbled, and I was overnight shunned, betrayed, and most members would not talk to me to hear “why” I and the other 8 women left. And so, he saved the day for the Dalai Lama event that occurred two weeks later on May 6, 2009. They used that event to foster within the community what an ethical, noble humanitarian Keith was. The Dalai Lama even wrote the foreword to his book, which was released and sold at the event. Ever since, they have “milked” that 45 minute public appearance by the Dalai Lama to instill in the minds of people Keith was good, and the NXIVM 9 were not to be believed – nor any of the highly controversial facts that had emerged. Stay tuned for more on this topic.
When are you going to put the 10.5 hours of video on YouTube or another platform, such as your own website?
That’s a nice, high-level monologue, Barb. Now, let’s get down to specifics. Are you saying you never heard the teaching to not pay taxes?
Yes, let’s get down to specifics, and let me share what I know in regards to not paying taxes.
During my 9 yrs at NXIVM, I am not aware of any workshop material that “taught” people nor coaches to “not pay taxes.”
However, I did observe things regarding this topic within Keith’s inner circle. Here is what I recall:
After a couple years of being involved, Keith became intrigued with a best-selling book called “Creature from Jekyll Island” written by G. Edward Griffin, which is kind of conspiracy theory explaining the roots of all modern American wars, depression, economic boom, and best-kept secrets of international banking. It’s an expose of the Federal Reserve, how it got formed by an exclusive boys-club gathering of American financiers and politicians. In fact, I brought Griffin in as a speaker for a Vanguard Week.
Then, Keith became enamoured with a Michael Moore documentary (maybe The Corporation?) which somewhere in it spoke of a law whereby a USA citizen isn’t required to file a tax return.
Later on I learned that Keith asked one of his inner circle women, Dawn Morrison, who worked for an advertising company not earning much money, to experiment by not filing a tax return following the guidelines of the documentary to see if it would work. I want to say she did it the next year, too, but am unaware of the outcome?
Once, I recall being on a walk with Keith and he offered to not give me a 1099 for commissions I earned around $10,000. I was shocked saying that was illegal and how could he do such a thing? At the time, I was grossing $1.0 million in my company, and this would be wrong and risky to do – not to mention absurd to jeopardise my business. He just dropped the topic and never mentioned it again. Understand, Keith boundary tested people’s morality and ethics. Clearly, I was not on board with tax evasion, and never heard another word on the topic again. This is also why Keith NEVER allowed me in the finance office.
Footnote: My earnings was a result of 15 years in business and BEFORE the Bronfmans or any NXIVM member became a client. Except, Nancy Salzman who invested a small IRA in the early 90s before she ever met Keith.
I recall another walk with Keith where he mentioned due to their suing Rick Ross (cult expert deprogrammer) that they were subpoenaed for tax returns, and stated they had not done one in a few years filing extensions debating what was owed with the IRS.
Keith did propagate within the inner circle that the government was lousy, didn’t manage taxpayer monies well, and was corrupt expressing he’d like to give them as little money as possible.
It wasn’t until 5 yrs after leaving NXIVM that I learned of Keith’s tactics of not paying taxes. In March 2015, Kristin Keeffe and I had a dialog about this. She left NXIVM the year before and after failed attempts to get the Feds to open an investigation offering her immunity she gave up hope telling me she moved to Ireland to protect herself and son (Keith’s child). However, she wanted to make me the “steward” of her NXIVM criminal knowledge stating I was the most creditable person likely to gain access to the Feds and do something (she was aware of my 8 govt agency mtgs). I taped and transcribed this call, and then a judge ordered me to submit it as evidence in Oct 2015. This transcript has since been widely circulated and is easily found online. If you read or listen to the audio, it is blatantly clear that I had NO clue of any of this corruption going on – and even while involved! If I didn’t know being in the inner circle, then you can surmise MOST members did not know either. In fact, I wasn’t aware of anyone who did, and if they did then the rule was don’t tell Barbara.
And so, it is my opinion that this gets exaggerated by certain people and the misconception is it was wide spread and widely “taught.” Now, I cannot attest to what happened in the ten years since I left, and or, if the current group of people leaving like Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente didn’t “pay taxes.” But, I suspect this is false propaganda and they did declare and pay taxes. Perhaps, you can ask them and maybe they will comment?
Barbara, like you said, you left years ago. Mark Vicente, his mother, Sarah Edmondson’s husband “Nippy” Ames and many others were named in Joe OHara’s lawsuit. How could they not know? Allison Mack was named in said lawsuit and three years later, was forming DOS.
