Here is a guest view by an individual, anonymous to me and to readers of Frank Report, who calls him or herself, Alanzo.
Alanzo professes admiration for Nicki Clyne and might indeed by an admirer of Keith Alan Raniere. One thing of interest about Alanzo is that he or she refers to cultists and anti-cultists, rather more or less accepting the term “cult” for NXIVM and for Nicki and him or herself. I do not think Nicki accepts or agrees that NXIVM is a cult.
In my brief interactions with Nicki, I found her reasoning for supporting Keith Raniere rational and sound – from her own experience in her own life and for her own purposes.
Nicki is very smart, incredibly articulate, and her very own person.
These things are easy for me to respect.
We disagree on a few things, especially regarding how far Raniere should be fought for, but we agree on way more than we disagree. She has her own very real and true reasons for supporting Raniere from her own experience in her own life.
And from what she’s told me, I agree with her stance – for her.
Where we agree the most is that mainstream society is incredibly shallow and materialistic, and dumb.
People like Nicki, and me, sought alternatives to North American mainstream society’s milquetoast pabulum. We found the social courage to branch out and find alternatives that worked for us, for a while, and for as long as it worked. Then we graduated and moved on.
We’re not embarrassed, we’re not apologetic, and we’re not shameful or guilty for having the courage to try to live the best life we can with the one shot we have.
This is what anti-cultists don’t understand about former and existing cult members: They’re usually smarter, more courageous and more independent thinkers than anti-cultists are. And they value life enough to risk the humiliation the mainstream shames them with to create a better culture with better values. Most “brainwashed cultists” have the courage and the intelligence, and independence of thought, to create a better world than an anti-cultist ever could.
Most Anti-cultists, especially most pinheaded never-ins, don’t have the intelligence, or the courage, to do any of this. Most anti-cultists have never been challenged enough to question their own worldviews, or examine their own assumptions. They figure so many believe as they do – it must be true.
Their Torquemadan Certainty® fuels their shaming of cultists and ex-cultists in their onslaught to create uniformity of thought and conformity of belief – exactly the thing they accuse ‘cults’ of..
Socially coercive “brainwashing” techniques don’t just exist in “cults” – Anti-Cultists employ them all the time.
Social coercion to create uniformity of belief seems to be hard-wired into all homo sapiens as a tribal species..
This is my position on Nicki Clyne:
Nicki Clyne is a great person. She has more courage and more intelligence than 200 pinheaded anti-cultists who try – every day – to tear her down.
Link to DOS members debunking brain washing on Alonzo’s blog.
“…You will get sleepy, very sleepy, your eyelids will feel very heavy, on the count of 10 seconds into this tripe you will be in a deep state of sleep where there will be no Keith Raniere, no NXIVM, no DOS, no child molestations, no rape, no genital branding, no psychotic breakdowns, no suicides, no multiple abortions, no poisonings, no untreated cancers, no false imprisonments, no kiddie porn pics, no immigration fraud, no racketeering, no money laundering, no blackmail, no harm, no victims, no apologies, no regrets, just a blissful state of complete unconsciousness, zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…”
I don’t know why this is presented as some win for Alanzo and the remaining deadenders. The courts don’t accept brainwashing which is used as an EXCUSE anyway. These people are all in, and not only do they accept their choice to support NXIVM and its leader who is a statutory rapist, sex-addicted, unethical, conniving, racketeering, and convicted criminal, they continue to wallow in it. They’re converted and conditioned. NXIVM couldn’t engage in brainwashing since it doesn’t exist—at least in the mythical sense of creating Pavlovian robots—but they certainly engaged in conditioning and coercive control techniques, as well as simply inducing of fear.
Were Alisson Mack and Nicki Clyne marked with Keith Ranieri’s initials?
Alisson Mack was so beautiful, but in the photo with Nicki she is very ugly, too thin. Didn’t she realize what the diet imposed by the sect master was doing to her?
—Were Allison Mack and Nicki Clyne marked with Keith Raniere’s initials?
Yes, they are both branded.
Any FRers got any inside info on Flynn?
Did Nicki Clyne give the arrest film of KR to Frank? She is the most likely candidate. There are only 4 possibilities and it appears fairly certain that Nicki is filming the arrest. Also, very odd that Nicki is the one responsible for Raniere’s arrest by taking photos of herself and posting them online. Just how loyal is Nicki Clyne and who gave that arrest film to Frank?????
Sure new record by simply baiting the audience with “ most of you are dumb” ….of course you”ll get a bite on that kind of bait!
Are you trying to say we are all dumb?
Are you saying we’re all dumb and we took the bait?
Cuz you clicked on the exact same link.
Who’s dumber: the morons that click on a link because they enjoy reading about cultist celebrities, or the moron that hates the Frank Report, clicked on a link, and posted a SNARKY comment?
At least we are all having fun…
…You should run along to PornHub.com or WokeAsshole.com. Either way, you’ll be around assholes [redacted] like you.
I’m so stupid, I don’t know if you’re implying, we’re all dumb.
I am just wondering, do you still have a clit-ring?
I bid you a good-day! 🙂
Alanzo = 103 comments (possibly a new FR record)!
This is not a record. Check it out. Statistics are readily traceable.
Not bad, but not record-breaking at Frank’s place.
That is a lot of comments…but only lately. Back in the day (a couple years ago) posts on sex and Kristin Kreuk often got triple digit comments. But she’s old news and her charms have faded and few want to have “online sex” with her anymore.
Shut up, Niceguy.
Anonymous 6:00 am-
“Shut up Nice Guy.”
..As God is my witness, that individual is not me.
It’s definitely written like something I’d write. I believe I would come up with something a lot more humorous but, as of late, I’ve been off-my-game.
Ask Frank — it’s not me!
Have a great Memorial Day! Mine is probably gonna be boring as crap.
–.As God is my witness, that individual is not me–
As God is my witness, that comment was written by me, Kristin Laura Kreuk, because I wanted to downplay my beauty as I have gotten too old to be a masturbatory fantasy even for middle-aged adolescents. Now I want people to admire me only for my acting.
What an incel tard. LOL.
Ain’t me guys!
We even beat India Oxenberg’s naked yoga photos.
Here’s a recent tweet I placed in a Tweet thread of Nicki’s:
“Keith Raniere is not innocent of everything tho. He is a sex addict and the unrestricted power he maintained allowed his human depravities to destroy everything everyone else had built for him.’
“Cult leaders go crazy for a reason.”
Nicki contacted me back-channel on Twitter about this, asking if I really believed it. I answered yes, and told her why.
She called me. What followed was a very rational, intelligent and tolerant discussion of her experiences and mine – why she believed what she believed, and why I believed as I do. She made a lot of sense for her underlying reasons for why she believed as she does.
I still believe what I wrote in that tweet. But now I also have the perspective of a person who has first hand experience I don’t have.
I remain open to Nicki’s experience, and she remains open to my reasoning.
All my interactions with Nicki have had this same rational, tolerant and kind quality. I’m not the only one to have experienced this kind of behavior from Nicki Clyne.
It’s why I wrote this comment that Frank has now turned into a post on his blog.
The most compassionate words I can muster in support of Nicki Clyne, and this goes for most of the Vancouver crowd, is:
She’s an A-C-T-O-R, or ACTRESS if you prefer.
Not to generalize but in my long experience among show biz types, actors are not big on independent-mindedness.
In fact, actors are trained and paid to precisely follow direction, precisely follow the script, stay “in character,” follow their blocking or choreography, hit their mark and speak the speech trippingly on the tongue.
In fact, any actor with a mind of their own, with any bright ideas on anything from their character’s hairstyle to (egads) script improvements, would last on a Hollywood set about 5 minutes. (Unless, maybe, he or she is an A-list Star with a lot of bank and a few superpower agents.)
It is all in the name of “suspending disbelief,” creating an illusion of reality that the audience buys into hook, line and sinker.
I’ve said this before and so once more (at least); actors are often in danger of self-destructive (substance abuse, suicide) cognitive dissonance bc they can get caught up in character roles that clash with their core, unconscious beliefs and values.
This is part of what led to my sister’s suicide and, if you believe Keith Raniere, Kristin Keefe, Gina’s friends, the evidence from her journal and at the suicide scene – it was all done by design at Keith’s direction specifically to coerce Gina into killing herself – down to Keith selecting the means and method, setting the scene, by which Gina would become a sacrificial martyr.
Nicki is now embracing an extremist (aka terrorist or cult) movement under Scott Adams, entirely contrary in every way to the alleged DOS mission, which includes a strong anti-Trump, anti-pedophile (aka hebofile, whatever) message, despite as we now know the fact that her avowed guru, whose monogram she bears upon her puss, is a convicted, imprisoned child molester.
In a further cognitive dissonance twist, the armed and dangerous segment of the far-right movement stands ready to mass murder all pedophiles and other persons of questionable perversions including same-sex couples such as Nicki and Allison.
Nicki’s Twitter ramblings are, IMO, heartbreaking signs of the same kind of real cognitive dissonance my sister, Kris Snyder and so many others brought to the brink of self-destruction through years, often decades, of mental torment by NXIVM, experienced.
