Suzanne and Kevin continue their debate on Keith Raniere, his remaining followers and the whistleblowers, former NXIVM high rank, Sarah Edmondson and Mark Vicente. Here is Suzanne’s latest.
You said you didn’t know anybody in Nxivm, except for Allison Mack, and you knew her tangentially from your work on the set of Smallville, many years ago. You’ve emphatically stated that you’ve never met Sarah Edmondson.
And that you didn’t know any of the other NXIVM people.
How then are you privy to a private conversation between Edmondson and Nicki Clyne’s mom?
Daniela and Lauren
Daniela seems to understand how badly Keith Raniere abused Lauren Salzman. She wrote for leniency at Lauren’s sentencing. It seems logical that Daniella should decide about Lauren.
Not weighing in on a personal opinion here about Lauren. Which is exactly the point. If Lauren was one of Daniela’s primary abusers, it seems that it would be more up to Daniella to decide.
Definitely not left to Kevin to decide LOL!
DOS Was Keith’s Creation – Not the Women
DOS was not a democracy, Keith said it himself.
The entire front-line slaves were there when he said [as heard in an audio used as evidence], and none of the front-line slaves disagreed with his statement.
All the recordings and emails show the front-line taking direction from Keith. It probably made some women feel a little better to fool themselves that this was all an idea they helped create, but it’s not their initials branded on anyone’s vagina. It’s Keith’s only.
The structure and organization ultimately benefited Keith.
It is true that Keith’s devoted slave women, such as Nicki, helped create DOS. Without all of them tricking their friends into DOS, giving blackmail (and then more and more), ordering seduction assignments, and graphic pornography that the mini masters knew was going to Keith, the organization wouldn’t have worked.
None of the slaves the front line recruited would have directly taken Keith’s orders or put that kind of trust in Keith, nor would they have wanted to do so.
The front line slaves were no different than the most trusted hookers in a pimp’s stable. Pimps use women to recruit other girls. Often younger girls. Those younger females would not respond directly to some man approaching them and saying, “hey, go have sex with people and give me most of the money”.
So pimps send women out to meet vulnerable girls, befriend them, and bring them into the pimp’s orbit.
In that sense, the front line was integral. But ultimately, they had nothing to do with the creation, because the very purpose of the DOS slavery was to benefit Keith.
He created DOS for that purpose.
Once a Pedo….
Dear Kevin – pedophiles do not change. Even with intense counseling and every possible therapeutic and law enforcement support, there is a high reoffending rate.
If you believe Keith was molesting girls back then, and he had absolutely no oversight with a law enforcement agency or specific targeted therapy and monitoring, which we know Keith did not.
The chance of Keith continuing to sexually exploit children is 100%.
All of that gives extreme weight to Camilla’s first person, consistent account of the sexual abuse she suffered from childhood at the hands of Keith.
Additionally, there is corroborating evidence. There are other witnesses who confirmed Camilla’s story under oath on the stand.
Kevin, for you to accept the reality of the older allegations of child rape that were beyond the statue of limitations but are unwilling to accept that Keith sexually exploited Camila, a 15 year old child and created pornography of her is illogical, irresponsible and tragically biased.
It is almost impossible for an active child predator to rehabilitate themselves magically.
“Lived in a room”
To say that Daniela “lived in a room” is a very disingenuous way of explaining what happened to her.
She didn’t have papers; she was in a foreign country illegally. She had no money. No connections outside this insular NXIVM community.
Perhaps, Kevin, you are too entitled and privileged to understand how vulnerable a person in those circumstances can be.
And Daniela was in the room at the direction of a man who had complete power and control in the community. This man was also her sexual partner, and both of her sisters were also enmeshed with him.
Two of these relationships were completely secret to pretty much everyone else. Certainly Danielle’s family was kept in the dark.
Daniela begged and pleaded to be released from the room, and this abusive senseless obligation to fulfill an ever moving target to be accepted back into outside life of the community.
First, it was an alleged ethical breach. For kissing another man. Even though that information was kept from all the integral parties to Daniella’s confinement.
Then it was an asinine book report. Next, it was coming up with this heal the breach plan and the right apology. Then it was because she cut her hair.
There is extensive documentation that Daniella suffered a critical mental crisis. Daniella was denied medical and for a long time dental care.
Calling it living in a room is f****** ridiculous and a lie.
When Keith inevitably exhausts all his appeals, all to no avail, I would love it if Moira Penzza wrote a book about the case.
She could do a lot of the legal aspects, with some interpersonal and other juicy nuggets thrown in.
But Moira could also pair with some other experts. Or even some of the main players.
Would love to see Camilla and Moira Penza pair up and write a compelling book from two extremely different Insider perspectives.
There’s so much more information that wasn’t used in the criminal trial or hasn’t been shared with the public in an easily accessible format or otherwise.
The more the dead-enders accuse people such as Moira of unfounded and crazy conspiracies, the more they are pushing people in law enforcement to come out hard refuting and dispelling all these insane notions.
So keep it up dead-enders. Can’t want to read that book!
Kevin, you’ve repeated that same bad fan mail story multiple times. It’s irrelevant to anything that’s being discussed here about a criminal case.
I am not sure why you think it is worth bringing to a conversation about Keith and the cult?
MK10ART: the branding table.Branding someone with unwanted initials of your boyfriend is violent. Blackmailing women into unwanted sexual contact is violent. Bare ass paddling for punishment while Keith pervs out watching is violent. Child rape is violent.
Good for you that you have a little bit of a boundary about hurting people. That’s pretty much the bare minimum expected from humans towards other humans. No violence. So hooray for you?
Here’s a virtual cookie. Yum yum.
But Kevin, you do not treat people respectfully. It’s “do as I say, not as I do”.
You repeatedly said you wanted to defecate in Sarah’s mug. You said horrible things about Sarah’s ability to parent her young children. You justify that Kevin, because you feel negative emotions strongly about Sarah. There might be people on this blog who have strong feelings against the people you champion. If you’re going to resort to that kind of behavior Kevin and set such an awful example, no one’s going to heed your chiding advice.