Suneel Chakravorty has a blog. The domain is Suneel.blog. So it’s easy to remember.
Suneel doesn’t think a friend of his was treated fairly. His friend, a man known by some as one of the top three problem solvers in the world, has been beset by problems he cannot solve.
One of these problems is that he is incarcerated.
Suneel’s problem is to get him freed.
Suneel grew up in South Florida, a first-generation American. His family is from India. He graduated from Harvard College in 2011 with an A.B. in Mathematics and a Language Citation in Mandarin.
He formed a software consulting business that provided software development and instruction to Fortune 100s, financial institutions, and tech companies.
From October 2016 to June 2018, Suneel took Executive Success Programs’ courses, and assisted in classes as a volunteer coach.
After the arrest and conviction of the Executive Success Program’s leader, Suneel became the manager of the legal team of his friend.
He is working to attack the conviction and “expose government corruption in the case of US v. Keith Raniere.”
Suneel would like his friend freed and corruption exposed. He might like to see Executive Success Programs again offer bright young men, such as he, their tools for success.
Whether that will ever happen is a matter of conjecture – with most wieghing in in the negative.
One of the attacks on the conviction Suneel is spearheading is Raniere’s conviction of sex trafficking Nicole.
For this one-time sexual encounter where he was present, and was accused of orchestrating, he was sentenced to 40 years.
He got in total a 120 year sentence.
Suneel has published a story on his blog, in collaboration with another friend, Eduardo Asunsolo.
I am republishing the story and hope to secure some intelligent comments about Suneel and Eduardp’s view and about their friend.
By Eduardo Asunsolo and Suneel Chakravorty
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In US v. Raniere, the government argued that one oral sex act between two women was sex trafficking.
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The alleged victim was a woman in her late twenties, Nicole.
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None of the elements of sex trafficking were met.
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There was no commercial payment.
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There was no proof that the sex act affected interstate commerce.
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Nicole was a member of DOS, which had a two-step, voluntary recruitment process involving collateral. The prosecution called it coercion.
The ‘sex trafficking’ incident involved a consensual act between adults. Nicole was a member of DOS. In joining, she made a ‘lifetime vow of obedience to Allison Mack, who had invited her to DOS.
In May 2016, Allison directed Nicole to go on a walk with Keith and do whatever he wanted, and she went on a walk with him and told him she would do whatever he wanted.
Keith put a blindfold on her and brought her to a house.
Raniere took Nicole to Camila’s townhouse at 120 Victory Way in Knox Woods.
He instructed her to undress and lie on a table, where he tied her wrists and feet. Then, another woman performed oral sex on her.
The woman was Camila. MK10ART’s sketch.
Nicole was laid on this table, nude and blindfolded. Camila entered and performed oral sex on her. Raniere watched. He got 40 years for that incident.
For this oral sex, federal prosecutors charged Keith and Allison with sex trafficking, which carries a minimum 15-year sentence and the possibility of life in prison.
Elements Not Met
Sex trafficking requires a commercial sex act, meaning someone received “something of value” on account of the sex act.
Here, there was no commercial payment. The prosecution said Allison kept her position in DOS by making Keith happy and thus would have access to him, which meant future financial opportunities.
They did not provide evidence that Allison keeping her position in DOS was related to the sex act or anything Nicole did. They did not provide evidence that if Allison lost her position in DOS, she would lose access to Keith.
Allison Mack was Keith Raniere’s partner in the Source.
Separate from DOS, she had access to him because they were business partners in The Source, an acting company.
Finally, the prosecution did not provide evidence of any specific financial opportunities Allison would have access to in the future.
Social Status Is Not Commerical Payment
In short, there was no commercial payment linked to the sex act. The prosecution’s theory makes any sex act potentially commercial because they argued that a social benefit is a commercial payment.
No Interstate Commerce
Interstate commerce must also be affected for a sex act to be sex trafficking. Otherwise, it is not in the jurisdiction of the federal government.
The prosecution’s way of tying the sex act to interstate commerce was that Nicole “took either Amtrak or Greyhound” to Albany that day, and they claimed that “the use of these modes of transportation affects interstate commerce.”
However, their witness, Nicole, testified she was already in Albany the day before.
This explains why the prosecution did not present evidence of an Amtrak or Greyhound trip, like a ticket or credit card statement. Even if Nicole had traveled the day of the sex act, there was no evidence that her travel to Albany was related to the sex act.
She was traveling weekly to Albany during that period, as directed by Allison.
On that particular trip, Nicole did not know beforehand that the oral sex act would happen, nor did Allison.
Also, Nicole testified that she sometimes carpooled from Brooklyn to Albany, not to mention that the trip does not cross any state lines.
Given the importance of the interstate commerce element, it is telling that the prosecution only spent a few sentences on their theory of interstate commerce, and their own witness’s testimony disproved their theory.
No Coercion
Coercion is the final element required for sex trafficking. All three elements have to be met, not just one.
Coercion requires intent and the threat of “serious harm,” meaning that any reasonable person of a similar background in a similar circumstance would comply with the act to avoid the harm.