Yes, it angers me that Keith’s ass is not (safely) buried in a supermax where he can’t continue mind messing with his nymphs like Nicki. (Adams, btw, you, Alanzo and Parlato might wanna tap Stone for security if you plan on bomphing Nicki while she’s now, allegedly, visiting Keith in prison.)
But the show must go on and on until every last mouth is Bronfman fed or silenced, I suppose. Sigh.
“Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.”
It is great that Nicki has found power and a resolution in her life. The Dossier Project seems to want to promote female empowerment and agency. While I love empowerment and agency, they don’t seem willing to acknowledge the violations and crimes that the group and man they are doubling down on did. What would be really impressive is that they would be able to find the humility to acknowledge and understand the suffering their ’empowerment’ brought others and have a less local and more global understanding and sense of responsibility of the impact of their actions. It frustrates me to no end they have dug their heels in without acknowledging the criminal abuses of power and trauma that were part of their own program.
Well said, Kate
Pure horse manure. And I know my shit.
Yawn. Crikey. Try again.
Agreed, Kate. The path forward requires humility, a trait aspired when directed towards Dear Leader/Dear Breeder, not so much directed elsewhere.
I completely agree. But I think the Dossier Project folks have bought into Keith’s dogma that the abuse was necessary for their empowerment because women are entitled princesses who need to learn through suffering. It can’t be that the abuse was just part of Keith’s pathology, his need for control and humiliation, because as Lauren said if Keith does it, it must be good. And part of recognizing that Keith isn’t all good is the humility you are looking for but not seeing. I found this video from a group of women who left high control groups including a slave of Michele’s in NXIVM (she is Jane in The Vow) helpful in looking at the complexity that the Dossier Project skips over.
“because women are entitled princesses who need to learn through suffering.”
Keith is an entitled megalomaniac, a practitioner of the humble-brag who wears a mask of humility. Without even knowing he’s a cult leader, one only has to read his ridiculous, grandiose CV and its list of his specious accomplishments to understand this. I try my utmost to never intentionally nitpick, criticize, mock, ridicule, etc., the looks–or any other set of physical characteristics that could be considered defective–of a person because one has no control over that, but someone like him needs to be put into his place for repeatedly and neurotically pointing out flaws and criticizing others (and causing them to develop their own neurosis due to it) for failing to meet the standards he could never live up to. And while looks are never “everything”, have an accurate perspective of your own physical self as a stocky, short, out of shape, nerdy, looking guy who really hasn’t accomplished anything of lasting significance. Don’t think your hypocritical self simply deserves to be fawned over by fit Victoria’s Secret models just because you exist.
Seriously…. Love does not equal control.
Why is Nicki being mentioned here at all, – or the better question : How is it, that this Nicki doesn’t seem to have been 1 of the accused like Allison was ? I’ve seen nothing written about her at all in all this – except that she married Allison for residential status , – up until now.
Is Alanzo secretly Frank Parlato?
Umm, first of all? Who really cares what you think about Nicki Clyne? Why is this important to you?
Second, why are you telling us that you and your elite are so much more courageous and more intelligent than everyone else? What do you get out of doing that?
Si’, yo pienso es el, pero no se la verdad.
I had not thought of Frank being Alonzo. So I looked it up and Alonzo is an Italian name.
It means “ready for battle”. Frank is Italian.
Oddly enough, Frank, has repeatedly said “I’m always ready for battle.”
Nicki Clyne’s interview in Scott Adam’s podcast (youtube) is a must-see.
Keith was lucky to have this beautiful woman as a partner. She is also very good at expressing herself. It’s very worthwhile listening to her story, told by herself.
She said she would denounce Keith if he did have an affair with Camilla when Camilla was a minor. But she is convinced the pictures are tampered with and she doesn’t believe Daniella’s testimony.
The interview was recorded before Keith’s sentencing. It turns out Camilla’s testimony did nothing to change her mind about Keith. This means she thinks Camilla is lying too.
I have no respect for Nicki Clyne.
“Alanzo” (Alan) is a well-known contrarian crank of the Scientology world. He was formerly an employee of their Peoria, Illinois mission.
He’s been banned from multiple boards for consistent troll-like and abusive behavior. Some suspect he is encouraged or even supported by Scientology itself, as part of the “outer perimeter” defense of apologists and websites who don’t directly support the CofS, but sew doubts about critics and criticism. Scientology does actually have extensive and strategic propaganda operations and such deep pockets that they do things like that even openly, such as supporting the public work of European cult apologist Massimo Introvigne.
His schtick is to push the position that cult critics and anti-cult activists are a cult themselves – taking a valid point that humans tend towards being agreeable and even cliquish and spinning it into a narrative of false equivalency with abusive groups. That’s something Hubbard, Scientology, and many high control groups or cults do, start with a valid principle but then bend it to an extreme.
As for Nicki, he seems to view her through the Scientological moral equivalency of “What’s true is what’s true for you” – which in typical culty fashion is used only when it suits, and dropped when it doesn’t such as in his judgmental derision of “200 pinheaded anti-cultists.” Note that he sidesteps substantive but inconvenient issues such as branding, blackmail, human trafficking, etc.
Thanks you for providing some background on Alonzo. There are multiple web forums threads where Alonzo, and, the Frank Report’s, Sultan of Six bicker back and forth, in a quixotic manner. I had believed it was Sultan arguing with himself.
I’ve seen them only argue back and forth on Twitter. What web forums are you speaking of?
Wow! That would explain alot! Good to know.
I pegged Alanzo for this too from the several comments he/she has made. Something tells me the elevator doesn’t go all the way up.
My bio is on my blog for anyone to read.
You know what else is on my blog? Article after article implicating David Miscavige & Mike Rinder in murders made to look like suicides, silencing rape victims and other actual criminal acts. Not just moral outrages that are completely legal.
Does an employee of Scientology do this?
AnonyMaker is either a Scientologist member of the Office of Special Affairs or a Rinder-duped critic of Scientology. There are a lot of duped critics these days since Mike Rinder “left” Scientology and took over criticism of it. He runs these information control and character assassination campaigns on the people he’s never been able to control.
These guys are ham-handed clods. And they are getting more desperate as the Masterson investigation is getting closer to Rinder’s role in silencing the Masterson’s alleged rape victims, and Kyle Brennan’s mother is releasing a book in the next few months.
They’re heating up their campaign against me. And I’ll be heating up mine, as well.
You write about yourself in the third person on your blog: go see a psychiatrist.
Alanzo where might we find a picture of you unmasked? Also, do you have a surname?
Somehow, I’ve come to lose trust in ANY and ALL of AnonyMaker’s research claims. His or her conclusion (diagnosis) last year that Heidi Clifford (Kris Snyder’s former partner) is a murderous sociopath who killed Kris to sell her truck strikes me as very similar to the slanderous story NXIVM attempted to prove to absolve themselves of any guilt or culpability in Snyder’s suicide.
That was not my conclusion. I consider suicide the most likely possibility, and cited a variety of evidence from the perspective of a former prosecutor who was her best friend and lead the search (but who is not, for some reason, usually quoted or interviewed) to multiple similar cases in Alaska (where things happen surprisingly differently than in the lower 48). I might have made the point that pinning the blame on Heidi made as much (or little) sense as some of the other theories, but that was not intended to promote that theory, though I do think (and agree with others) that she is a bit of an oddly cold character – which is not entirely unsurprising for someone who got involved in a group like NXIVM.
I think my track record for providing useful, fact-based and research-based information is actually pretty good. I not infrequently spend more time fact-checking and researching than I do actually writing.
And Alanzo’s real first name is Allen. He said his bio is on his blog, but if so, it’s currently not easy to find – maybe another claim that doesn’t quite hold water – and a google site search doesn’t show him revealing his real name anywhere there, so I’m not going to doxx him here.
Hi, Allen (sorry I got the spelling wrong the first time around). “Peacemaker” here – I changed up my old moniker because Frank’s forum is rather rough and tumble.
I’m going to respond, in good part because I think it offers an opportunity to get into some things about culty mindsets, and how cults operate, that might interest readers.
I’ll start off by responding to a question with a question: Would a Scientologist call in a bomb threat to a Scientology “org”? The answer is yes, they would; they have done just such things when it is to their tactical or propaganda advantage, such as trying to get the police and public to see protesters as an actual dangerous threat, or even to try to frame people (see the case of Paulette Cooper, who very nearly went to prison as the result of a Scientology operation worthy of the KGB). Hubbard himself wrote that “incredulity…is our greatest asset”; Scientology deliberately does things that are unexpected if not seemingly implausible, knowing that peoples’ tendency to reflexively dismiss a ‘church’ doing so, provides good cover. So it’s not at all outside the realm of possibility that they would set up or at least support and encourage a “perimeter defense” that attacked Mike Rinder, a top enemy these days, under cover of some attacks against their leader David Miscavige as well. I’m not saying that’s what’s actually at work, but in the world of Scientology, where they actually plot things that can be labeled conspiracies, it can’t be ruled out; and your implication that it couldn’t be possible falls into the logical fallacy known as argument from personal incredulity or appeal to common sense ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_incredulity ).
