This is one of the best comments on what has happened to Nicki Clyne and Allison Mack and a lot of other women and men in Nxivm that I have ever read. It explains a lot in the least amount of words. It was left as a comment on Is Allison Mack Still Communicating with Nxivm and in Love with Raniere? I made it into a separate post because I think it is valuable and it might incline towards a little sympathy towards those victims of Nxivm who also made others into victims.
By Paul
It takes years to break free of trauma bonding, and that is the nature of Allison Mack’s bond with Keith Raniere. It’s not the same as Stockholm Syndrome, but there are commonalities.
She could be compared to a battered wife who always returns to her husband because “When he’s nice, he’s really nice.” But that isn’t it either. Think more of the Uyghur people who are in Chinese camps, bombarded with indoctrination and taking part in self-abasement sessions every day. Brainwashing is a much over-used term, but it is possible to deeply damage a person’s sense of self and idea of what is real.
I think the Raniere’s mind-bending was designed to do exactly that. ‘Rational Enquiry’ was designed to be nothing less than the unearthing and manipulation of a person’s inner world. It was a process of deconstruction and reconstruction.
A healthy mind is best left alone. We all have our quirks and inconsistencies, strengths and weaknesses, but we get by mostly OK.
A healthy mind is not a perfectly functioning mechanism, but it is a mechanism that works well enough. Constantly drawing attention to a person’s weaknesses is very harmful. This is what Raniere did. Constantly. When we do something silly, our inner self notices, and we tell ourselves that we made a mistake, and decide not to do it again.
Raniere sought, and in some cases succeeded, in replacing that inner voice with his own. This is wickedness of a very high order. It is the exact opposite of what you do if you want a person to learn to trust their own judgment, grow, and become a more self-reliant person.
This is more than likely where Nicky and Allison are in their inner lives.
To be honest, I’m not confident that it can be fixed without some extended time in a good therapeutic facility. By that, I do not mean some sterile locked ward. That would just be a prison with a nicer name.
But they are not beyond hope of some kind of progress if ALL ties are completely and permanently severed with the source of the damage.
That is an absolute must.
Frank Parlato 
Janine Morrison 
J.J. O'Hara 
Richard Luthmann 
Marie White 
Paul Serran
Please leave a comment: Your opinion is important to us!
Paul, don’t believe the story about a FORMER something who had a cousin who’s dogsitter’s brother who is in contact with the gardener of the house around a mile from Allison’s home is saying….
Not many people have access to her and she is monitored (and more so now…because of Frank’s false accusation)…
Allison only has contact with real people , not remote…she is respecting scrupulously her court orders (as she is afraid of jail).
And none of her friend would betray Allison with those kind of lies.
She is still healing and you are right, it’s taking time (and it’s going to take more time…)
But what was done with the article wasn’t helpfull and feel like the work of a terrible person (if this person exist…because the former source..)
Trying to hurt Allison further, push her in prison prematurely and trying to get her extra punishment would never be done by a former friend of hers…
This is pure sadism trying to destroy the fact that Allison is lately seen as a victim.
Also , believe me, seeing what is in balance, her parents would never let her do anything like that…and she is 24/7 with them lately.
I don’t think Raniere ever designed anything intentionally, except to fulfill his need for sexual gratification and power, he certainly didn’t design anything to keep himself and others out of trouble. LOL
Brainwashing is a valid excuse if you live in North Korea, where there are no alternative sources of information. Albany less so.
In the US most people do not search for alternative sources…they only read/watch sources that confirm the opinions they already have—ie Fox, MSNBC etc. It’s a form of self-brainwashing.
I watch the Libtard programming for entertainment purposes, it’s also important to know thy enemy. LOL
Brainwashing doesn’t exist, it’s a proven scientific fact. Lying and withholding information does, but not brainwashing. LOL
Umm…no. Have you ever heard of EMDR therapy? Well, it’s supposed to relieve people of trauma that has been deeply ingrained in the mind and body subconsciously. It works both at the conscious and sub-conscious layers of brain and mind processes. Trauma induced bodily reaction that is difficult to get over is a form of “brainwashing” in the sense that it prevents the sufferer from seeing that their present situation is not even remotely like that which caused it in the first place, even though the mind and body are acting subconsciously as if it is.
This idea that these people are not victims in some sense is very dangerous, especially if they spent years in a cult where they engaged in various forms of thought reform, likely not with their best interests in mind but that of the cult’s, and one really needs a professional to assess that and not some armchair commenter.
