By Leon Festinger
I was left dumbfounded after reading Sultan’s rebuttal yesterday and needed some time to digest before replying. I know he has said, again, he has stopped reading the blog but I doubt he can do that.
The article containing comments he made years ago shows he can’t stop reading and defending. He has a ‘relationship’ with Kristin Kreuk; albeit it’s probably one-sided and does smack of unhealthy obsession.
“I don’t know what you mean by ‘deeper involvement’. If you mean she was a willful participant in bringing teen girls into NXIVM for the satisfaction of KAR’s [Keith Raniere’s] sexual proclivities, why should I “entertain” these thoughts if I don’t believe them to be congruous with what I know of her character?”
With what he knows of her character? You can’t know someone’s character by watching them on television or reading interviews, or following their social media accounts. That is the face presented to the world and not the true person. Sultan, you don’t know her and neither do I.
I am not saying, absolutely, Kreuk knew what was going on throughout NXIVM, but I am saying you can’t be 100 percent certain she did not. She was part of the organization for a number of years and the person she brought into the group rose to one of the top positions.
To your point about Gina Hutchinson being but one who was mesmerized and greatly influenced by KAR. She was not the only one. What about the successful people who joined, gave in their successful careers and paid for classes until the bank balance was zero and were then indebted to KAR and the gang? That doesn’t appear to be normal behavior.
This is weird. A blurb about the upcoming season of KK’s TV show says there will be embarrassing revelation about KK’s TV character that seems to parallel KK’s real life:
—To make matters worse, the case forces [her character} to confront parts of her personality she would rather keep hidden. “When people attack her privacy, it starts to get into emotional profiling and the darkest parts of your psychodynamics that you don’t want to look at and you don’t want anyone else to see,” Kreuk says.—
Psychodynamics is a term NXIVM frequently used. It is also used in one of Keith Raniere’s biographical snippets where it kind of implies that he is an expert at it.
psychodynamics—sounds like a bit of mind-fuck is still stuck in her head. thanks
That is very weird, indeed.
I was an avid reader of saratogaindecline back when Tighe first started blogging about NXIVM and I remember when he first started writing about KK. Numerous KK fans showed up to defend her, but Sultan was the king of KK apologists. It kinda weirded me out when he started showing up here on Frank Report, and even though he now uses a different moniker, I IMMEDIATELY knew it was the same insanely devoted KK fanatic that had pretty much taken over the comments section on the blog literally responding to every single person who dared to impugn the character of his beloved favorite actress/stalking victim. Nearly a decade later, he’s still cruising the internet looking for forums where people are talking about NXIVM and Kreuk so he can insert himself into the conversation and do his white knighting.
Which reminds me…the Wayback Machine on archive.org only has snapshots of articles from 2011 onward, even though Tighe was talking about NXIVM at LEAST as far back as 2009, if I recall correctly. I think Tighe might have switched blogging platforms at some point, so maybe that’s why those older posts aren’t archived. But then again, it’s possible to send a request to archive.org and they will remove any old websites from the Wayback Machine if you can prove you’re the author and give a good reason.
You’re a good man for trying to reason with the Sultan but unless you want to parry a list of logical fallacies, back and forth you’ll get nowhere, He is Kristin’s ride or die as basic and foolhardy as that.
There is so much about Sultan’s behavior concerning Ms Kruek that raises red flags. His posting in her defense for years and alleged interactions with young girls on the message boards are just two. His devotion and belief she knew nothing about the criminal nature of NXIVM when she held such a high rank and won’t even entertain the idea she played a role shows it is beyond a normal attachment to a celebrity.
I do wonder what will happen once the trial gets underway and NXIVM starts making headlines. KK’s name will again be in the news and she’s going to be asked about her involvement. She isn’t going to be able to fly under the radar then and what will become of Sultan if it turns out she was in the know and was either complicit or decided to stay quiet and try to protect her own reputation.
I do agree arguing with him will do nothing. He’s locked into his point of view.
Ride or die, writing romantic letters to notorious criminals, stalking complete strangers, seemingly all hinging on a fantasy of intimate affinity with the target, i fully agree its concerning, I wonder what Kreuk herself must feel about it? it’s been going on for so long, surely its possible she’s aware of his – devotion ?
to anon 1:21pm; well said and thank you. I will also add that many have come out publicly and privately. Also KK was part of the inner circle she would have known alot more than your average class taker. As a commeter in 2011 pointed out…YELLOW SASH…TWO STRIPES.
Which is one reason I admire Frank and his work. Assuming Frank doesn’t post here as someone else lol.
Anyone posting here under different monickers is a fraud. Be real. Be you. Push your agenda if you desire, but do it as one person with a point. If Sultan is in fact appearing here as others, shame on him. And on anyone else doing the same. There’s enough speculation regarding the trial.
Some people may have to choose a different name for each of their personalities. Who knows why people do what they do?
—Anyone posting here under different monickers is a fraud. Be real. Be you.
