[Editor’s note: I like to give contrasting views. the following has already appeared as a comment on a post I wrote earlier today suggesting Kristin Kreuk speak out – for her own sake – about Keith Raniere. I did separate each of the author’s comments to make them easier to follow].
By Scarrom
I fail to see your logic [on Kristin Kreuk].
[You wrote ]‘She let NXIVM use her name and image to bring in scores of people. I know, I was there. She was star #1.’
NXIVM brought in scores of people by various means, at least according to their own figures. Where is the evidence for the causal link that Kristin brought in “scores of people” due to her association? I am aware that Kristin recruited three people.
Only Allison Mack remains in NXIVM. Rick Ross has stated that cults hide behind organizational fronts of legitimate businesses. Implying or implicitly conflating that she brought in scores of people into NXIVM to take self-improvement courses with the notion that she brought in scores of women into a “sex cult” is simply bad journalism. Many people take one or two of these type of courses and never return.
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‘Maybe she slept with Keith Raniere’
Kristin never slept with him. I know. How I know is irrelevant. Also, you have another source stating that Kristin was never a member of Keith’s harem in your article posted several months ago
So I don’t see how speculation into this aspect of her life is relevant anymore. It only serves to sully her character.
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‘When this explodes – and it will – she will, unavoidably, go down as part of NXIVM history…’
She is already part of NXIVM history. The key word is “history”. She’s been gone from it for several years now – at least since 2012 – and has moved on with her life. She has no relevance to DOS. She was never part of the inner core. And she had no knowledge of any of the financial misbehaving and other illegal criminal activities of Raniere and company. Guilt by association is an ad hominem logical fallacy.
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‘I have more respect for Allison Mack or Nicki Clyne than for Keith Raniere or Kristin Kreuk.’
Well this is just stupid and shows your bias. You have more respect for a woman (Allison) who is second in command to Raniere in DOS and who even you have speculated married the other (Nicki) to keep from being deported? Sara Edmondson had been in the cult longer, was in it before her and remained well in it after Kristin left – she even called Lauren Salzman best friend who was also a bridesmaid at her wedding – and even she didn’t know about the branding, yet here you are attacking someone who left several years ago like she’s part and parcel to these secretive machinations when at most her involvement was simply at the level of believing that the group was for the advancement of ethics and self-improvement.
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“Kreuk and Raniere are hiding.”
More idiotic conflation between two unequal characters in this saga that serves no purpose except to sully the former. Kreuk has been living in Toronto for five years now. She worked on “Beauty and the Beast” for four years and just recently finished filming a ten episode series called “Burden of Truth” which she also executive produced.
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“And Kreuk was the first celebrity of NXIVM; used to build NXIVM.”
This is not true. Mark Vicente, Mark Hildreth and Sarah Edmondson were all in it prior to her. All of them were (minor) celebrities in the entertainment industry. I believe Linda Evans was also associated to it before her. She could be considered the “biggest current star” they had taking and coaching courses when she was in it, but Tom Cruise to Scientology she is and never was.
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“She was used to abuse women.”
More ludicrous guilt by association.
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This article was little more than nonsense and essentially an ad hominem against someone who hasn’t been relevant to NXIVM for several years and certainly has no relevance to its most recent events. It serves only to sully the content of this site. It also smells of an attempt to use a person’s celebrity for their own purposes.
Ironically, something like the author claims NXIVM did to her.
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I disagree. It is a known fact that cults like these tell you to hide your involvement and/or lie about it. Kristin was in it. She has been named as a coach and took courses for years. She was seen at Acapella Innovations and Vanguard Week. She has never denied that she is still in it. For all anyone knows, she could still be in it. Like Allison Mack and Nickl Clyne, she is still Facebook friends with Clare Bronfman who continues to financially support the cult while neither Mark Vicente, Sarah Edmondson, or Mark Hildreth are. One has to wonder why she remains a friend of Clare’s if she is so against NXIVM, DOS, Vanguard and whatever else the cult teaches and promotes.
The Wiz says:
“I believe there are many out there who think when this blows wide open the shit will hit the fan and she will be outed. But here’s the truth I believe. When the shit hits the fan and everyone is outed, it will be huge — inside this bubble.”
I agree — when “the shit hits the fan” it will be big mostly on this site. Ranire, Kreuk and even DOS will be back-page news compared to the bigger, more widespread scandals.
Vancouver isn’t Hollywood.
ESP isn’t the Fashion Industry.
Albany isn’t Washington, DC.
Kreuk’s story will just be small(ville) potatoes….despite the real pain Ranire might have inflicted on her and other Espians.