The prosecution argued that since Nicole was in DOS and had given collateral, there was coercion, and she could not consent.
However, this makes no sense and is contradicted by trial testimony. Nicole was an adult woman.
Before voluntarily giving collateral to learn about DOS, she spent days considering it and exchanged multiple emails with Allison figuring out the appropriate collateral to back her promise of secrecy.
Then, when Nicole learned what DOS was and that it involved a lifetime vow of total obedience to Allison, she was given a chance to join.
Nicole testified at trial that she chose to join because she wanted to be mentored by Allison and to have a group of women support her.
She entered each step voluntarily, with full knowledge of the commitment she was making to Allison. Thus, the collateral cannot be coercion.
Allison Mack with her slaves: Nicole, Michele, India and Danielle.
Furthermore, there was no intent to coerce with collateral. There were two steps to joining DOS, where women learned the most polarizing aspects before choosing to join.
This shows that the intent of DOS was not to coerce. Otherwise, they could have just had one step, and then the person is in for life.
DOS did not intend for the collateral to coerce. It was a surety to back their promise to keep DOS secret, and, if they chose to join, to keep their lifetime commitment.
Finally, there was no serious harm. The prosecution argued the collateral was coercive because Nicole feared it would be released.
Set aside that the collateral was part of a voluntary agreement. No collateral was ever released, nor has any member of DOS claimed someone threatened to release their collateral.
In the trial, there was evidence of women failing or refusing to comply with assignments and no evidence that any DOS member was threatened with releasing their collateral.
If the collateral were released, there would be harm, but there was no evidence the collateral would have been released for failing to comply with an assignment from your DOS “master.”
Allison Mack and Keith Raniere. He was her master and she was Nicole’s master.
Keith Raniere was convicted of sex trafficking and sentenced to 40 years for this one act.
Not only is he innocent of sex trafficking, but this oral sex act being considered sex trafficking is an absurd precedent.
It has watered down the sex trafficking law and given future prosecutors the power to turn consensual sex into sex trafficking.
Authors’ Note: Thank you to Nicki Clyne and Marc Elliot for their editorial review of this article.
Frank Parlato 
Frank Parlato 
Guest View 
Janine Morrison 
J.J. O'Hara 
K.R. Claviger 
Richard Luthmann 
Nicki Clyne 
Marie White 
Paul Serran
Are you out of your mind? What a bizarre endeavor
Also, Alonzo?
Don’t tell me that critical thinking is painful. It’s not.
1. What is human slavery? What does it look like, exactly? Read about real human slavery, how it is practiced, and what all its pieces are.
2. Apply that factual information to the real life context of what DOS members lived. Also include the every day reality of NXIVM, too – be sure to distinguish between the two.
Alonzo? This is bullshit. You just tried to tell me how I ought to be thinking about things.
I call asshole!!!
The women of DOS (except the front line) never knew that Keith Raniere was in any way involved with the
slave ring. Let alone grandmaster and architect.
If the DOS slaves gave a pornographic photo or recording to a female “master” they were told it was to kept fully secured in a private and non viewable location.
Not shared with Keith Raniere. Or any man. In the “women’s only” organization.
That’s why Nicole was so upset when she caught Allison Mack sending nude group slave photos to Keith Raniere in real time.
That sharing of privileged private photos only given for safe keeping among trusted women friends violated every part of their DOS slave agreement.
And it proved the lie. It was never about female empowerment. It was about fulfilling the sexual desires of a man. Keith. It was about fulfilling the very specific desires of control over many women by one particular man. A disgusting old man who just happened to be the shared boyfriend of most (if not all) of the frontline slaves.
Revenge porn is a felony.
You may give someone naked pictures of yourself. But if they distribute those pictures without your consent to anyone else, those who distribute it are guilty of a felony. And if those who receive the naked pictures, without the consent of the subject, share them with someone else, they, too, are guilty of a felony.
Think about this with regard to “collateral”.
Members of DOS say they shared those naked pictures with their “master” willingly, to bolster a personal commitment to improve themselves. The threat of those naked pictures being shared was supposed to overcome any back-off they had for not overcoming the obstacles they needed to reach their goals.
It was a weird and stupid agreement.
But was it really “blackmail” or “extortion”?
No.
Not unless you are an easily impressionable and intimidated jury member who has been prejudiced by FBI-planted evidence of child pornography.
Even the defense attorneys were intimidated by what they were witnessing between the prosecution and the judge in this trial.
No wonder the jury only took 4 hours to return a verdict in a highly complex 6 week RICO trial.
Government show trials are really obscene.
They intimidate everyone, don’t they?
Alanzo
Oh Alonzo! Don’t be silly! Of course a “master” would never release those pictures. Doesn’t mean all that stuff wasn’t out there and created for a purpose and couldn’t be released by someone else.
I think I can see more now how you fell for a cult. You’re actually a pretty trusting individual.
Does your insight enable you to see how I fell for an AntiCult, too?
Because that’s part of the story – not just falling for the cult.
Can your insight grasp that, too?
If so, let me know what you think about both. Maybe you can help me.