Frank,
I can not find the after show companion piece which accompanied Schitt’s Creek season that first appeared on POP tv season 6 episode 7. Regarding NXIVM.
The show is now on NETFLIX and does not have the same thing. Sorry
No sweat. Thanks for trying.
https://youtu.be/2-KpGyWIIfs He mentions a NXIVM Podcast here quickly in beginning.
Frank is right. This is the reality of what happened to Raniere’s victims, many of whom became abusers themselves. But if you believe this is accurate, then no one was more of a victim than the unfortunate Clare Bronfman, who became Raniere’s deployable agent and the worst abuser of all. As an observer of NXIVM long before it came crashing down, it was clear that the primary target of Raniere’s manipulation was Clare B. and much of what he did was to control her until she thought she was in charge but all she was doing was what he wanted and she was letting him use her fortune to fund his legal assault on those who chose to start thinking for themselves. Only Nancy Salzman, for a variety of reasons, had no excuse. And as for those who relish demonizing Clare Bronfman, starting with the owner of this blog, the reality is that he was one of a few promoters attracted to Bronfman’s wealth and lack of sophistication who expected to make a “killing” for himself only to find out that he was dealing with someone truly evil and more manipulative who had a tight and increasingly tight hold on the golden goose and had no intention of letting go or sharing the wealth. Clare Bronfman will continue to pay for what she did. Our system demands it. But demonizing her or the other women misses the point. She is the biggest victim of all.
I wonder what made her feel like she was in charge – it must have been when Raniere told her to wear a jock strap. LOL
They are all guilty, that’s what happens when you are an adult and break the law. LOL
Yeah, well, your “Golden Goose” — and that’s actually “Geese” plural to include sister Sara Bronfman who used both her purse and her puss to do Raniere & Salzman’s biddings — are still hatching plots to destroy lives, propagate Raniere & Salzman’s perverse teachings, sextort, bribe and “protect” public and law enforcement officials caught in their web of corruption — all of which makes it a little difficult to dredge up any sympathy for them as “victims.”
If either had a shred of remorse and no plans to carry on with their criminal activities they could start with making reparations to John Tighe, the blogger they poisoned, framed and imprisoned. They could go after the corrupt Albany attorneys — Steve Coffey and Pam Nichols, to name a couple, and (why not at this point) Dennis Burke — who abetted and advised them to continue financing NXIVM long after they were well aware (at least) of criminal activities so egregious the Albany Times Union (owned by Hearst Corporation) ran a week-long expose’ series on NXIVM detailing those crimes including child molestation back in February of 2012. They could assist the NDNY and the DOJ in prosecuting crimes directly perpetrated by drug cartel connected NXIAN Mexican Elites and help eliminate the threat of these most (or more, one would hope) dangerous, murderous crooks to NXIVM survivors — especially those living in Mexico who are vulnerable (one would hope) to retaliation cartel-style. They could help ensure justice is meted out more fairly than laying the blame at the feet of a few deceived, deluded, enslaved actresses whom they recruited with their dazzling golden eggs to “take the fall” for the rotten eggs who “victimized” them, as well.
I wish them all the best; hopefully, some day they will be able to break free of this torment.
That is the funniest thing as they could be free of torment but they brought it upon themselves. Heathly minds and all that. Let us elaborate so does one of them wear an ankle bracelet and the other shows her ankles upwards to a prison. How
quite ironic as a wife.
They did not bring this upon themselves. Sadly, you understand nothing!
Neither do you actually. Caveat emptor and then they paid their money for these courses. < no explanation mark btw.
This is for your scammed friend, Ronnie. Seems he might have been duped by Chelsea Clinton’s father-in-law
https://apnews.com/144672cff00f4428bb4067d65629e2fd
Ed Mezvinsky is a real piece of work.
Chelsea Clinton’s father in law is a Jewish guy from Ames, Iowa but he works for Nigerian fraudsters!
Chelsea’s “official” father Bill Clinton is a pedo.
MSNBC ignores Epstein docs implicating Bill Clinton; CNN largely avoids
https://www.foxnews.com/media/msnbc-ignores-epstein-docs-implicating-bill-clinton-cnn-largely-avoids
George Floyd had three times the lethal limit of Fentanyl!
Does this mean Chauvin will be getting out of jail? BLM organizations are going to lose their minds.
Your video was taken down. LOL
George Floyd had 11 nano grams of fentanyl in his blood when only 3 nano grams can cause an overdose death.
The Communist gangsters at Google and Youtube have yanked Tucker Carlson’s video about George Floyd’s death.
Here it is:
Tucker reacts to leaked George Floyd footage: ‘Why haven’t we seen the rest of the video until right now?’