John Tighe said those on Necker Island plotted money laundering. Is he lying? Why would he?
Not to mention, those who stayed with him after numerous women spoke of his pedophilia and rape, along with police report.
Being named in a lawsuit does not equal being served. How would they know they were named in a lawsuit? Do you know how many lawsuits are floating around at any given time? How do you know that YOU are not named in a lawsuit right now? Where did Tigue get his information from? We have no idea whether he’s lying. Perhaps he has a character flaw and is a liar. We don’t know. How do you know these people became aware of the “numerous women” who spoke of Raniere’s pedophilia and rape? Raniere taught that underage sex is okay. Why would Raniere’s loyal followers have an issue with him having sex with young girls? Or older multiple sex partners? Who goes and reads police reports? Do you understand how naive your questions are?
I apologize for a delayed response as it has been a very busy few days for me. I was able to get to many comments tonight, and would like to respond to you, but it’s now 1:00 AM and I am too tired. More tomorrow.
I am sorry to not have responded yet, but it’s been very busy the last few days. It’s 1:00 AM and I’m too tired, but will respond tomorrow.
Yes they are not heroic figures. As long as they were making money and felt insulated from authorities, business continued as usual.
After Sara Edmundson’s branding experience, she became aware that continuing to support and grow this organization was a personal risk she switched gears to whistleblower.
No way Vincente and Edmundson were innocent!
They knew the crimes.
Your comment suggests that you think that Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente went along with things as long as they were “making money and feeling insulated from authorities?” Let me share my experience first.
During my 9 years at NXIVM, they, and others (including myself) did make money. However, speaking for myself, the only money I earned was from commissions on those enrolled. At the time, I was grossing $1.0 million from my asset mgmt. company (before ever meeting Keith or Bronfmans). After a year being involved with NXIVM, I decided to stop taking on new clients ($1.0 million was plenty of money annually), and with that free time devoted it to working and building NXIVM. Most do NOT know this, but I was NOT paid for most of the work I did. Why? Because, like I said, grossing $1.0 million from my company was great money. My choice was to do something philanthropic, to give back to my community, to make a difference in the world – and making money from that was NOT my motivation. The jobs I performed and did NOT get paid for included: I put in organizational structure so it was more professional, I helped create committees and ran many of them, I supervised and coached many people, I enrolled, I did weekly intro calls for anyone who wanted to learn more, I oversaw sales & marketing, developed the social events, holiday parties and ran them, I created and ran Vanguard Week, I was on the Executive Board, and developed and supervised the NXIVM Café.
What I do know, and observed, is there were many people who belonged to NXIVM and didn’t earn much money – and many didn’t care – and many wanted to do it because it felt purposeful and meaningful (not unlike volunteering for a good cause). At the same time, many were not enrollers, or trained enough to teach, or to perform other jobs. In addition, Keith’s business model sucked, which I constantly was complaining about as lots of coaches facilitated training and did not get paid. There is more to this that I will elaborate in another post. But, the point that I am making is that almost everyone who became a high level coach did so because it was purposeful, they were selfless, caring, generous, intelligent, genuine humanitarians who wanted to make a positive difference in their lives, and in the world.
My personal experience of Sarah and Mark while I was involved, is they, too, shared that view. I assure you that MOST of us were not there for the “money.” I certainly was not because if I devoted half the time I did within NXIVM instead building my company that I would have easily grossed $2.0 million. Happiness, peace, love, and living a purposeful life does not come from money.
As for Sarah Edmondson, let me have you consider this: Sarah lived in Vancouver, three thousand miles from NXIVM headquarters, and was not part of the inner-circle nor intimately involved with Keith. Because of that, her Center was able to grow as the shenanigans of Keith’s inner kingdom did NOT exist there. Sarah had over 200 members in her Center and developed an amazing community. After 13 years of honest, hard work trying to better herself and others, she was grossing $30,000 a month. Had a wonderful husband, a two year old son, a beautiful home on the harbor, and a great life.
Then, she came home with a brand cauterized on her private parts after being coerced, manipulated, and scared. That is when her husband Anthony and her realized something was seriously wrong. But, in order to do something about it, they had to FIRST evaluate that they would being giving up 13 years building a business, income, friends, and a community they loved. Effectively, GIVE IT ALL UP AND START FROM SCRATCH. And so, I assure you it was NOT an easy thing. However, even though 80% was good, the 20% was so bad that they could no longer stay at NXIVM. Add in the knowledge that should they leave, that Keith might very well come after them with a vengeance just as he did to me – and they were rightfully, understandably terrified.