LMAO. ‘Be the real you.’ The really, real you.
This is both ironic and true.
To hide behind some or even one alias without fear of retribution allows you to be the real, ugly, cowardly, you.
“Give a man a mask and he’ll become his true self.”
Yet it’s never the real you because you’re not face to face so no one no can know who you really are.
While people criticize Kristin and others who have not spoken out against the cult, I laugh at those who say such “brave” words hiding behind a mask, knowing how those who spoke out were hit with litigation after litigation and often feared for their livelihood and their lives.
More and more I am thinking that the sultan is a member of Nxivm. His comments and posts only do more damage to KK’s reputation than good by his one sided argument. It only serves to bring out the objectivity in others. When called out on his other alias’s, he lies and denies in true Nxivm form (lying for the Nxivm cause is not lying). Besides anonymous and sultan of six he shows up I believe as, SOS, The Judge, Scarrom, So Salty, Karl Basset, Jesse, Seriously, La la Lad, and Wasabi Steak, and some others. Maybe this is Nxivm’s way of getting back at KK for leaving the cult.
Good point. I would also say the same for Shadowstate. He is constantly doing Raniere and Bronfman’s dirty work by always trying to pin everything on Allie Wack. Flowers and her fellow alt left NXIVM people are also constantly defending the feminist Kreuk.
Observer, yes, us “alt- left” people, when not dancing scandalously, can be found attending “spirit cooking” dinner parties, hosted by feminazi’s, where small children and aborted fetuses are served as appetizers. At the stroke of midnight, we all turn into lizard people, and fill our wine glasses with blood.
Care to join us?
Hey tk I thought you said you were done with this site when you told parlato FUCK YOU. Typical alt left lying liberal hypocrite huh. You and flowers are two nuts in the same sack.
No I do not care to join your Satanic evil. Share it with your Luciferian master.
It’s hard to know which posters have assumed many names but it’s clear there are some here who do assume different posting identities to either further their agenda or speak in a more vulgar tone.
Honest, authentic communication is difficult for most people; particularly those on a internet site.
Furthermore, there is the distinct possibility some posters represent Nx factions, the defense or even the prosecution and have an interest in swaying the media, public opinion and ultimately the trial in a favorable direction
I don’t doubt there are Nx factions commenting here. It may be a requirement for some of them! There are also others who are just disrupters.
wrong S P A N T at 12:10 PM
I am not now, nor have I ever been, Sultan
He didn’t say he could be 100% sure she wasn’t involved in criminal activity. Why are you putting words in his mouth?
He said that the people who accuse her can’t be positive of her guilt, but yet they continue to make presumptions about her and continue to drag her name thru the mud, based on unproven assumptions.There is no reliable evidence to even support these accusations that any girls had been recruited into DOS through GBD.
As to his observation that Heidi is behaving in an illogical manner when she condemns Kruek but yet defends other ex-NXIVM members, I would have to agree with him – it is odd that she doesn’t even recognize the hypocrisy of her own actions.
The only trait KK has shown is that she is a fraud. She allows herself to be front and center for Acapella Innovation, College Project and Juicy Peach but not Nxivm. This was back in 2011 before the Times Union series came out. She must have known or at least suspected that there were “nefarious” things occurring. This gave her plausible deniability that she used in her 2018 statement. She might not be so stupid after all.
sk—She must have known or at least suspected that there were “nefarious” things occurring—
Then shouldn’t almost every Espian have known or suspected the same thing? So are they ALL evil or brainwashed or–please explain.
Was every Espian in Nxivm as long as she was, or hold as high a rank, or were they a high level recruiter as she was ?
Compare apples to apples please.
Excellent rebuttal. I concede that I overstated my case.
But my point was that so much info on the nefarious nature of NXIVM and Raniere was available to ALL Espians (long before DOS) so why did they not leave? Because most were not born evil, then a form of us-against-them brainwashing must have been effective in making members avoid, ignore or not believe all that bad press, and keep paying for courses and recruiting others.
This mind-fuck worked on the thousands of small apples, as well as bigger apples like KK, Edmundson, Parlato, etc. who also didn’t understand or believe despite their higher or more involved status. And someone like KK, who was such a valuable recruiting tool would be even more heavily worked on by the cult to keep her in line. I don’t know if Vanguard fucked her, but I am sure she was mind-fucked like crazy by him and Nancy. Of course, maybe KK had such a strong mind and character that she was immune to this treatment, yet eagerly served the evil cult willingly.
When I first heard of NXIVM, I mocked the members as stupid and gullible, then I learned many were smart, and successful who had joined simply to improve themselves, but had somehow been duped into believing ridiculous things. So I now I blame the effective NLP love-bombing more than the brainwashed victims.
Now you’re talking sense, Sultan…etc.!
It’s a true FACT that many well-meaning youngsters and even VIP professionals became ensnarled, by deceptions of all sorts, in this evil web. Some are still stuck — paralyzed in a warm cocoon unaware they are prey.