Alanzo
I think I might be falling towards some anti-cultism for participating in discussions at the frank report, but you know what, Alonzo? I have personal reasons for being here and personal convictions that I’m willing to defend. I’m really against this human slavery thing. I think its an absolutely terrible idea.
Yes, anti-cultism is all about taking your moral principles, such as being against human slavery, and whipping you up into a moral panic about them with regard to a particular group.
This is done through the use of stereotypes, deleting the real, day-to-day context of what life was actually like in the targeted “cult”, using over-the-top black & white hyperbole such as the term “human slavery” to describe normal every day behavior, and making you feel righteous for attacking these members of minority groups who think and live differently from you.
Even though they used the terms “master” and “slave” there was no actual human slavery going on in DOS, and certainly none in the rest of NXIVM. But anti-cultism makes you believe there was. And that anticult delusion makes you feel like you are fighting for great justice – every day.
You believe you are doing GOOD by persecuting minorities. You are inoculating the society and protecting people from getting sucked in. You are accomplishing this by seeing to it that others are just as upset as you are. The more people whipped up into a moral panic about NXIVM, the better.
So any true and factual information that ratchets DOWN the moral panic is rejected. And any over-the-top nightmare interpretation is adopted and spread to as many people as possible to get them panicking too.
Anticultism is all about the panic – it’s not about the truth if the truth shuts down the panic.
I speak from experience here. What got me out of anticultism was the same thing that got me out of Scientology – questioning the assumptions I’d been given to believe by both, and being willing to go through the discomfort of adopting factual information that questioned my existing beliefs and social standing.
So here are some critical thinking questions for you, My2cents:
1. What is human slavery? What does it look like, exactly? Read about real human slavery, how it is practiced, and what all its pieces are.
2. Apply that factual information to the real life context of what DOS members lived. Also include the every day reality of NXIVM, too – be sure to distinguish between the two.
This process is actually painful. It’s very uncomfortable to question one’s existing beliefs. And there are usually social ramifications for doing this that can make you not want to continue.
When I applied this to Scientology, I knew I would lose all my friends and business contacts and possibly members of my family. And if I spoke out, I would be fair-gamed. It was terrifying – very very unpleasant.
When I appled this to Anti-cultism, I also lost all my friends there, too, and was targeted for fair game.
But that same thing can happen in a marriage and in a job, too. I decided that the truth was more important than my tribe.
So that’s what got me into, and out of Scientology, and into and out of Anti-Cultism.
This takes courage, and you have to be willing to live with the truth as a moral principle. By applying this, you evolve, learn and grow.
At least I did. It hasn’t made me very popular. And I’m fine with that. It was part of the choice I made.
Alanzo
In the newest promo of. “The Vow” season 2 Nancy Salzman says that she beliwves Keith Raniere is guilty.
Her words. Out of Nancy’s own mouth are a more credible view into what a codefendant was thinking.
[…] This is in response to Suneel Chakravorty and Eduardo Asunsolo’s article Three-Fer — No Harm, No Foul, No Sex Trafficking. […]
This time last year, when this information started rolling out on the Frank Report, most of the commenters here were typically dismissive and insulting to anyone who would seriously consider it. If you examined the underlying evidence for the sex trafficking charge, for just one instance, and disagreed that it proved DOS was a sex trafficking organization, you were a brainwashed cult dead ender – even if you’d never taken a course in NXIVM.
For me, I was a brainwashed cult dead ender because I joined Scientology in 1984 and got out and exposed them in 1999. So there ya go: Alanzo considers the evidence lacking for sex trafficking because he was in Scientology 22 years ago!
Say no more.
I’m pleased to see some of the more intelligent commenters becoming more serious in their evaluation of this information. There are even some commenters here imagining the ramifications of this happening in a federal court room now – the ramifications for us all, not just for Keith Raniere.
Of course, there are still retarded dipshits here, such as “Nice Guy” and “Aristotle’s Turd”, who don’t seem to be able to read. Maybe it’s all the tapioca pudding dribbling down their chins. This distracts them and they’re unable to finish one of Frank’s articles on the subject. I guess you’ll have moronic mouth-breathers like these guys in any human group. Oh well.
I’d like to congratulate Frank for his stick-to-it’veness. He’s done an excellent job making these cases under vicious social headwinds.
I hope more people take this seriously. If you look into this case and allow yourself to realize what really happened here, you’ll shit your pants. And it won’t be because you’re retarded.
You’ll shit your pants because you are not retarded.
Alanzo
How on earth is this Alanzo guy calling anyone else dumb? He was in Scientology for 15 years haha…clearly not very bright and a total sucker! Alanzo…please stop pretending you know anything about the law because you don’t. Watching Law & Order SVU and blogging all day does mean you know anything you arrogant fool.
Sincerely,
Actual Attorney
Keep riding Alanzo and they’ll be picking lead out of your liver.
Claviger?
Is that you?
How’s the tapioca?
Alanzo
“This time last year, when this information started rolling out on the Frank Report, most of the commenters here were typically dismissive”.