Now, they could have gone quiet into the night, only taking themselves, not caring about anyone else, nor give a hoot about Keith and his abusive ways. But, THEY DID NOT DO THAT. Instead, they made a brave and courageous decision to leave with a bang, and to take as many members with them as they could, which was hundreds. And, knew the risk of doing so was legal action that would last for years.
And so, in my eyes THEY WERE HEROIC FIGURES. In the eyes of many others who “know” more of the inner world of NXIVM and what great risks they took THEY ARE HEROES.
As for what they did, or did not know about “crimes” only they can answer. Hopefully, when the trial is over (and Keith is in jail), they might answer your question directly.
Thank you for your comment, and should you want to ask a more specific question I have not quite answered, then please do.
Barbara, what about John Tighe’s claim that Siohban Hotaling was a money mule coaching in Vancouver on a tourist visa (illegal) and taking Canadian dollars across the US-Canada border? She was named in O’Haras lawsuit too. If Canadian dollars went to the US, surely Edmondson would know.
As previously mentioned, I was never allowed in the accounting finance office, nor was privy to money coming across the borders, and lots of stuff. The transcript from March 2015 between myself and Kristin Keeffe a year after she left NXIVM also validates that I did not know of any of this because she stated “we didn’t tell you” and it’s clear by my shocked responses I had no clue. Keith had learned early on that this type of thing would not be okay with me and I’d leave – therefore – I was not told. And so, I have no knowledge of whether or not Siobahn was a mule coach in Vancouver bringing cash over the border. I presume if anyone would know that it would be Sarah Edmondson,Nippy Ames, Mark Vicente and others. Perhaps, you can direct that question to them or one of the people from Vancouver.
$30,000 is a lot of money. It’s enough for a family to live comfortably on.
Also how do you know how much Edmondson got? Was that based on your time there or have you been in recent contact with her?
Yes, grossing $30,000 a month is a lot of money. Shortly after Sarah Edmondson left NXIVM, I flew up to Vancouver for a few days to meet with her and Nippy to offer any support, information, understanding, perspective and help that I could. Sarah told me that I would be proud of her having taught, trained and mentored when she first came in. At the time she was an actor, and I then taught her how to build the Vancouver area and assisted in that endeavor. Sarah shared that when she was promoted to a Green Sr. Proctor that normally you give tribute to the person that helped you reach that level. She said that I taught her everything she knew about business, starting a center, enrolling, organization, understand money and how to manage it – and that I was key in her achieving those goals. But, that my name was NOT allowed to be said, and how awful she felt to not give credit where credit was due. She laughed and said she surpassed me in enrollments and earnings telling me she was grossing $30,000 a month. And, she did indeed surpass me, and I was for sure extremely proud of her! I always knew Sarah had a lot of determination, was caring, worked hard, earnest, genuine and sincerely wanted to help empower people and make a difference in the world. And, I firmly believed she would do very well, which she did. Sarah and I have a lovely relationship and I strongly defend and support her.
Mark Vicente spent enough time with Raniere that he probably can see the similarities between Raniere and Trump and the blind loyalty of some of Trumps followers who come off like Pea. If people criticize NXIVM members for not believing or leaving after the Times Union expose, what do people say about the people still supporting Trump after the countless articles written about him, his businesses, his finances, and the women who have accused him of sexually assaulting them. Fake news, biased media out to get him you say, well doesn’t that sound just like the excuses of Raniere and his followers.
Any excuse for a retard to bash trump. People don’t follow trump like retards followed raniere. People voted trump because they are sick of whiney liberals. They voted for policy.
The difference is that Trump’s fake news has been proven to be fake, over and over again.
I wasn’t able to find a reply button to a question you asked. Yes, I do have the 10.5 hour video of the NXIVM 9 with Keith. However, I have guided it with my life and have never shown nor given it to anyone. Nor do I plan on putting up on youtube or elsewhere in the foreseeable future. At the beginning of those meetings, Keith asked us to keep our dialog confidential, and WE all agreed. During Susan Dones bankruptcy, NXIVM filed an adversarial lawsuit against her. When they refused to provide any supporting financial documentation to defend their claim of losing money, those related claims were dropped. The remaining claims Susan was able to successfully have dismissed. However, NXIVM was able to get a permanent injunction court order against Susan forbidding her and Kim from ever disseminating, publishing or showing that video to anyone. NXIVM never filed any such claim against me, Susan’s court order only applies to her and not me, and there is no court order forbidding me from showing it to anyone. However, given NXIVM was able to successfully win that argument, I have never shown it to anyone knowing how sue happy they were, especially against me.