Then, as noted in an earlier comment below, you tend to rather blatantly do just the things you are accusing others of; you can, for another example, decry “shaming of cultists and ex-cultists” and yet a few sentences later go on to shame “pinheaded anti-cultists” (many of whom are of course ex-cultists). That seems to me to fall into patterns ingrained into Scientologists, and other cultists as well, including projecting bitter criticisms onto outsiders or those seen as “other”; and dividing the world and its people into black-and-white, good and bad (“suppressives” in both Scientology and NXIVM). You also try (quite mistakenly) to paint me as either “Office of Special Affairs or a Rinder-duped critic of Scientology”; as in Scientology and NXIVM, ultimately everything gets ascribed to sinister conspiracies. And like Hubbard himself, you grandiosely position yourself as important enough to be conspired against by the real major players, when the Alexa rankings for your blog are insignificant.
You could be forgiven for still falling into the mental traps of Scientology, as it’s known as one of the ultimate mind-f**ks. I’ve been trying to point out to readers here, just how long it can take someone to extricate themselves fully from a high-control control group, its thought patterns and its social environment as well.
Glad to see you are back, AnonyMaker. Always found your comments to be thought-provoking and well-researched.
Alonzo, Alan, whatever is an obvious troll. Didn’t know about the Scientology link though- good catch.
Classic troll behavior. Post something utterly indefensible and pretend to defend it to the last breath. Make obvious contradictory and counterfactual statements and when caught out simply deny, deny, deny. The point being to get people mad, sow confusion and promote stupidity. It helps to be free with the insults too. Under disguise of promoting “free and open discussion”, the real aim is to reduce what could have been serious dialogue to the level of childish tantrums.
Trolling is as old as the Internet. The best solution is just as old: don’t feed the trolls. Don’t respond, don’t argue, don’t give them oxygen.
Calling someone else a “troll” is a lazy ad hominem attack that allows you to dismiss all their arguments so you can continue to believe as you always have, your confirmation bias intact. It’s cognitive dissonance reduction technique 101.
I apologize for talking about ideas that challenge your present beliefs and make you feel uncomfortable.
Alanzo, are you still banned from Reddit? Still accepting donations? Seems like you like to jump around a lot, dude.
Nah. You’re a troll.
“Calling someone else a “troll” is a lazy ad hominem attack.”
Alas, sometimes, the pejorative fits.
Do you dwell under a bridge or in a cave?
Hello. GASLIGHTING.COM look it up, LOSER
So, is your labeling people “pinheaded anti-cultists.”
Are you really that un-self-aware, that you are blatantly doing the very thing you accuse others of?
That’s part of why people suspect you of having ulterior motives. They find it implausible that you would be so blatantly inconsistent and contradictory (at least, not unless you’re still very stuck in the cult mindset of thought-stopping and denial) and so assume that your talking out both sides of your mouth is a calculated tactic of propaganda and disruption.
Nothing like someone who claims individuals attack him with primitive ad hominem and pejoratives. Gotta love Alonzo’s use of platitudes — only to attack others with elementary school drivel.
This is what you’ll never get, ‘AnonyMaker’: The truth is never tribal.
Every tribe traffics in some true things and in some false things.
After more than a decade of belonging to the anticult tribe, I found that the false things in anticultism became toxic and corrosive to me. It was an incredible relief to allow myself to acknowledge the truth of some true things that were not part of the tribe, and call out the false things that are part of anticultism, such as the superstition of ‘brainwashing’.
But that brought the tribal ninnies in anticultism down on me, like you. You will literally follow me from forum to forum to tell everyone I’m an OSA Agent because I violate your tribal narrative. If I’ve read the science on brainwashing which has clearly debunked brainwashing since the 1940’s, and talk about this, you tell everyone I’ve flipped to the enemy tribe, and now I’m an OSA Agent, paid by David Miscavige – even tho I implicate Miscavige in murders and the cover-up of rapes in Scientology, too.
You’ll never look up the science on brainwashing yourself. And if you do, you’ll never speak of it. Because doing so would contradict the narrative you enforce. And you know where that’ll get you.
Your contorted explanation for me working for David Miscavige would be hilarious if it wasn’t so sad. I’ve seen it repeated over and over by the other ninnies in your tribe. Loyalty to the truth, and disloyalty to the tribe, equals OSA AGENT to you.
This is pinheaded anticultism.
Where you see contradiction, you can only see it in terms of contradiction to the tribal narrative. Debunking brainwashing, for instance, might be contradictory to your tribal narrative, but it is not contradictory to the truth.
Thus, the truth is never tribal.
Now go back to Karen and Jeffrey. I’m sure when Karen’s out of session auditing people using Scientology, she’ll be ready to put on her anticultist hat again, and dupe you into your next flying monkey crusade.
Yes, what you say about Alanzo is absolutely correct.
Some of us have been aware of Alanzo for even more than a decade. Yes.
He is not exceptional, and there are more people like Alanzo, individuals whose names are known, to many people who also know about Alanzo; these are people who choose to expose cult behavior and/or cult criminality.
Alanzo is sometimes a busy little beaver. All hot air, a martinet. All is pretense with this sad jackanapes. Evidently he is addicted to getting weird attention put upon himself, too. Otherwise he would’ve quit by now, because he already has a terrible reputation as a cult dawgie. Ah yes, he does.
This Alanzo awareness is simply because some of us have observed Alanzo specifically, and others of his type, inside of EVERY group who misrepresent their “product.”
He, Alanzo, is under the illusion that he’s clever. That is amazingly unperceptive of Alanzo. Amazingly!
These Alanzo antics are pretty much his entire fucking profession. (I could say a lot more here about that, but Alanzo bores me by now.) See it for what Itt is.
This “hee-haw boy ‘Bot” dreams that he is “auditing” others, who just don’t get his “wisdom” and “superior knowledge.” The dude is just pathetic, and at this point he is transparently useless as an ambassador for anything at all. Too notorious for being an asshole.
Minimal research can give you the details, if you want or need to clutter your brain with the shit which Alanzo tries to sell and exactly HOW he tries to do that.
He (and certain pals or colleagues of his) harass anti-Scientologists in particular, and also pester others who work to expose cult-like groups and activities. This harassment and insertion is done by adhering to specific Scientology formulaics, and the antics of these lackeys, who insert themselves to do damage, are also well-known.
By the way, Alanzo is playing head games and that’s ALL. Look closely at what he inserts here in his verbiage.
He is taking a nasty and a twisted swipe at Mike Rinder right here.
I could write a book about Mike Rinder, and it would be a book that admires his evolution, details his (brutal) awakenings OUT of Scientology and tells of his life as an activist against Sci. I have read and watched Mike Rinder for many years by now. I love the man and stand with him and for him.
Mike Rinder speaks for himself. Stfu, Alanzo. Mike does so not only very honestly but heroically.
Mike Rinder is a dedicated activist who works everyday to expose and to dismantle Scientology. This is absolutely sickening what Alanzo tries to imply herein.
He Alanzo, adds in the accused rapist, Danny Masterson, to make his implications more “notable.”
Here you get a small example of Alanzo and his dirtbag character, smearing Rinder “from the back.”
I see you, fuckhead. Loud and “clear,” Alanzo.
This remark about Rinder is so out of line that it is nauseating.
How anyone reacts or responds to Alanzo is, of course, one’s individual decision.
Anonymaker and I have/had both been around for quite awhile at Tony Ortega’s Underground Bunker and elsewhere. Many years, in fact.
We have never met or spoken. Our voices differ, we might disagree about a few things, but Nxivm is not our first mutual OBJECTION.
Mike Rinder was the head of OSA for David Miscavige for 22 years. He destroyed thousands of families and committed and covered up many criminal acts. Since brainwashing doesn’t exist, only a psychopath would get up every morning and destroy the people he destroyed for a living for more than 2 decades.
So why not question a guy like this? Why make him into a hero?
Since ‘leaving’ in 2007, Rinder has never revealed a Scientology crime, despite running OSA for 22 years. Plenty of morally outrageous acts, but nothing that would bring any criminals indictments such as what happened with Keith Raniere.,
Rinder knows what happens with criminal subpoenae – forensic accounting & penetrative powers that find the things they don’t want found. Why does Rinder know this? Because Rinder was part of the “All Clear Unit” to keep L Ron Hubbard out of jail while he was on the lam from the law when his wife went to prison in the 70’s early 80’s.
And of course, as the head of OSA for 22years,he was the chief “protector” of the Church of Scientology. Rinder knows the difference between criminal subpoena and civil lawsuits.
Scientology eats civil lawsuits for lunch. Criminal litigation is a whole nother matter.
Everyone knows what happened to Keith Raniere when criminal subpeonae were issued on him. That’s why Rinder makes excuses for why David Miscavige is still in power, still doing whatever he wants to Scientologists.
Rinder has claimed that he went to the FBI and ‘told them everything’ 14 years ago. And yet when he was asked who he spoke to at the FBI, he said he “couldn’t remember”.