-Alanzo
It hasn’t been proven the FBI framed Raniere.
It’s Kiper’s opinion. Kiper ain’t god Alonzo.
It isn’t a forgone conclusion!
You sound like Suneel
****
Get your sugar levels checked! I think your diabetes is acting up.
Nice Guy, you write about people with such real understanding and sentiment. That’s what makes your trolling so good.
“Nice Guy” doesn’t like to think of himself as a troll who fills the comments section of the Frank Report with abusive off-topic spam troll shitposting.
He thinks of himself as an artist who inhabits different characters – all for great justice.
While drinking.
Alanzo
Nice Guy is a deliberate character created by an artist. He is dignity distorted, bravery becoming knavery, sanctimoniousness masking sin.
He was a mirror, jeering at the subject it reflected. Yet so muted were the jeers, so delicate the inaccuracies of delineation, that they evaded detection. True and false were blended together. The false was merely an extended shadow of the true.
This is an example of “Nice Guy” apologism to the point of prestidigitation.
Only tribal ninnies, completely wrapped up in ignorance and anticultism, never noticed “Nice Guy’s” cruelty and his “inaccuracies of delineation”.
Everyone else saw it and puked.
Is Nice Guy dead now?
Can we finally speak of him in the past tense?
Alanzo
The best description I heard was from the mother of one of our better-known commenters.
She commented, “Nice Guy looked hot enough but too lazy to do anything but just lie there and smoke.”
—He [Suneel]formed a software consulting business that provided software development and instruction to Fortune 100s, financial institutions, and tech companies.
LMFAO!!!!! If you believe this bullshit- I have a 6ft penis I use as a diving board at pool parties.
Suneel learned so much from Keith.
Like how to lie big!
Can Suneel name one company?
LMao @ Suneel
I bet Suneel is the fourth greatest problem solver in the world.
***
The Frank Report needs hire fact-checker!
Why would Suneel, or anyone else, lie about being a software consultant? It’s not exactly a flex.
Considering his background and education, it seems reasonable.
Suneel and Eduardo?
You guys are assholes.
How dare you minimize these crimes by cherry picking your favored version of the story?
Bet you wouldn’t feel this way if these things had happened to you or God forbid, your daughters.
But you know what? You guys are both getting old and in all likelihood will have a difficult time getting a sane woman to even go on a date with you let alone procreate.
You’re clearly misogynistic and possibly downright evil. You’re also both cowards fully unwilling to put your money where your mouth is.
I’ve said it many times before. If collateral and sex assignments were no big deal, I’d like to see you post a dick/face pic on your linked in profiles. I’d also like proof of you completing a seduction assignment. I won’t go so far as to request you actually be raped but I want photographic proof that you obey my command to strip naked and do whatever else I say for a woman of my choice. I also reserve the right to request daily dick/face pictures to be delivered to me immediately upon request.
Of course I know you are both cowards and will not even bother to acknowledge let alone accept my 90 day challenge.
Come on guys! Just a 90 day challenge. I won’t even ask for damaging information about your family or to own all your assets. Just a few a sexy pictures. No big deal, right?
We could form a “slave pod” of dead-ender males my2cents
Marc Elliot. Suneel.(sigh) Damon. (this is challenging. They are all pretty gross choices for recruits)
They can all get “a symbol of the elements” branded on their scrotum. Then the free labor. Porn on demand. 500 calorie diet. Sleep deprivation. Manscaping. Critiques. Seduction assignments with an old dude. Non stop collateral/new blackmail demands. Group naked photos. Asking permission from their master to eat. etc.
If those dead Enders will truly commit to living the DOS Slave lifestyle for a couple years then it’s fair that we reconsider their point of view.
However for the dead ender man it would still be very different. Because the men would know what they were getting into beforehand. They would have a more fully informed consent. Something the ladies who were made into slaves were never privileged enough to enjoy. So it would be very hard to recreate that level of betrayal and abuse of trust and Power
Suneel‘s penis is like a pap-smear brush. Once it gets inserted….
Women can’t wait till it’s pulled-out.
Isn’t it just the opposite? Women adore him.
It does seem strange that the convicted sex trafficker Maurice Withers, who punched Raniere on Sept 6, has a mere 18 year sentence compared to Raniere’s 40 years. Raniere was charged with one act with an adult, no money exchanged and no crossing of state lines.
About Withers: “On May 5, 2017, after a four-day trial in federal court in Madison, Withers was convicted of nine counts of sex trafficking, including three counts that involved a victim who was a minor. Withers used force and threats of force to coerce women to work as prostitutes for him in Dane and Sauk Counties, in the cities of Madison, Wisconsin Dells, and Baraboo, and also transported three of the victims to Las Vegas to engage in prostitution there for a month.”
OK, as others have said it is up to the judge’s discretion, but still.
Whoa!!
Also odd that he was decidedly responsible for the altercation and released shortly afterward.
Sorry, that should say he was punched on Jul 26, not Sept 6.