I will say this about that 10.5 hour video, it is probably the first time Keith was ever on a hot seat being confronted about HIS ethical breach, abuse of authority power leadership, for his lack of proper protocol, being held accountable for his failures, mistakes and abusive ways. And, it was like an out of body experience for me as I sat there watching him for the first time repeatedly lie, deceive and manipulate the other 8 women into believing I was crazy, blaming me for telling false things, and was the root of the problem. Furthermore, it was the first time I ever saw Keith not composed, calm and in control. His face was beat red, he was sweating at times, angry, fearful, frazzled, speaking nonsense, his neck muscles at times bulging, and he kept gripping his wrist in what I perceived was an attempt to control his blood pressure. Yup, Keith was not in a good way and it was quite a sight to behold. After watching this, I realized that he might be “crazy” and had some serious problems. The NXIVM 9 immediately resigned the day after our last meeting with him. Truly, I don’t think most people have ever seen him this unglued and disturbed.
Smack down comments don’t help anyone! People all have different experiences, different timing for realizations and regrets. Nothing positive is accomplished by demeaning other survivors for not behaving the way you believe they should have. Be kind everyone!
Different people are also blatant liars. NXIVM is too ugly to be kind to everyone.
Some people deserve scrutiny. If someone knew something bad, they need calling out.
I think it is fair to say that one should scrutinize some people, but I believe it would be a better way to not assume someone is guilty, and be curious asking first instead. It depends on what you call bad, as to whether they need calling. What I observe often on this blog is a presumption that if a coach or proctor left NXIVM, that they should now step forward and offer anything they knew, and to apologize or come clean. If someone didn’t know any bad nor done so themselves, I still see them attacked as if they did. Being that I know this topic well, I don’t subscribe to the philosophy that if someone innocent left NXIVM that they now need to man up and make some public statement or go to great lengths to so call make amends to redeem themselves for ever having been involved. I have even read here where if anyone at NXIVM made a commission on enrollments that they should from their own pocket pay everyone back. In my opinion, this is ridiculous. Not only that, during my 9 years involved, 10,000 people came through the doors. It was rare that someone took a 5 or 16 day training and after a couple of days wanted to leave and get a refund. Nor, did I observe people after their training say they got nothing out of it.
For example, I think the attacks against Kristin Kruek are awful, and should stop. I don’t believe Kristin as a part of DOS, that she knew about the inner workings, or participated in wrongdoing. Supposedly she left in 2012 and decided to move on with her life. She further decided to not go public announcing her involvement with NXIVM and speak out publicly about it. Well, I don’t think she needs to do. I hope she is doing well and wish her all the best.
From your comment, I presume that you think Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente knew of crimes committed and ignored things. May I ask that instead of making generalized claims, that you be more specific as it would be easier to address?
As for not paying taxes: Please read my comment to rex2 as he also had an assumption that WE didn’t pay taxes. I reviewed this to the best of my ability and knowledge. Please note, that I was in the inner circle and did NOT know of them not paying taxes, being corrupt on a corrupt level financially, were bringing cash over the border from Mexico or other items. If I didn’t know it, and didn’t hear any other member speak of it either, then I think it is fair to say that MOST members were not aware of these kinds of crimes or tax evasion. I enrolled Mark Vicente in 2004, and then Mark enrolled Sarah Edmondson. I coached, supervised and mentored both. For several years I helped Sarah develop the Vancouver area and assisted in many enrollments with and for her such as: Alison Mack, Kristin Kreuk, Grace Parks and others. During my time with Sarah, I was not aware that she was not declaring commissions earned, nor did I tell her not to. If I could be involved for 9 years and DID pay my taxes, not knowing of anyone NOT paying taxes, then it is very possible that Sarah Edmondson (and maybe Mark Vicente) were not aware of this either. It is unfortunate that this blog and the media have made some very over-wide sweeping generalizations about what WE members did or didn’t know, or what WE participated in. After I left ten years ago, it is possible that they put into place some new gameplan to teach members to not pay taxes, and maybe Sarah and Mark went along with it. Perhaps, you will be able to ask them directly someday – and learn if they, like me, was not aware of this. Now, I will say that after I quit, that Kristin Keeffe informed me in 2015 that many prominent Mexicans were bringing cash over the border on the Bronfman’s plane, and other commercial airlines. I have also heard the rumor that Mark’s mom, Julianna, picked up mail at different PO Boxes. Did she know what was in the envelopes? Did she participate in not paying taxes? I don’t know, but do know that MOST of us were in the dark about many things.