And despite having access to a blog every day, 3 seasons of a TV show, and now an ongoing podcast, Rinder has still never revealed anything that would put David Miscavige, or any other officer of the Church of Scientology, into criminal jeopardy.
That was not the case with Keith Raniere. Why is it the case with Scientology?
When it comes to Scientology – question everything.
I won’t be playing Alonzo’s game anymore. Because Alonzo is like the nerd version of the Amway Cowboy from Texas.
… And to think, Alonzo, could be the very first troll. He may be an ancient denizen, of the primordial message boards, of old. Alonzo might predate dial-up-internet.
What an astounding discovery this could be!
Dare I say, what if Alonzo, harks back to the era of telephone chatrooms in the 80s?
We may have located someone who has even less of a life than I do…. 😉
Yes, a lot like Scott Hamway and stuck in a voluntary RUT. Blabbing from beneath a fucking tower of personally disorganized babble. Bub bub bub and no one has called the undertow driver! The undertaker? The goddamned mortician with the pancake makeup and the hair rugs? The embalming fluids?
[Please, Otto Auto crash pilot, eff off. Leave the language to me, the retired tigress. Eff off outta here.]
Back to NiceGuy. I was just distracted. That’s all. Too much Balzac. Far,far too much Madeleine and Tintin and Snowy.
Dear Nicest Guy with divine taste in choosing a wife, and I don’t ever forget that,
You and I have remembered quite similarly these ” indigenous” and quite naturally unnatural similarities. Hamway and Little Aldo here. What a match. It is amusing! All of it, so vividly tragi-comic, and all the world IS, after all, a stage. So many encores. No such thing as enough.
Seldom is heard a discouraging word?
What the hell is this? Springtime for Hitler, with Gene Wilder and Zero Mostel with Mel Brooks as our screenwriter and idea man?
“A Gay Romp with Adolf and Eva at Berchtesgaden” or what?
The theater of the absurd is deeply dear to my heart. Even if the plot tears up all of Europe, at least we can laugh later, huh?
I shall say no to any beer as to me it smells like an old schooner full of diaper liquid. You offered to even buy me one earlier. But thank you anyhow, and I’d love a beverage any day or evening.
Perhaps I could have rosehip tea, sweet and iced? You guys who like beer can have my share. ( Really this is bit of repartee is me responding to some other Niceguy comment which I lost somewhere, but in it Niceguy also referred to Clav someway, somehow, somewhere.)
Cut that out, NiceGuy. Please with sugar on it. Clav is already too magnetic, and really, I might have to run off, just as it is. This is my responsibility to figure out and I’m very myopic as it is and is and is. Hopelessly so.
Is that another song? Is That All There Is?
Of course it is. I have gotta go dance. See you again sooooooon, NiceGuy. This is gonna take awhile, how to keep on making sure that hips don’t lie. These hips. My ones. Move it or lose it. That is all too true.
Hamway and Aldo crapping in a tree
k-i-s-s-i-n-g their knickers
here comes a swarm of bees
Or was that a green whore net?
My dearest Shivani, I am ready to run off to anywhere in the world with you (I’ll also consider other-worldly places if we can work out the details and Google maps covers them). Just send me the appropriate date and geographical coordinates — and I’ll meet you there.
PS: Of course, as you would intrinsically know, I generally hate beer. Room temperature dark Guinness is the only exception — and that’s only because of some latent DNA.
The Greatest Scandal in American History!
Fauci admits he funded Wuhan Lab investigating Bat Viruses including Gain of Function
Fauci is a War Criminal
Fauci Faces FIRING As MASSIVE Scandal About To Erupt After Fauci Admits Funding Went To Wuhan Lab
Dr. Fraudci Strikes Again
1. Raniere taught a curriculum that all of NXIVM needed to follow. In fact, they had to pay to take the classes if they ever wanted to get paid for their hard work.
2. Anyone who dissented was shunned and considered a suppressive. If you didn’t go Raniere’s way, you went out the door. And if you didn’t go quietly, you were harassed psychologically and legally for years.
3. DOS members couldn’t eat without Raniere’s permission and had to be ready for him at all times. They had to do whatever he commanded them to do.
These are just a few examples – sadly, there are many more, which show that Nxians were told what to think, how to think, and how to live.
To use your own words, Raniere employed “[s]ocial coercion to create uniformity of belief.”
Now, how exactly are the leftovers and Nicki Clyne “independent thinkers”? The leftovers are still so controlled by Raniere that they speak with him in prison and do his bidding on Twitter.
Sorry, but most people outside cultworld earn their belief system through a lifetime of experience. Most don’t get so stuck in such a rigid structure as NXIVM.
Nicki is afraid to develop her own belief system because she has adopted Raniere’s for so long.
So, people in cults are not independent thinkers. That’s a ridiculous thing to say. Perhaps, before they got trapped in a cult, they were very open-minded. But, as soon as they become indoctrinated, the ability to think critically is lost.
People in cults left mainstream society and its attitudes and beliefs, searched for alternatives, and found and adopted minority beliefs.
That requires more independence of thought than never questioning mainstream society. It also requires more courage.
Do most mainstream Christians, for instance, come to their beliefs because they questioned what their parents told them, endured social ostracism, etc? No. Most mainstream Christians hold their beliefs because they never questioned anything, and they simply believed what their parents believed, and swallowed the standard pabulum their culture handed them.
In this way, a person who has the courage and intellectual curiosity to question their culture, and rejects what the mainstream has offered them is yes – more of a independent thinker.
It’s not a ridiculous thing to say. It’s the truth.
==In this way, a person who has the courage and intellectual curiosity to question their culture, and rejects what the mainstream has offered them is yes – more of a independent thinker.
No, they’re not. Just because someone rejects something because it is “mainstream” doesn’t make the person more intellectually curious or courageous than someone else. There has to be a logically valid reason for said rejection, and the moral certitude to act upon it. People can reject things for all sorts of “reasons” (more like rationalizations), many of which have nothing to do with intellectual discernment. It’s quite possible the rebel is clueless and “mainstream” society is quite correct. Sometimes said rejection is just a reflection of one’s own narcissistic tendencies.
Never said they rejected it because it’s ‘mainstream’. Further, you assume that their rejection is based on ‘narcissism’ and not on logical analysis for their own lives.
Quite a Torquemadan argument, when you think about it.
My comment was addressed to the topic at hand in general, not with respect to particulars (current NXIVM members).
It doesn’t matter if you didn’t explicitly state that anyone “rejected [something] because it’s mainstream”, because that’s exactly what you implied in the words you’ve written. You’ve generalized mainstream society as dumb, boring, and other negative terms in many of your comments.
And no, I didn’t generalize that “their rejection” (particular) was based on narcissism. I made a claim about some people who “rebel” from mainstream society.
“Torquemadan” – How many times are you going to use this word? It’s like you saw it on a Word-of-the-Day calendar and decided to use it whenever you can to try and impress people.
You remind me of the scene in Good Will Hunting where that nerdy long haired Michael Bolton loser tries to pass off some fancy bullshit and Matt Damon gives him an epic beatdown. You don’t make yourself look smart, you just come off as a douchebag.
And I don’t care how important you think it is, if I ever have to use it, which I fucking doubt, I am not putting that ® after it either.
Good point that taking a stance of rejecting the “mainstream” is not necessarily a sign of superior personal characteristics. while some might do so for altruistic reasons, others do so out of childish oppositionalism, or simply because they’re failing at getting along and want to blame others – for an extreme example, think of Ted Kaczynski in his cabin in Montana, writing long philosophical screeds and sending out bombs.
Research shows that most people join high control groups or cults because they’re at a point of vulnerability and need for acceptance, not one of strength to break with norms. Though such groups do craftily exploit and twist members’ idealism.
Given that “Alanzo” has been banned from multiple internet forums, including ones where I know that even-handed admins have given him a second or even third chance, and acts in ways that prevent him from forming allegiances and undermine his ability to have influence in the matters he claims are important to him, I’d say he has trouble getting along.
No, Alanzo, all they did was leave the mainstream only to find themselves in another high control environment. Cults prey on these types of people.
And, it has been shown that when those who do get out fail to look at what made them vulnerable to such abuse, they are doomed to jump into yet another cult.
Sound like someone you know?
The world does not come down to “mainstream society” or “cults”. What a sad, limited worldview.
There are all kinds of non-mainstream people. And it is so much less mainstream not to belong to ANY group. Or club. Or cult. To identify as just a human. Out there in a singular manner.
Some people do not even have a political party! Or a sport’s team. Shocking! But true
Al kinds of lives are possible. You are a very stunted person, Alan.
Nicki Clyne is on Twitter 24/7. My guess is her life has become as boring as our lives.
Except recently. When Nicki went to ” visit a friend in prison”.
Anonymous 3:51pm, that made me laugh.
I am not Nice Guy. 😉
Hi, Nice Guy!!
A lot of insults being thrown here, as well as assertions of opinion being sold as fact.
And I don’t mean by Alanzo.
On one hand, Nicki is being talked about as a victim, then the narrative gets turned into “burn the witch!”
Very hard to take most of these comments seriously.
Please retire “burn the witch”.