Anyway, I got that info from an Albany Times Union article from Sept 21: “NXIVM’s Raniere says fellow sex trafficker punched him in prison.” By Robert Gavin
“It does seem strange that the convicted sex trafficker Maurice Withers, who punched Raniere on Sept 6, has a mere 18 year sentence compared to Raniere’s 40 years.”
It’s called taking the plea bargain.
Good point!
It’s not an isolated Act.
There was the attempted sex trafficking of Jessica.
There are multiple women who were given the seduction assignment and brought to Albany for the purpose of having a coerced and blackmailed sexual encounter completely instigated and designed by Keith.
A man whom the women had never been fully informed was even involved in the alleged women only group.
There are multiple elements proven in court that show a pattern and bolster up the sex trafficking charge.
It is a very common dead Ender tactic to take something out of context and the bigger picture and try to reframe it.
The totality of the evidence shows that they were running a sexual slavery operation.
The dead Enders keep attempting to take one element such as The Branding and reframe it as consensual sorority team building.
Not what it really was (putting a man’s initials on their friend’s vagina and lying about it being a symbol of the elements)
Or in this disgusting essay, deceitfully presenting consenting women having sexy time together as opposed to both women being blackmailed into doing what a creepy guy who ran a sexual slave ring had ordered.
It’s not really for these two dudes to declare that no harm came from the sex trafficking of Nicole.
Nicole did not ever consent to Camilla performing a sex act on her because Nicole never knew who was in the room.
It would be terrifying to be tied to a table and not even know how many people were in the room and what they might do to your naked bound and vulnerable body.
This was not done for Nicole’s pleasure it was done for Keith’s enjoyment.
Nicole talked about being relieved when she realized it was a woman. Between her naked and bound legs
Nicole thought it was less likely she would be raped through intercourse. If the person currently sexually assaulting her was a female. That shows you how little information Nicole had about what was being done to her. But make no mistake Nicole was raped. It also let you know what Nicole State of Mind was during the sexual assault. She was not laying there thinking oh this is amazing she was saying holy s*** who’s in this room when and how are they going to rape me? She was terrified.
If a dude was tied down and then another dude performed oral sex on them against their knowledge or their fully informed consent and expressed will in that moment would it be any different?
Didn’t Keith also record the assault?
This was most likely to be a humiliating and degrading experience to use as further blackmail. Not a gratifying and enjoyable sexual experience for either Camilla or Nicole. The two women did not seek each other out they did not set up a consensual sexual encounter. Both of them were blackmailed and ordered into a planned out and premeditated sex act that Keith orchestrated. To arrange all of this in advance Keith had every intention of Nicole being trafficked to Albany for the purpose of this forced sexual assault. This was not a spontaneous occurrence. Keith needed to make sure Camilla was there he needed to make sure Nicole was there he had to set everything up so the assault played out exactly how Keith wanted.
It’s really sad that this group of former friends to Camilla who knew her entire family and knew Camilla since she was a child in some cases know that this fellow Community member was sexually exploited and groomed from the age of 13 and then sexually abused and posed in explicit pornography as a minor by a much older man with a history of praying on underage girls and this is their response. Who would ever have wanted to be a part of this community? How they treat their own is absolutely stomach turning.
Camilla was kept isolated from her family ordered to find f*** toys slaves and a virgin successor mentally emotionally and physically abused as an undocumented child and young woman who was very vulnerable. Camilla tried to kill herself. Keith destroyed every part of her life. Her health. Her opportunity to get an education. Having a normal childhood. Any kind of version of that possibility of some kind of normalcy and consistent upbringing would have been better than what happened to Camilla in Albany. Keith absolutely imploded her family. Camilla was made to abort his child and then watch her sister have his baby. Keith gave Camilla HPV and damaged her possibilities for successful for fertility in the future. Camilla still struggles with an eating disorder and all the health related problems that brings because she was groomed and mentally tormented about her weight from earliest adolescence.
There’s no defending Keith unless you are a heartless sociopathic cult follower.
These legal arguments are impenetrable. And to prove it, Eduardo has a sworn affidavit stating that keith’s penis is in fact 3/4” longer than Robbie’s.
Make no mistake: the FR is advocating for the release of convicted racketeer and sex trafficker Raniere.
Going back to a FR story from Nov. 8, I found this little gem, endorsing The Free Raniere Club’s mission:
“The vacating of Raniere’s conviction and hence most likely new trial is, in my mind, the proper remedy for government cheating“
By repeatedly publishing the “views” of cult loyalist Chakravorty, often (as above) without commentary, the FR is taking his side.
Chakravorty’s little essays, that we have heard repeated ad infinitum now, are not some objective alternative viewpoint. They are propaganda pieces full of outright lies.
The DOJ’s case for sex trafficking did not depend on that one incident. That’s a lie that Chakravorty continually repeats and the FR repeatedly trumpets. In the course of Raniere’s month long trial the prosecution established a pattern of Raniere’s trafficking. The entire DOS organization was a sex trafficking operation. Young women, often aspiring actresses, were recruited, lied to, blackmailed, then coerced and threatened into various sexual acts for Raniere’s pleasure.