‘Floyd’s death changed everything. It was a pivot point in American history,’ he said
The American people should have been allowed to see police body camera footage of the moments before Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin pinned George Floyd’s neck under his knee much sooner than this week, Tucker Carlson argued Tuesday.
Footage from the cameras of former rookie officers Thomas Lane and J. Alexander Kueng was obtained by the Daily Mail and published Monday. The video shows about 18 minutes from Kueng’s body camera and 10 minutes from Lane’s.
The footage shows four Minneapolis police officers struggling with Floyd this past May 25 before one of them, Chauvin, ultimately pins Floyd to the ground in a scene that sparked protests worldwide.
“The catechism has been written and it’s in stone. ‘George Floyd is a martyr, period’ … ” the “Tucker Carlson Tonight” host said. “But in America, that’s not good enough. It’s not a real answer. In free societies, citizens have a right to know why things are changing so quickly.
“What exactly is the basis of this cultural revolution that we’re all living through?” Carlson asked. “Once again, it may be some time before we can answer those questions with certainty. Maybe we never will. We’ll probably debate them for decades. But more facts are always the first step toward establishing what the truth is …
“Floyd’s death has been used to justify a nationwide convulsion of violence, destruction, looting, in some cases killing …” Carlson went on. “In addition to unprecedented levels of political upheaval, the wholesale reordering of our most basic institutions, Floyd’s death changed everything. It was a pivot point in American history. No matter what your side you’re on, that’s very clear at this point. So with all of that in mind … it’s striking how little we really know months later about how exactly George Floyd died.”
Carlson then played clips of the body camera footage. Prior to its publication by the Daily Mail, the video was only available for viewing at the Hennepin County Courthouse, by appointment only.
“You can decide for yourself what you think of that video. And we hope you will. That’s the whole point of having a news network, to bring you the facts and allow you to decide what they amount to. We hope that takes place in this case,” Carlson said. “So the question is, why haven’t we seen the rest of the video until right now? The video seems relevant, particularly considering all that happened next.”
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8576371/Police-bodycam-footage-shows-moment-moment-arrest-George-Floyd-time.html
So Cucker Tarlson says you can kneel on someone’s neck for 9 minutes if they are on drugs.
It’s possible for two things to be true at the same time. People high on fentanyl often have superhuman strength and need to be subdued for their own physical protection and the protection of others. However, the knee placement was a mistake. LOL
shadow since you like to investigate so much, tell me what you think is the reason why they removed the portraits of bill clinton and George W. Bush, it would be for the alleged claim of ghislaine maxwell to have a video of a usa politician having sex with a minor girl, do you think the stench is already covering those two
Trump didn’t want to keep being reminded of two guys who didn’t do their job and became buddies because of this commonality. LOL
The re-educational program looks way more extreme in comparison to Nxivm. I kind of see your point with the mental training. I definitely don’t think it’s healthy or wise to stand in the way of ones religion. I guess Muslims should stay out of China.
That’s because it is way more extreme than NXIVM. The Chinese don’t care about religion, any of them. Everybody should stay out of China. LOL
What has Paul forgotten?
That Allison Mack and Lauren Salzman extorted from their victims money, jewelry, bank account numbers and credit and debit card numbers.
Allison Mack and Lauren Salzman are according to the US DOJ no different from gangsters who use force, fraud and coercion to steal property from their victims.
One has to [redacted] in order to forget it. LOL
Many actors/actresses are pretty f*cked up to begin with, Raniere didn’t have to do much more to them. LOL
The Xinjiang re-education camps, Paul … Frank, what the heck?
Paul feeds us Happy Talk about how hard core criminals like Mack and Clyne can be reformed by psychotherapy.
What is the reality?
Police tell residents to surrender to criminals in Minneapolis
Where in all this Psychobabble is there any concern for the many women victimized by Allison Mack and her wife Nicki Clyne?
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The purpose of the criminal justice system is to vindicate the rights of the victims and deter and punish the perpetrators.
Mack and Clyne are grown adult women,not Cutesy-Wootsie little girls with no responsibility for their own actions.
Everyone is a victim.
Shall we defund the police and abolish the prisons and replace them all with social workers and medical clinics?
This is the same pablum puked out by Anti-Fa and B.L.M.
Everyone is a victim.
And I can tell you for that Ms. Mack still considers herself to be Queen Allison.
The appropriate cure for Mack and Clyne is at the gray bar hotel.
Paul: Thank you for your well reasoned comments and opinions. It is a pleasure to read things in this vein.