Try using your own words and creativity to express yourself.
Cliches are boring & Lazy
“Don’t hate the player. Hate the game!”
“Takes one to know one”
Agree. So many ARGUMENTS! Seems to me all of this dissension is simply causing everyone to be even more divided as a human race. Can’t we all just get along and let everyone have their own opinions without judgment or criticism?
It is good of you to acknowledge your lack of ability to think things through independently. Butt but! You did not really need to point out the obvious.
And the coolest guy is Frank Parlato, who puts his heart and soul, his life, into this matter. He really deserves us all to support him now. If he were not, this case would be dead. Respect him, Frank!
Where is the intelligence in writing something intended for a large audience that includes the writer saying that most North Americans are dumb?
Tales told by an idiot, so this is par for the course.
A facet of Alanzo’s shtick, gimmick, is to insert himself and to bring chaos and disagreements, if he can be successful. He want to distract people away from what is found to be true. He uses ramshackle psychology and tries like hell to sound knowing and even superior. It is all bullshit, though. Alanzo merely exemplifies the wreckage trapped in its corner, still yapping away as if he is incapable of anything else anymore.
It is pathetic. Pathos vs. bathos. So have a good look. Ah-cha. Dissolved already. Evaporated, imploding.
Facts! He tries to take people on a journey of condescending questions and comments all with the end goal of trying to find an appropriate label for them. Cultist, anti-cultist, atheist, theist, materialist….etc., etc. so he can stroke his “I was right” ego. But, yes, this is his schtick and it’s been on rinse/repeat cycle for quite a while now.
Nicki Clyne deserves zero respect. She serves as a sock puppet for Raniere with no original ideas of her own. Her communication with him now determines what she says on Twitter and every action that she takes.
The fact that she does not hide her participation in DOS does not entitle her to any respect. In fact, the way in which she uses her continued participation reflects a narcissistic arrogance.
She’s basically saying, “I don’t care that I lied to and misled women about DOS and the brand.” And, not only that, she goes a step further to say,”and, if you now say you’re a victim due to my actual misrepresentations, you have no agency, and are relying on your victimhood to gain attention.
Sorry, but f**k off!
She victimized these women and has the nerve to attack them for acknowledging that they were victims. That’s a great way for her to avoid any accountability for her actions, which is all she does on Twitter.
It’s not her own actions that destroyed her acting career (quitting BSG for Raniere, continuing to support him even after his sex tracking conviction, among others). No, it is the media and society who can’t deal with how edgy she is and is canceling her. No one gives a shit about her.
It’s not that she’s actually being canceled; it’s that no respectable person wants anything to do with her, much less work with her. She a blank-staring cult member who thinks her critical thinking skills are above all others, except Raniere. If she could only see what a ridiculous picture that is.
Her ego and arrogance are tremendous. She also believes that she is the focus of the government’s wrath. I wish she was that important, actually, because maybe then they would deport her ass out of my country for committing immigration fraud.
You know who I respect? The survivors of Raniere. They are survivors, not victims. Sarah may be flawed, like we all are, but she is a true survivor who has the courage to begin to look at what she was a part of and did during her time in NXIVM.
What Nicki’s doing is the easy road. You don’t need any courage to deny all accountability for the impact your actions had on others and on your own life.
Nicki’s a coward.
I anticipate her joining the ranks of Qanon soon, as long as Raniere gives her his permission. What agency!
Just because a person/man/woman is attractive/handsome/beautiful does not make them: 1) a nice person, 2) a decent human being, 3) someone with a conscience. Grow up.
==Where we agree the most is that mainstream society is incredibly shallow and materialistic, and dumb.
So, both of you are over-generalizing, patronizing critics of practically everyone else.
==Then we graduated and moved on.
Ha! Nicki hasn’t moved on. At all. She’s still doing her master’s bidding.
==We’re not embarrassed, we’re not apologetic, and we’re not shameful or guilty for having the courage to try to live the best life we can with the one shot we have.
Neither is Raniere. But whatever.
==They’re usually smarter, more courageous and more independent thinkers than anticultists are.
Or they simply tell themselves they are to make themselves feel better. What is your scientific and statistical criteria for asserting such a bodacious claim?
==This is what anticultists don’t understand about former and existing cult members
Most people aren’t boxed into your invented category of “anticultistism”. Are people who have written (albeit controversial) research papers on categorizing cults, anti-cultists? I understand that cult is seen as a pejorative mainstream term–like many other terms–but that doesn’t mean it is completely arbitrary.
Most people don’t even care about other people’s alternative lifestyles (at least in Western societies where the freedom to engage in such is quite large) until the people who adhere to them begin to interfere in the lives of the former in destructive ways and/or break the law. Kind of like what NXIVM did with its racketeering enterprise and sextortion ring masked as a sorority
I know it’s psychologically comforting to the self to think and tell others that you’re on some high horse–you know, being self-identified as intellectually superior to a dumb mainstream society–but I see only your “anticultism” joining you and Nicki at the hip. But Nicki really only cares about one cult in particular–the cult of Raniere.
By the way, EVERYONE reinterprets their own past beliefs and history in terms of their current beliefs. It’s not just unique to “cultists” who return to “mainstream” society.
Well shazayam, Frank. I never thought I’d rate my own “guest view’ on the Frank Report!
Typo tho: I didn’t use an exclamation point on the declarative sentence you are quoting for your title.
If you want to make me look goofy and idealistic, you still can. Just put your exclamation point outside your quotation mark.
Well written, Alanzo. I agree – Nicki is definitely a strong person with a very well defined sense of self. Any suggestion that she is brainwashed or somehow has no agency is made out of ignorance.
–Nicki is definitely a strong person with a very well-defined sense of self.–
Not many thinking people would consider someone who remains under the sway of a proven con-man as “strong and with a well-defined sense of self.” Just the opposite. And the more adamant and fixed in their support the weaker they become.
If Anonymoused was actually being sarcastic, then I agree and apologize.
I don’t think Nicki’s brainwashed.
She seems like a well-defined pedophile apologist who uses her agency to tweet about freeing a disgusting old criminal cult leader.
A treat for Alonzo!
A night in the NXIVM harem with Nicki and Allison.
Most North Americans are dumb? So Nicki Clyne posts a photo of herself on the beach in Mexico, and that fact that she’s too dumb to know that the photo will give away the location leads to Raniere’s arrest, yes or no? Not a small mistake and pretty dumb!
If Mack was throwing out trash today in the NYPost, probably it wasn’t her 25 pound box of mixed chocolates.
Good golly, Miss Molly. This is not good news for the Los Alamitos dumpster divers.
At least Mack has grown some boobies, though.
If that is in any way looking at the brighter side of her upcoming schmo patrol assignment, at Victorville or some other all-American joint.
She already looks rough.
Crock of absolute horseshit.
Alanzo is Sultan of 7
Alonzo is real.
He often responds to Nicki on Twitter.
And Nicki, through NXIVM, is familiar with the teachings of Scientology.
I’ve been following his feed.
Alonzo makes 5G Fred seem down to Earth. Interestingly enough, Alonzo
flip-flops between anti-cult and pro-cult depending on his audience. He definitely has the hots (infatuation) for Nicki Clyne.
” He definitely has the hots (infatuation) for Nicki Clyne.” Nice Guy
Alonzo can have her.
No, Nice Gentleman. There have always been various “Alanzos.”. Sultan is not one. Sultan is doing his own thing. Please do not insult the Sultan. Heh heh. With him, it is different and somewhat more personally individualized. The Sultan is a work in progress. Have some mercy, my dear. Alanzo is on a very fracturing mission altogether differently motivated. The ways and the means, within these two commenters, do not make any kind of a match.
Different folks, different strokes! Variety is so so spicy.
Excellent point, I agree completely!!!
The NYPost has Mack photos. She might be dumping trash.
I don’t get it. Of the more famous actresses from NXIVM — Nicki Clyne, Allison Mack, Kristen Kreuk, Sarah Edmondson — only the latter is settled down and has kids. By the ages they are all at now — late thirties, early forties — each one of them should have at least two kids going into their early teens. I guess that’s what happens when you waste your time and live your life according to the principles of a sex-addicted, polyamorous fraud.
“each one of them should have at least two kids going into their early teens”
You sound like that idiot Sultan. I see you have conveniently excluded Grace Park, who is one of the most famous actresses associated with the group along with Ludwka Paleta who has some 3 million IG followers. Park is married with at least one kid and Paleta is married with twins. The more likely scenario is that the childless ones either can’t have kids or were never really interested.
Sultan may be a lunatic but he’s certainly not an idiot.
Sultan-of-7 has officially moved on to Olivia Munn.
Olivia Munn is 1/2 Asian! No surprise there!
— each one of them should have at least two kids–
No. Not everyone believes in this, nor should they. Joining a sex cult is not a good choice, but there are other ways to lead a fulfilling life than following the path of marriage, kids, divorce, broken home, financial hardship, confused kids, etc.
It’s well-known that being on Sci-fi shows lowers a woman’s estrogen levels.
Ha ha ha.
That seems plausible.