Raniere headed this sex trafficking organization. He held the purse strings: e-mails introduced in court showed Mack had her paychecks withheld until one of her slaves delivered for Raniere. It was a commercial operation.
Chakravorty simply lies about this. And the FR publishes that lie. Without comment. And not for the first time.
None of this can be called an “inquiry” or an open-minded search for the truth. Not when it’s based on repeated misstatements of simple fact.
Maybe this is meant in the spirit of having a little fun. Stir up a controversy, generate a little heat. I get that. Be provocative.
I find it scurrilous and dishonest. Sorry.
Raniere ain’t getting out of prison. Frank and the rest of the Free Raniere Club are spitting into the wind. Chakravorty’s crazy, evidence free allegations of tampering, like his other lies and delusions, carry no weight whatsoever. Nor, to be brutally honest, does the FR.
The New York Times ain’t picking up this one. Raniere’s fate rests with rational people, Federal judges, not some three dozen conspiracy-minded denizens of the Internet.
So according to Nicole’s testimony, Allison was surprised about the incident at the townhouse? Which likely means that Allison didn’t plan it or know about it in advance.
Nicole continued working for The Source and communicating with Allison after leaving DOS? So she was allowed to leave, her collateral wasn’t released, and she maintained a friendship and paid employment with Allison after leaving? And per a letter posted to Michelle H’s blog, Nicole wanted to introduce Allison to her brother during an upcoming pride festival?
This, after the townhouse incident?
How did anyone know about Nicole’s “kinks?” Was this a planned game for Nicole, per a fantasy that Nicole had and wanted to carry out (per Michelle’s blog post)? Or are they making up the thing about Nicole being kinky and wanting to act out a fantasy, and Nicole was legitimately scared out of her mind when they blindfolded her and tied her up?
What evidence is either side bringing to the table to support their respective claims?
The claim about Allison “selling” India to Keith in exchange for money owed for Allison’s work in The Source…is there actually an e-mail where this exchange is clear and easy to read, or is this a rumor that’s been exaggerated?
The e-mail I saw had Allison asking for payment, and promising to work with Clare to streamline the payment process going forward. India wasn’t mentioned once.
Did Allison actually do these things, or did the women sell her out for a payday and immunity from prosecution?
What was her motive? Why would she have done this? Money doesn’t work in this case, because she could have done voice work or acting work that would have more than paid her bills.
Did any of the DOS women ever release collateral, or threaten to? Other than the defector, who also committed marriage fraud on the side? Funny how Nicki gets a ton of heat for a “sham marriage,” but no one blinks an eye at a sham marriage that a defector was given immunity for. My my, holy double standards, batman.
If they were committing crimes, why did they film and record everything they ever did?
If KR is the most violent predator in America since Charles Manson, why did it take a NYT article to bring him to the US Government’s attention? And three decades after he was linked to accusations of hurting girls in upstate NY?
So a blogger named John Tigue (sp?) knew who KR was, knew what ESP was up to, and covered it extensively until he ran into legal issues, but no one else in media or Government had a clue? Despite KR running an MLM in the state capital after having settled with NYS not to ever operate an MLM again after Consumers Buyline was shut down?
Why aren’t there answers to these questions? If there are, please point me in the direction where I can find them.
Doesn’t anyone else find it hilariously ironic that the deadenders imply that naked photographic images containing child porn effectively coerced the other defendants into taking plea deals and got their leader convicted, while with the other side of their mouths, they claim that naked photographs and other “collateral” was not coercive?
Very good point!
So hear about the podcast Serial that led to release of Adnan Syed based on new evidence and failure of prosecution to provide evidence? Sounds somewhat related to Raniere. Where that podcast came out in 2014. He just now got released in 2022. That is how long it can take and that is actually kind of fast as crazy as that sounds. A quote that matters, “…substantial and significant probability that the result would have been different” with the additional evidence. That ultimately is the problem here – Raniere and his pedo lovers are presenting nothing that meets that standard because of all the other charges.
If by some miracle they toss the pedo charges, they do not impact the whole substantially. Frank has tried to make the argument that it could with his domino argument of the pedo charges resulted in everyone else abandoning ship for reduced charges, which resulted in less lawyers working the case, as a result Raniere’s defense missed important details like the camera card. The court doesn’t care about the what if’s prior to the case, just what could have happened during the case. His domino effect is irrelevant. The evidence also doesn’t support a “fruit of the poisonous tree” argument because tossing the one doesn’t result in tossing the other because they are not tied together. Even Frank’s own timeline supports this. The case was built before the pedo pics where found, they just added a cherry on top of the case.
Raniere should fight, he has nothing to lose in the effort so why not. But its his fight, not theirs. These three and others essentially putting their lives on hold just to fight with him, just in case he is freed and they think things would magically return to how they were. Its so sad.
And yeah I am ignoring their little theories. Cause none of them matters. Everything they brought up was the defense’s job. They either did it during the trial or they didn’t but failure to come up with explanations is what the trial is for. Coming up with new explanations later for existing evidence or testimony is meaningless without new evidence that is “substantial and significant”.
But how can the defense do their job when the evidence was NOT provided until the beginning of the trail?