As for ignoring things for years. What specifically do you think was ignored? Yes, there was abuse, punishment, favoritism, issues not being addressed and other things. But, this exists in any relationship, job, company or organization in various degrees. Based on what level you were subjected to it, or if you were in Keith’s inner circle, would determine what you “saw” or “knew.” I would not say I “ignored” these things during my 9 years, but rather, continually addressed, confronted and tried mightifyl to have them resolved. Eventually, like in any relationship, you weight the pros and cons. What I know is this, the more illuminating abuse occurred within a very small group of people in Albany within Keith’s inner circle. Which, I know a lot about having been in it for 9 years. Sadly, the overall community and how things ran also gets over-generalized to the point that the average outsider thinks it was so atrocious, that WE all knew about it, went along with it, did criminal things, etc. But, that is not exactly how it was. This area is a very complicated and lengthy one to articulate, especially in a short message like this. Hopefully, in time with further postings and comments, I will be able to bring about a better, deeper understanding. Until such time, I hope that you might reserve judgment based on the underlying “assumption” of what WE did know or did.
If you could provide questions (not accusations) that are more specific, then I might be better able to answer them more precisely.
I want to point out to everyone that Barbara is most likely telling the truth in regards to her taxes and her knowledge of the inner workings of NXIVM.
Barbara is an intelligent enough individual to be cognizant of the fact that making false public statements at this juncture would be a mistake. Barbara has actually addressed more topics and provided more information, in this comments section, than I was expecting to read in her actual future articles.
I just think she is giving us her time and we should give her the benefit of the doubt. Barbara has nothing to gain by sharing her personal story and information. I was a little skeptical until I read all of the comments she as taken the time to reply to.
She also seems to be fairly articulate so I am actually more excited to read her future articles.
Wow, I don’t think anyone on this blog has ever been so “nice” to me. So, thank you! This will be a short response as I will say “ditto” to everything you articulated so well yourself!
Get a room.
You were involved with the recruitment of Allison Mack, Kristin Kreuk, Grace Park?
Barbara, how can all these people be named in a lawsuit and not know anything? Even to question why they were named?
You left BEFORE the Times Union expose, the pedophile evidence, the police report, Joe’s lawsuit, the Necker Island trip and more.
Allison Mack was named in Joe’s lawsuit and the Times Union expose in 2012, and was on Necker Island. Just 3 years later, she started with DOS.
Tons of people who were not inner-circle or on the striped path said they were told about tax evasion. There was a module about it!
WHEN was the tax evasion module first used? Stop arguing in circles and start to think.
Well Scott thanks to you Barbara hasn’t had time to write an article thanks a lot dude!
I must have been in another Nxium in Clifton Park! The Nxium located at New Karner Road had evening meetings where Keith would regularly discuss not paying taxes and it was discussed in the class modules.
How is it possible that Barbara Mark Vicente Sara Edmondson and all the others didn’t hear this??
I was there and I know what I heard
I also left when I realized early on that there was a complete disconnect between the teachings and the practicesof Nxium
The modules talked of people being paid for labor yet they didn’t pay commission to many people that were enrolling others.
Nxium is and was a SCAM.
Is it true coaches simply put their “earnings” back into NXIVM? They didn’t declare taxes, instead paid for more bullshit?
I am not aware of coaches not declaring earnings and not paying taxes. However, if you read through some of my comments in this post you will find the only areas I heard was Dawn Morrison not filing her tax return because Keith wanted to experiment after watching a Michael Moore documentary where he describes the law technically doesn’t require one to file a tax return. Outside of that, I am not aware of anyone else.
As for coaches putting their “earnings” back into NXIVM, many coaches liked to take trainings, and whatever money they earned, whether it be from NXIVM or other jobs outside of NXIVM they held – they would pay some of that money to pay for a course. Some took loans from NXIVM, or bartered for their courses as well. I believe that many wanted to take courses, or were pressured to do so, and incurred debt in that regard. I often enrolled people in the higher level courses, and have been blamed for doing so. At the time, I firmly believed a certain course might be beneficial for them. What I will say is this, I didn’t observe any coach who took a higher level course be unhappy about having taken it, although they were not happy about the cost. I often argued with Keith to offer discounted rates to coaches, but was continually told it was a bad idea. I figured if you were at a place like Macy’s and get an employee discount – so be true at NXIVM. I was overruled though.
Sure you were there….
……like you would have been in front of Keith right off the bat…please go back to your home under the bridge you friendly troll.
I believe if you read through my comments in this post that you will find answers to all of your questions. If there is a specific question you don’t believe was answered, then let me know.