Watching them seems to lower some dude’s testosterone.
Or at least give them an OCD/Comic-Con hormone. Cospplay -itis?
I thought you said Cosplay tits
Ha ha ha.
That was definitely a missed opportunity on my part.
Allison looks terrible in that wedding photo and their body language is awful. It will for sure be interesting to see if Nicki speaks for or against Allison at the sentencing and what report she may have submitted.
Icy-Nine, I bet Nicki is steering clear from the sentencing.
Lucky for Nicki, the law of Marital Privilege — i.e., “Spousal Privilege” — exists in the U.S.
K.R. Claviger has not yet spoken on this issue.
They got a divorce though right? So I am not sure how that works for crimes committed while married but now divorced, if that privilege exists, and/or if it even applies to Federal law or only applies to States. I would guess any statement she makes could incriminate her. Nevertheless, if it was at all a real marriage, you’d think you’d be fighting for your wife’s freedom. But since Allison was a cooperating witness against Rainere, Nicki probably hates her guts.
It wasn’t a “real marriage”. If it was, Nicki would come out hard defending it. Think about it. She has no problem advocating for a pedophile. Or DOS. On an almost daily basis. She got really freaked when asked about the marriage on Dateline NBC.
Nicki is hedging her bets because she is unsure what Allison has/will say about the marriage.
Multiple women have already gone on record stating it was immigration fraud.
On the other hand, Nicki has the collateral and is a true believer. So maybe Allison will just go along to get along.
But there is no chance Nicki would remain so closed-mouthed about the marriage if it were legit. In fact, she would try to use it.
I hope when I ask Claviger, he’ll reply regarding the marital privilege question.
Nicki’s love for Allison was, sadly, not as strong as her love for Vanguard.
It’s still amazing, to me, that adults could take seriously, a man, who named himself after his favorite video game. Vanguard. WTF?
Have a great Memorial weekend!
I hear ya, NiceGuy. Remember, you can always find a new wife, but there’s only one vanguard.
Everyone enjoy Memorial Day!
I follow Clyne on Twitter. Occasionally interact with her. Honestly got nothing but compliments for her. She would be well within her rights to tell me and others to f^$& off on the regular and doesn’t. I wish her only the best and truly wish she would move on 100% from all things NXIVM and figure out whatever it is will make her happy and pursue that. I think her continued defense of the cult and DOS is an anchor that is just a massive drag on doing that.
Ultimately, she is simply a girl that drunk the kool-aid. Millions do that on the regular. Really it’s no different than the wide-scale drinking we see from the far-right about Donald Trump based on nothing but words. What actions they think he accomplished is often manufactured and based on just words…much like Raniere’s claims of being the smartest man in the world. There is a reason repetition of phrases is a key tool of any propaganda and cult tool chest – it works.
Sadly, as Clyne’s descent into the far right demonstrates she is more susceptible to such things than most. I would not be the least bit surprised if we learn she starts or joins another cult (Scientology perhaps?). Based on her Twitter feed and her writing, it’s clear she prefers a binary view of the world – good vs bad, strong vs weak, can only be on one side or the other. The greys do not really exist, it’s just you unnecessarily complicating things. You can only be pro-justice by being anti-government (thus far right), ignoring that both parties equally use the justice system as a hammer as if everything is a nail.
In the end, I see her as an unknowing victim that is stuck in a jail of her own devising despite having the key to the door in her pocket. Hopefully, one day she will use it.
Very good analyses
Are you the guy on Nicki’s Twitter account that said he watched every Battlestar Galactica episode, after learning about Nicki from the Nxivm scandal?
I also interacted with Nicki and told her it’s dangerous for a female celebrity to interact with strangers (men) on the internet because a few of them are probably hardcore stalkers.
For the record, I do not believe you are a stalker.
Kristen Kreuk has an army of stalkers and Allison Mack has a few stalkers herself.
In fact, one of Mack’s stalkers showed up at the home of her parents during her home confinement.
The three best looking women in Nxivm are Nicki Clyne, Kristin Kreuk and Toni Natalie.
Toni is a classic beauty.
Heya Gas Stone
The imitation western pastries in India
The cakes and cookies, the sweetie pies
Lined up for display, these desserts look
appetizing, festive, colorful, yummy.
But a spoonful of any of these confections
Quite stunningly, is a tasteless disaster
without flavor or texture
One is unprepared to encounter
So much absence and dearth
of substance or pleasure
Gas Stone. Put a fork in it. Or are you too easily sassified?
Maybe that’s it.
Your name is nice, though. I imagine y’all, carting around a large sack of fart juice on your back, dressed as a red-cap who hauls a whole lotta disorganized baggage.
Welcome to Walmart!
Walmart has us barely withstanding our gales of laughter today. Talk about putting its monopolizing clubfoot right up its ass.
Welcome to Walmart. Etc. Hahahahahaha
Looking for Pepto-Pervo- Bismal?
That isn’t what Noni Tattlelee had on her amoebic brain pan, when she grunted
Another “deny til ya die” blind follower. Sad. No one can ever speak the truth.
No. I was an anticultist just like you for many years after getting out of Scientology. Then I began to see how cruel and intolerant anticultists were and decided I wanted nothing more to do with them.
Most people who get themselves involved in anticultism don’t see its sociopathy because their own self-righteous crusade against their targeted cult blinds them.
A huge majority of anticultists are members of mainstream religions and ideologies who attack “cults” simply because the cult believes differently than they do.
In fact, I’ll bet over 50 percent of the readers here are mainstream Catholics or atheists or jews or Baptists, etc motivated mostly by their own mainstream beliefs.
Just as cults can and often times should be criticized, so should anticults.
For that, I’m your huckleberry.
There are not “sides” to everything, Alanzo. That’s intentionally divisive and “Us vs. Them”.
Which is… Culty.
It’s just people.
With differing degrees of opinion. But you are really painting the world as two teams at war.
Bizarre for those belonging to a group who proclaimed a world mission of elevating ALL.
Mastodon shit. Ancient lumps of ejected WASTE.
If you ever wake up, continue to leave everybody else alone. This is the least you can do.
Plus it could be the one fucking thing with which U have never experimented.
I loved that insult!!!
I could give you a kiss or buy you a beer.
Claviger will be jealous either-way.
Alanzo, you speak a lot about anti-cultists (presumably anyone here that is anti-Raniere) being people that have never been challenged enough to question their own world views or examine their own assumptions. What if someone here has actually been in a cohesive control environment that they thought was making the world a better place, but discovered it wasn’t, and it caused them to re-examine many of their beliefs. And what if that person is involved in the NXIVM debate to help prevent more people from suffering in a similar situation. If that person is speaking out against Raniere, does that make them an anti-cultist?
Anticultism is the ideology of the anticult movement. It centers around the superstition of “brainwashing” and the intolerance of anyone who believes differently than they do. You can be Anti-Raniere, but pro-Nxian. You can separate and distinguish between Raniere’s depravities and someone who did a few levels of ESP.
Anticultists see little difference, and will attack and accuse any Nxian of being ‘brainwashed’, no matter their position in the hierarchy and whether they committed any crimes or abuse.
My experience of the last 20 yrs has taught me that Anticultism is actually dangerous. And when normal, non-sociopathic people get into a sociopathic anticult group, they can demonstrate a tendency to lose their self and start displaying sociopathic, intolerant and hateful behaviors.
So with my experience, I believe it is important for someone to stand up and say something about this.
So I do.
==Anticultism is the ideology of the anticult movement. It centers around the superstition of “brainwashing” and the intolerance of anyone who believes differently than they do
There’s no such thing as anti-cultism “movement”. This is just a play on words, an attempt to reverse the dialectic in an emotional way for a pejorative label attached to groups onto those using it to make them look wrong and evil. There are only a small subset of people who have made it part of their lives (economic or otherwise, rightfully or wrongfully) to be anti- what they believe are arguably “destructive” cults.
You can deny the “cult” label attachment, which presupposes the meaning of the term, or you can argue against the details of the categorization, but to presume it as merely label that is completely arbitrary and is always used to “dehumanize” is patently false.
Language is replete with negative words that are symbols to concepts attached with meaning.
If you attacked people for being part of an anti-murder “movement” you’d be looked upon as a fool.
There certainly is an Anticult Movement.
Been around a long long time. Like I’ve said, Torquemada was one of its earliest and most famous Vanguards.
But all those intolerant religious fanatics of the past have a new mask to hide behind these last few decades. It’s a mask they use to hide their true motivations for attacking people who believe differently than they do.
More on the Anticult Movement here:
From the information provided in that link, the anti-cult movement isn’t as homogenous as you make it out to be with your dogmatic and reflective pejorative usage of the “anti-cultist” label.
As someone already rightfully pointed out, society is simply not divided into a cult/[anti-cult (mainstream)] exclusive or exhaustive bifurcation, which is a false dichotomy. I’m sure there are people who are raging anti-cultists, just like there are people who are raging cultists (extremes exist practically everywhere), but the divisive language you use is simply absurd, ironically wanting of nuance, and is reflective of an anger due to (possibly) belonging to a group that has been labeled a cult and being attacked in some way for it.