They could delay the trial. But Keith the defendant wanted the trial to take place as quickly as possible.
This was a well written summary by Suneel.
Frank, was the ‘interstate commerce” element really defined by Nicole taking Amtrak or Greyhound to Albany?
I have a hard time believing that the government would be able to ‘stretch’ the RICO elements so thinly, and so absurdly, using such mental gymnastics.
If Moira Penza really did that to get a conviction, then her lawyering skills aren’t what got Keith convicted. If that really happened, she simply found a jury too fucken stupid — or too left-wing — to interpret facts like adults.
Surely, that could not have been what the government relied on for “interstate commerce”, right?
Tell me there was something else, Frank. If not, I’m officially losing faith in our government.
What the fuck is happening here? I’m a man in need of facts.
I disagree about the ‘coercion’ argument though, because if Suneel’s theory is correct (i.e., that once collateral is given voluntarily to make a lifetime commitment, that person is now obligated for life not to break it) —- then such a choice can never be reversed under the implied threat of collateral being released, which would allow people to become slaves for life due to a single hasty decision they made.
A person cannot be bound for life under threat of collateral being released —- there must be a way for them to reverse that decision (officially) within DOS, without the implied threat of collateral being released.
Suneel is arguing that a lifetime commitment is valid for life, if made voluntarily.
But… Even simple contracts in business are often ruled ‘invalid’ —- if they violate the ‘unconscionability’ principle of law.
https://ezerwilliamsonlaw.com/examples-of-unconscionable-contract-terms/
A lifetime of ‘slavery’ cannot be imposed on somebody just because a person gave up collateral without knowing the full extent of sexual escapades they might be asked to do.
I realize that Suneel isn’t arguing this was a contract — but I’m merely pointing out the absurdity of the logic he’s using.
What if Keith had asked Nicole to run head first into a tree? Would she have had to do it, as part of honoring her lifetime commitment to DOS?
Suneel’s argument isn’t realistic there. Coercion existed IMO.
there was ‘running head first into trees’, as well as puddle drinking and beating each other up? Badass training.
Yes the sum total of the interstate commerce was that Nicole took either a train or bus to Albany.
The prosecution successfully persuaded the judge to give a non-pattern jury instruction on the sex trafficking – sort of making a new law, or new precedent. That concerned the definition of commercial sex. That no money had to change hands. It was enough if Allison Mack got a social benefit.
As for coercion I agree that collateral was coercion. But without the two elements of interstate commerce and commercial sex, I do not think it was sex trafficking. It might have been extortion. Maybe blackmail. I do not think it warranted 40 years on its own.
Agree
That is not actually the sum total of that charge. The blackmail and coercion is a very big part of it. At the point that female slaves had Financial legal pornographic highly damaging to their careers and devastatingly damaging to their families catastrophic and life ruining blackmail that would be released if they did not obey their masters orders it changed everything. Nicole got on a bus or a train or in a car and came to Albany at the orders of her master with the threat of that blackmail released hanging over her head every single day every hour and every minute of each and every decision that she made. It was always more of a decision than a choice because it wasn’t really a choice once they were blackmailed. Their choices became limited and weighed against other horrible possible outcomes.. Allison did ask for money and Keith replied that she would be paid when India was delivered to him naked and through his orders. There’s plenty to uphold these charges. What wouldn’t you do to protect your own family? Nicole talks about how her family and how everything that would be nightmarish for them if she tried to get out of the slave ring would unfold colored all of her forced actions to comply up to a point. Obviously most people wouldn’t ever provide information that would be so detrimental to their family. But that’s a mistake Nicole made trusting Allison and trusting the other people in this cult. And it was a not fully informed choice because she was told that no man were involved whatsoever. At the point that she initially opted in she believed them that it was a women only organization. If she had been told from the start look you’re not really taking orders from Allison you’re taking orders from Keith and he’s getting off on all your naked photos Etc Nicole would have chosen differently initially. Nicole was deceived by though she trusted the most at the time.
Just wanted to add something…
Although I disagree with Suneel over the issue of collateral being coercive, I agree with him 100% that Nicole did not feel coerced on the night when she had oral sex performed on her by Camila.
On that particular night, Nicole agreed simply to please her female master and to gain social status within the group.
She was motivated by pleasing the other girls in DOS —- so that she would be accepted by the other DOS women. I think her need to ‘belong’ is what motivated her (not fear of collateral being released).
If she felt coerced on that particular night, she’d have at least said something in her communications with her female master. Did she say anything to indicate she felt coerced?
She did not say anything. But she did tell Mack about it. Mack seemed surprised, Nicole testified.
Nicole had sex relations with Raniere after this “sex trafficking” event. She emailed him asking him to make her into a “sex goddess.” But she had given a lot of collateral.
After she left DOS, she continued to contact Eduardo and Allison and participate in the Source.
Phenomenal and received 400k for her pleasures, whilst still asking Allison for help!
I also believe black mail should be the only charge and if that got him 40 years he’d be out at 100 years old.