I’m surprised you didn’t join NX yourself, if Leon’s got it right and you’re not KK “payroll” but just a sincere, if obsessed beyond belief, fan in order to fulfill your own fantasy Anima projection. FANTASY being the key word. (But I suspect Leon’s more Frued than Jung or Kant?)
I think if we all try harder to build any premises around FACTS, some of the fog may lift.
Tell us some, please, Sultan. Were you worried about KK when you started defending her on Saratoga In Decline? Did you call her Dad, really? Do you think if you save her honor in this you still have a chance? Are you a computer programmer or with the NYSE? Were you on Saratoga In Decline when The Rat appeared on October 24, 2010? Did you warn KK’s dad about that? That his daughters life may be in danger? How bout when KK’s name was published? When, in the same thread, you read of Mexican cartels, did you tell anyone about that to protect your princess?
she was named in Joe O’Hara’s lawsuit. She was named in the Times Union articles about her cult leader’s pedophilia. She was part of the Necker Island gang that was planning no good. Most NXIVM people cannot claim that aspergers boy.
Saying the same thing over and over again does not mean a thing. You are just looking to reaffirm that what you believe is true. But the thing is it is still speculation at that. whether she knew of anything or did not or left because of those things. I am waiting for you to spout that she did not leave until later too.. and did not keep “Minimal Contact” like she said she did. But I digress that is believed as a lie even if it was a pr statement told to be said even if she did not know anything or knew of stuff and kept quiet. What would you do in her position?
I know when I have a favorite actor or actress, I try to read and/or watch any interview they give on talk shows or web sites or magazines but I also know they we’re only seeing the face they want to give us. In this day and age, people always have their phones out recording fan encounters, but even then, the “star” realizes that someone is always watching. We can like them and admire them from afar, but we don’t actually know them.
Perhaps Sultan of Six needs to admit that, even privately, then he/she can get on with their lives.
For some people (Sultan? Pea?) fantasy attachment is the most significant attachment they can manage. Real relationships are much too threatening but fantasy soothes and provides comfort as the fantasy world is magical and devoid of hardships, real life communication problems, intimacy and rejection.
There will be always be people attracted to a site like this for those reasons. One can construct a perfect world no one else can puncture.
Double Anonymous – that is a very astute observation and you may have hit the nail on the head. The next question is why does Flowers, of all people, jump to Sultan’s defense at every turn when she has been so quick to cut down and deride so many others posting here.
Excellent points here and your other reply.
Thank you very much.
You’ve solved the case! I am obviously the Sultan (your logical arguments prove this beyond a doubt) and I’m sure you will now be promoted, due to your excellent police work.
Whoever you are and what ever your motive, a simple IP address check from Frank can confirm if you post as another on this site.
I apologize if I was unclear in the comment and led you to think I believe Flowers and Sultan are the same person making comments. I never meant to make that implication. Sultan has a very distinct writing style as do you.
Yes, Anonymous, Frank could do that, if he wanted to….
Festinger- I was being sarcastic. But could you explain your cryptic remarks regarding why I defended Sultans comments? You seemed to imply there was some hidden meaning to it. Lol.
The truth is I was agreeing with his logic, while pointing out the illogic of several others…hardly anything mysterious.
Leon? So what if she defends sultan of six. I have come on here in the past a few months back to defend him against Bigots. I guess with a simply iP check you will see me and her are not the same person. I agree with what sultan of six says here too. You people lack critical thinking. Then use the same logical fallacy about past articles trying to make everything you say true about the person you all are attacking.
Thanks for the defense hmmm but there’s no need. They’ll just say you’re me. These people are toxic. The only person they were right about claiming to be me other than posting anonymously was scarrom when I tried to be nice and rational and no one cared. So I became my real part nice/part asshole personality but still just as rational. Regardless, it was always irrelevant. I was never Jesse, The Judge, Wasabi, or whoever else they named, etc.
Indeed. Explains Sultan’s over zealous defense of what he actually knows little about. Also explains the Shadow’s obsessive hatred over what he actually knows little about.
the Shadow’s obsessive hatred over what he actually knows little about.
NXIVM INSIDER: Crimes, secrets of Allison Mack, Nicki Clyne and other top members of sex-slaver cult
Allison Mack is a narcissist and disgusting human being.
Crimes: Immigration fraud, tax evasion, assault, sexual assault, rape, extortion, fraud, possibly about 10 other things.
What more do I need to know?
Muslims go BOOM! for the chance to get 72 virgin brides with cone shaped mammary glands in “paradise”. Fantasy.
Kristin Kreuk kisses actors on screen and that fantasy is only popular with females and low testosterone males. Read online stupid fans asking if there will be any love scenes in her tax payer funded drivel. That’s what teen girls and losers want to see, FANTASY. Yet, these feminist monsters and beta males shit on family values, throwing out shit like “toxic masculinity” when what they want is the attention of the opposite sex. They don’t have it, so they hide in make belief land. Fantasy.