Normally, I would make some snide comment, but I would never wish to denigrate the institution of gay marriage, as I am sure these ladies went into with the absolute purest of intent.
Both Frank and Alanzo give Clyne a lot of credit for being open about being in DOS. Did she have a choice? She was with Raniere when he was arrested in Mexico. She’s all over the NXIVM documentaries, and it’s not just one or two interviews. She posts inane twaddle on Twitter just about every day. I am not seeing much opportunity for her to refrain from being clear about her involvement.
Alonzo gives us a new word folks. “Anti-cultist”. These are the people who do NOT rally, protest or chant “Justice for cultists!! Justice for cultists!!!”
Yeah, nothing says one is “independent minded” and “intelligent” like joining a cult. Alanzo is pretty easy to impress.
Nicki is being sued civilly for being a not at all great person to women that she chose to “mentor.” In truth, that ” master” position was abused to procure and manipulate the women for Keith Raniere’s perverse enjoyment as “slaves”.
These women trusted Nicki and she badly betrayed them. Their lives were intimately involved and entwined. This anonymous dude “knows” Nicki through Twitter. I am going to believe the women.
Nicki directed these women to fabricate very damaging blackmail against men they all knew. Nicki pimped these women to Raniere. Nicki directed them to create demeaning porn for a Keith’s sexual gratification and lied about it.
Nicki cheated to jump ahead of other more deserving and legitimate immigration cases.
Nicki made a mockery of marriage equality which has been a hard won battle fought for decades.
Nicki continues to keep women’s collateral instead of returning it. Causing them untold heartache and misery.
Being ” nice” is different than being “good”.
I am sure that Nicki is nice. And fun.
So was Ted Bundy.
I would like to see an article from Frank about more of these details. Get a better idea of how the leadership was involved in the running of NXIVM, carrying out Raniere’s will and so forth.
Wouldn’t mind hearing more on the extent of Nicki’s involvement in the actions of the cult as I’m unclear on that. Was it equal or greater than Mack, more than India? Did she just follow orders or did she create many of the orders? Things like that.
As for the “mockery of marriage”, yeah don’t care. Silly talk. The ship on the sanctity of marriage sailed a few millennia ago with the whole marriage as a business transaction (among other wrongs). Marriage is whatever the individual/couple chooses it to be. The rest is just religious and legal sign-off because of tradition and taxes. Also not clear how taking advantage of the system had any impact on “legitimate immigration cases”. She’s a Canadian hot white girl actress, so for her citizenship was a guarantee that would just take years. instead, she took advantage of a shortcut. More power to whatever immigrants can do it regardless of the country their from. Focus on the topic at hand – NXIVM and her involvement there.
That’s a very dismissive and entitled view of the fight for marriage equality.
And an argument used against marriage equality was that it would be abused in this manner.
There are people in legitimate relationships who are denied marriage green cards all the time.
It is clear that you do not care. There are people who do care. Abuses of the system impact them negatively.
I would never dismiss your comments as “silly talk”. Especially if it was an issue close to your heart.
Don’t tell me what to focus on.
It is relevant. Nicki is a proven liar. She lied in a legal setting. She broke the law. Allison and Nicki required their “slaves” to lie and participate in this crime. That was part of DOS and it is part of court testimony.
It says a lot about the extent to which Nicki would follow Keith’s directives. And pass on that criminal participation to those in her downline.
Nxivm had a history of immigration fraud. It was a part of their criminal enterprise.
Could be more specific.
What do you mean by “lied in a legal setting”?
Also, what laws did the slaves of Alison and Nicki break? You do know DOS activities were legal. Even its secret activities were legal (master/slave dynamic, demanding collateral, branding since the ladies DID consent). Keith raping them by threatening to reveal the collateral is the only area that was illegal and that is so damn murky due to the constant weeks of active participation of the slaves that the odds of a successful prosecution were slim. Most of NXIVM’s public-facing activities were legal too. So, curious on what crimes you think the non-leadership was committing.
Please, can you point to where women have claimed that Nicki abused them while she mentored them in DOS? I’ve never heard or read any woman claiming that. Please provide your references, unless you are just making it up?
Nicki is named in the civil suit. And I am pretty confident it is not because she was a great mentor.
You can find out more about Alonzo on his Twitter page.
He frequently comments on Nicki’s Twitter.
Alonzo has had ties to Scientology
Nancy Salzman shamelessly ripped off Scientology to create NXIVM.
Isn’t that the truth?
Another thing Frank should consider reporting on – Scientology. If only to compare how much of a copycat the “genius” Raniere was in tactics. He practically used their entire playbook with new terms and dropping their nonsense phrasing for things. About the only thing he didn’t get around to was SeaOrg which is effectively Scientology’s legal slave force (nope, sadly that isn’t an exaggeration).
Alonzo has to deal with “Squirrel Busters”? (Google that, its truly cray cray)
Not many current fake “religions” or chaotic systematizations have been discussed in as much depth as Scientology has been.
If someone sincerely wants to investigate Sci., the amount of info already available is on the verge of too much.
The Underground Bunker, Tony Ortega’s salon, is and has been ongoing every day for many years. There is also more.
There are many, many books, audios, videos and mostly by former Scientologists who are now “anti-cultist” activists, some of whom have shared prolific bodies of expository work of their own.
Try Jon Atack, for example, a brilliant writer and his seminal work, A Piece of Blue Sky, 2013. This is one mere example out of thousands of Sci. cult disaster exposés that is well worth studying.
Frank would be covering old, very well-trodden ground digging into Scientology.
Nobody needs Frank to do this for them, either. Do it yourself. How about that? Put in a few years or more of your own dedicated, sustained research efforts and think on your own. You can do this and you will be much more informed, personally.
Or just sit there blabbing away and be as superficial as you please.
It does not matter, essentially, but it is possible that you do not know how much, and what, you haven’t explored for yourself.
This lack of a backbone shows, though. It seeps through the words, the language used to assemble thoughts. And that is never a surprise, how a lack of personal background research resembles paddling a canoe with a hole somewhere in its structure.
It is observable that such superficial “revelations” are inevitably bent, misshapen, inadequate.
Really. This is move it or lose it, what we call our thinking processes, and you receive what you are willing to put onto it, via your own concentrative FIRE. Where is yours? Watching Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles? Again? Oh well.
Here, let me pet you on the head. Yes, you are so smart. You a good smart boy, yes you are…
I had a good laugh skimming your silly little trolling. Thank you for the entertainment.
I agree that Frank should consider reporting on Scientology from his perspective from NXIVM.
From what I’ve seen of Frank so far, he allows divergent, even dissident, views. He publishes arguments from the other tribe.
This type of intellectual honesty is completely missing in Scientology watching these days – especially since Mike Rinder, the “former” head of OSA – took over.
I think Mike Rinder will have a harder time duping him than he has had with others.
Just to save you the trouble of labeling, which is your passion, Rinderninnie here! Never seen anyone quite so obsessed in one person as you are with Mike Rinder. Almost daily, sort of paints a jealous hue over your face. On and on about what crimes he knows about as head of OSA. Like the FBI/etc. hasn’t already seen him around and don’t know he was the head of OSA and, if it was actually beneficial for convictions towards Miscavige and others haven’t already thought of bringing him in to question him on all the crimes. YOU did it, you have broken the case to take down Scientology. Give yourself a gold star and pat that back of yours!
Mike Rinder was quoted in the LA Times yesterday as a “Former Spokesman” for Scientology when in fact he was CO OSA when those women were coming forward about Masterson. The Times article mentioned none of that.
Do you believe Rinder was just practicing speeches into a mirror during that time?
Or do you think that, as head of OSA for Miscavige, he was taking actions to have them silenced?
Curious to see what you have to say.
—Nancy Salzman shamelessly ripped off Scientology to create NXIVM.
Hutchinson helped procure the Scientology literature.
To be fair to Ms. Clyne, the easiest thing for her to do would have been to renounce the whole thing.
She didn’t even though she might still be indicted in the future.
Not true, smtolle.
She is doing the easiest thing right now. She is not challenging the belief system that led her to where she is now.
She is denying all accountability for her actions.
Nicki is a coward. It’s easy to deny.
How did it occur here that you are running a photograph of a gentleman wearing a bit of old, dry-looking burgundy lipstick?
And passing this off to be a lady named Grace and Park?
Plus, is that Nicki Clyne minus a bleach job, or is that Bucky Beaver?
Soon. Soon. This vacationer still loves a weak end. A weekend. For heavens’ sake. Including a Canadian, Ethiopian WEEKND. Especially those musicians are exceedingly relaxing.
We are recounting the technological brilliance, the frailties, the splendours, the abbreviated but energetic biography of Hedy Lamarr to our young gentleman whose insincere homework assignments are sorta done. Tea time is a necessity.
I like the boys to see, to hear about unexpected examples of brilliance and of having determination, as well as beauty, love, elegance, humor.
Alanzo is similar to the extremely unmelodious shrike birds who squatted to nest this spring in our bougainvilleas and whom no one wants to hear from ever again. Even our cardinals, mockingbirds and blue jays were disgusted having those shrikes nearby.