Seems fair without the government setting new presidents for Rico that have huge implications for freedom and specifically punishing the one who deserves it.
The Retard Wrote: “If that really happened, she simply found a jury too fucken stupid — or too left-wing — to interpret facts like adults.”
I believe the jury had a lot of typically shit-for-brains right wing folks on it. As I recall, the gov’t seemed to want right wingers who’d be horrified by KR’s penchant for using abortion as birth control.
It’s a dangerous precedent if these are the new guidelines for sex trafficking.
And it seems like the government is embracing it. We’re any of these points brought up and clearly stated during the trial?
The government seems proud of this new precedent based on what they said when they gave out awards.
“DOS did not intend for the collateral to coerce. It was a surety to back their promise to keep DOS secret, and, if they chose to join, to keep their lifetime commitment.”
This is coercion… “surety”- this is the threat. If someone were truly committed why take collateral? And why continue to demand collateral – of the most damaging kind, if not to instill fear and threat of release.
Nothing needed to be said. Collecting and securing collateral is enough- how would it help them keep their commitment to DOS by having it? It’s because there is the inherent threat that it could be used against them in any capacity.
You should stick to your first two points. The third criteria the prosecution has- you need all three anyway. Don’t undermine your credibility by suggesting the third is also not a viable charge.
Let me start with saying that 40 years is an excessive sentence if it is only based on this single incident. However, Nicole was not the only woman abused by Keith. India was abused many, many times (directed by Alison) and Sylvie once I believe (directed by Monica Duran). There may not have been the “interstate travel” element in these cases, so Keith couldn’t be charged with sex trafficking here, but repugnant behavior by Keith, Allison and Monica it definitely is.
I disagree with Suneel and Eduardo on all points in regard to what happened to Nicole. To say that there was no coercion because Nicole could not have feared her collateral would be released is ridiculous. The coercion element of sex trafficking count is clearly met.
Another element for sex trafficking is that something of value has to be exchanged. Remember the e-mail/whatsapp from Allison to Keith where she almost begs him to give Claire the green light to pay her for her work in the Source because she is broke and can’t pay her bills. Allison entered NXIVM as a multi-millionaire. Keith took all her money and now she is in a position she literally begs Keith to get payed for her work. She has to please Keith to get payed. This is one reason she directed India and Nicole for sex with Keith. Another is it would improve her position within the organization if she pleases Keith. So “something of value” was exchanged. In sex trafficking convictions this element doesn’t need much evidence: the slightest transfer of value is enough.
The interstate element is also met. She came from another state for this sex-act. It doesn’t have to be on the same day the sex-act and the traveling took place. Nor does the sex-act has to be the only reason she travelled.
Keith is not innocent of sex-trafficking nor is it absurd he got convicted for what he did to Nicole. But 40 years is excessive. Garaufis got carried away here in his dislike of Raniere.
— But 40 years is excessive.
He ruled within the bounds of the law so there was nothing legally improper done here. That cannot be excessive by definition unless the law is changed. I think it’s obvious why he ruled that way — he projected Raniere’s future behavior from his history and made a judgement call (he’s a judge after all) that he wasn’t going to stop, and it was only going to get worse for others. People like to claim that ethics and the law aren’t the same. While technically true, it’s digressive in principle. The law is an enforcement of the “umbrella” ethics of a society. People living in it can have more rigorous ethical standards within it, but they cannot have a looser one as Raniere did, and that is why he is generally also seen as a morally repugnant individual.
Mighty Van Halen, you’re right, too!
Brooklyn to upstate NY IS NOT another state. They are both NY.
StevenJ, I so totally agree with you.
These three continue to frame everything in terms of legalese. As if Raniere is somehow freed would resolve any wrong. They continue to just not get that what is legally wrong and morally wrong are not always the same thing. You can feel Raniere was railroaded by the system and still find him to be a repugnant human being. That isn’t the approach they are taking. They feel he was railroaded and is a glorious human doing nothing but awesome things for everyone, especially women. The moral dissonance is astonishing.
Their argument is basically “yes he beat his wife regularly but she must have wanted it because she never pressed charges so nothing wrong was done.” That is moral argument they are essentially making and completely oblivious they are making it.
Typical with hero worshipping but the lengths of it as keep seeing it throughout society is actually depressing for it means no moral lines exist for people like these. If their hero, be it Raniere or someone else, were to get on live TV and start biting off the heads of babies, their first response would be “wonder what they did to deserve that”.
“They feel he was railroaded and is a glorious human doing nothing but awesome things for everyone, especially women. The moral dissonance is astonishing.”
Excellent summary of the deadenders position by Erasend.
When you look at the legal arguments here, why do you focus on the “deadenders”?
Attacking Nicki Clyne for a legal argument is not the same as attacking Kiper, or other experts, who are submitting their expertise to courts, or who are in court arguing for appeal.
Why don’t you ignore the people who are not legal experts and instead focus on the people who are?
I know why.
You’d rather attack non-experts than those with power.
Punching Down is such a shitty way to live.
Don’t you think?
Alanzo
Convicted by a jury of his peers…who had ALL the evidence.