There is an old article here at Frank’s where other Sci. squatters were on patrol, using their inept method of sending quick, nonsensical comments composed of 3 or 4 word phrases. This happened due to some Hubbard exposures. The vultures have got to keep up on their news coverage like paranoiacs.
These poor, snivelling and enslaved assholios get paid to do this kind of daily monitoring, reportage and divisive hovering by their Sci. Commandoes. It is a slave-wage JOB. Work shifts are assigned to spy upon the houses of cult unlove, you see.
That is more than Alanzzzzzzzzzo gets anymore for squirming around in groupie-dom, any which way he can.
He only knows the can-can. Terribly limited, and no other routine appears to be even approachable, for such a brain. Alas, all ass. Alas.
Luckily, our naughty limericks about Alanzo can expand now, if one so desires. Try to tart up the old boar. Bore. Oh dear. Writing now, the entire topic lacks adventurism, and there cannot be any conquests ever to arise.
The only thing left is to give Alanzo the Dickens. This is a wholeheartedly dismal, depressing sort of a mission.
Therefore, I must withdraw. J’accuse. And also refuse. Refuse the refuse. Just say no to drags? Uh-huh. I like that rather well. No to drags.
Yes, you seriously should consider cutting back on the drugs. Looks like the stuff is frying your brain.
Ho-hum. Ah so, honorable a-hole.
See me being all polite!?
Thank you for providing the opportunity. Cheerio.
Didn’t you once believe L Ron Hubbard was a great person too? Enough with the superiority complex. 🌋👾👽
He certainly clings to the illusion of his superiority or “higher intelligence “. It’s just the fools’ arrogance. The dude has been desperate to swing from Clyne’s untamed public hair for years now. Quit pulling your pecker and get outdoors for some air. You’re a grown man!
Nicki is also an unindicted co-conspirator (by her own admission in her interview with Scott Adams) who intended to plead the 5th if called to testify in Raniere’s trial. And she is part of the civil case as well. I don’t think this is exactly a success story.
What I see is that idealistic people who want to make the world a better place are looking for something to accomplish that. Unfortunately, instead of joining a group that was upfront and honest about their goals and intentions, she happened to be in a social circle with people who recommended NXIVM. She could have just as easily volunteered at a food pantry or joined an intentional community that wouldn’t have been so toxic. I can’t speak for everyone here but I can say that the reason I am against cults is because I want people to be able to avoid these groups that rely on deception and abuse. I highly doubt that any of the women in NXIVM who are currently facing jail time would have ended up in this position without running directly into Keith Raniere and NXIVM.
So, the question is now what do about someone like Nicki who firmly believes that a man who has harmed so many people should be free to continue that harm.
And it seems to me, she is knowingly lying about certain aspects of the case. That deserves criticism even though I can be empathetic to how she got into this mess. If she insists on continuing down this path, I am afraid it isn’t going to serve her well. And she now has access to all the information she needs to figure out who Keith really is. But she refuses to do so. Hopefully, with some more time and space, she can come to see that Keith is not who he says he is and he will only use her for his own ends. In the meantime, she could at least stop criticizing his victims for coming forward.
Is Alanzo really Suneel? Does Suneel wipe Nicki Clyne’s poopy bottom like he did for Clare?
“Where we agree the most is that mainstream society is incredibly shallow and materialistic, and *dumb.”*
‘Dumb’ is an anachronistic term used to describe people who for one reason or another cannot speak.
I find it offensive.
You lost all credibility with me from the point where you used that term.
How is dumb anachronistic?
I am befuddled, confounded, and flummoxed.
I love language and I don’t follow your usage.
Perhaps, you’re a poet and you do not know it.
I live in Brazil and follow the case through this website.
I confess that I do not understand some points.
Did Keith Raniere have photos of Allison Mack and Nicki Clyne?
Were they both branded?
Was the marriage between the two of them “real” or was it just their master’s requirement?
Can Nicki Clyne be sued and arrested?
I don’t understand how former members that aren’t US citizens are still in the country. They’re foreign nationals who are part of a criminal racketeering enterprise. According to all the conversations around deportation, they should be expelled from the country.
Yes, Keith told them to get married.
Both Nicki and Allison are being sued in a civil Racketeering lawsuit.
Trial date yet?
Hopefully, it will go to trial. The rules of a civil court are not as stringent as those of a criminal court. The amount of information that could potentially come out could be an absolute gold mine of exactly how much some individuals were involved in things.
Torquemadan: adjective Of or pertaining to Tomás de Torquemada (1420–1498), prominent leader of the Spanish Inquisition.
Torquemada was the edgy Vanguard for today’s anticultists.
Innovative, too. Did you know he had a Bible with a cover made out of human skin?
Uhm…Webster’s doesn’t recognize it —
and I have never laid eyes on it.
Kafkaesque on the other-hand….
Keith Raniere, tormentor turned tormented, is like a Kafkaesque character.
Then again, iPhone spell check does not recognize Kafkaesque. Damn Semantics!
Why are they telling us how insecure they feel in their intelligence and capabilities? It’s so exploitative to publish these insane people.
Yep, we know. You’re all the super special chosen people and we’ll never understand.
Why is it these people never worship volcanoes?
Hahaha, yeah. If I ever wanna trust an actress who defends branding cultists and human traffickers, she’s the 1st one I’ll go to 😂
Most, if not all, anti-cultists have been smart enough to not get enrolled into a cult.
This was exactly the way I felt about the entire damned Catholic church when first seeing it.
Having been told that this place was God’s house, and yet everyone who was sitting, standing or kneeling there was so miserable. Meanwhile if that was God’s house, where the hell was God?
You don’t invite guests to your place, only to be absent. That is a huge, huge gaffe. Completely beyond the pale. At the very least, call and cancel the date if you won’t be there at your own darn RSVP event.
I asked and asked through the whole Latin recitation and the furious bellowing of an old, fat, sadistic nasty priest whose name happened to be Father Powers. Not kidding. Powers, ffs.
There I was, being un-“indentured” for the first time churchwise, by a huge CROCK of shit some crazy creepy people define by the name of God. I was at the most four years old, and at heart, felt quite disappointed. No God here. Just a bunch of big nuts. Nuts with pocket change and hopefully, they might drop some of that and I could get some bubblegum.
Seldom is heard a discouraging word, but nevertheless, I saw that I was fast and furious to find out what’s really cooking. These people were all sound asleep at the wheel.
Exploring fascism as an expressive dynamic of cultic “belief” has always been sitting right out on the table. It is here, there and everywhere. Historically.
So back to the flight of the alone to the alone. It works for me. Everytime.
The Nxivm plights continue to be of interest, due to all of its continuing damages.
The Nxivms latched onto the theoretical machinations of a sociopathic personality. These he and they have enshrined as if it were truthful and milked for all of its worthlessness. The results just keep on rolling in with the tides.
When one puts a false god before oneself, this reflects as a piece of a wider neverending story. How easily we forget. What is true? What is theoretical? What is blind faith? What is faith unadorned? Does that exist!
So I remember to remember, too. All of it. All or nothing at all. Never be bored for a second. And yes to the Beautiful Dreamer. It is all an amazing musical. Symphonic. Realism plus surrealistic pillows.
Ooh. What a gap. Forgot to hit post with all of this dreamboating taking me adrift again. Enough of Niagara Falls.
This is a fair comment. It’s a common thought that runs through anticultism and which makes anticultists believe they are superior: more sane, more rational, and more intelligent than someone who has left a cult.
But here’s the thing: a person who has never joined a cult, adopted its ideology and let it do all their thinking for them, has never experienced the catastrophe of having had thier ideology – the way they make sense of the world – collapse on them.
Most anticultist’s smug belief that they possess the truth, all the false assumptions they run around with in their heads, have never been challenged.
Is such a person who has never gone through the fire of leaving a cult really more wise, rational, sane or intelligent than someone who has?
I say no.
You can be 100% certain of something that is 100% false.
And until that fact of human life has run you over like a fucking freight train, you have no idea what you are talking about. And all your smug superiority is that of a teenager’s who has never really lived.
Has it ever occurred to you that most people have never been so lost in a deception that they feel like a freight train is running over them when they finally confront all the lies?
Though I believe most of us are lost to some degree at different points throughout our lives, not every revelation is that jolting.
Most of us do not require a total overhaul of beliefs like you did.
—has never experienced the catastrophe of having had thier ideology – the way they make sense of the world – collapse on them.
That’s an astute observation Alonzo. Heretofore, I have not contemplated that aspect of a former cult member’s psyche.
So much of our world is a made up of imaginary human-constructs.
We all forget how much of reality is illusionary in nature, not unlike an RPG game.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the matter. Sincerely!
Wow. A nice, considerate person!
Thanks for taking the time to say something kind to me.
Nicki is only playing a role – more like taking curtain calls – to an imaginary audience of adoring fans and so are you, Alanzo.
In the not-so-famous, delusional last words of Clare Bronfman: “People all over the world love me!”
You’re not spreading love, you’re spreading hate slop for pigs headed for the bacon makin’ shop.