First, excellent rebuttal Scarrom
Kristin was not the face of NXIVM because NXIVM doesn’t really put on a face to the outside. Everything is word of mouth, friend to friend as far as recruitment goes. Maybe for that short venture into a capella, she was a face but one of three faces and that only lasted for two events over ten years ago.
My position is that most of middle America probably has never heard of her. Thinking back, I probably knew the show Smallville had to do with Superman but I had no clue or cared to know who the stars or actors and actresses were on it. The shows on the WB were too young for me. I did watch Charmed from time to time. I am pretty sure Smallville was to lure male viewers in a certain age group in, at a certain time slot on a network not that did not have the drawing power of a show on CBS/ABC/NBC or even FOX. Over it’s ten year run, Smallville never ranked in the top 100 most watched shows for Nielsen Ratings. In fact, it never made it into the top 110!! It’s average viewership was a low of 2.38 (year 9) million viewers to a high of 6.3 (year 2)
I only became aware of Kristin Kreuk and Allison Mack after they were linked to NXIVM on SID blog after the Times Union story broke in 2012. I have never seen Kristin walking in Knox Woods with any of the harem or with Keith. That is not to say it didn’t happen, but I didn’t witness it with my own eyes and other members of the Knox Woods neighborhood watch “committee” have never mentioned seeing her either. And believe me, there are quite a few eyes and ears around these parts. Allison on the other hand, I have seen walking with Keith and I can probably say the earliest date I saw them on a walk was summer 2012-ish, which was probably after Allison announced she was taking time off from acting.
I honestly don’t think Kristin was anything more than a bit player and she was definitely not inner circle. If she was, she would have relocated to Albany like Allison and Nicky and numerous others I can name.
My feeling is leave her alone because dragging her name thru the mud over and over is really just bullying and click bait. She really isn’t that important to this story.
My remark to the author having more respect for Nicky and Allison is that is FUBARed. They deserve no one’s respect. They are not role models, feminists or anyone to look up too. They are the antithesis to the #Metoo movement,
As for this story exploding, we here in the surrounding areas of Nxivm village have been waiting for that moment to come for years. Just a few arrests would be nice but unfortunately with Keith in Mexico I guess we will all miss his perp walk.
Spot on.
I believe there are many out there who think when this blows wide open the shit will hit the fan and she will be outed. But here’s the truth I believe. When the shit hits the fan and everyone is outed, it will be huge — inside this bubble.
Very few of the public will see this as more than a blip. An omen of what to look out for. The level of caring by the outside world will be minimal. I promise.
Why would anyone in the spotlight, or in the entertainment world want to shine MORE light on herself about this cult of deceit and manipulation.
1) it would only serve to make her look foolish and would be painful for her to have to read all the shit spewed about her on line and in gossip circles.
2) because of her celebrity status she has more to lose by coming out. And even more if any collateral for any reason is leaked.
3) Demanding her to speak out is just a cry for legitimacy in ones own position. Why does anyone need Kristen to speak out? You all know what’s happened to you. All of us are healing from whatever level of minfuckedness we’ve been left with. Kristen endorsing this message doesn’t serve her. Why does it serve those who demand it?
4) and remember we don’t all share a common ethical centre. You may feel yours is higher than hers. She may feel the opposite.
5) dragging Grace and Mark (previous post) through all of this pressure is also counter productive for all the same reasons.
6) I have spoken to or know of some people who have been so traumatized by their experiences in this cult that they fear coming out to anyone but their closest support groups. In good conscience we NEVER demand that they speak out. We don’t make them feel small. We don’t coerce them into speaking through intimidation. Why can we not extend the same courtesy to those celebrities who stand to lose something most of us don’t experience.
Wiz.
I have to tell you, it’s post like this that have made me question my original stance. The women in this cult have already been bullied horrendously, so now there is a shaming campaign to force them to expose themselves even more? I feel rather badly that I came off
in previous posts as wanting to hurt KK in someway, because that was never my intention.
I would hope that if KK was questioned by authorities that she would tell them what she knows, even if the info is six years old, and not try to cover for the cult and it’s higher ups. I have no doubt that Raniere has a great deal of influence on them, but he’s not worth going to jail over. I hope the friends and family members of these women help them to help themselves.
You are right, Wiz. These people should or should not come forward on their own terms and when it the right time for them. Most are victims in the first place and deserve to be protected over being exposed for being fooled by a conman. As long as they did nothing illegal or supported it, they should live their life without being publicly shamed as far as possible.
Why do you want any of these women to speak out about their professional or personal relationship in the first place? Maybe putting distance, space and time, between oneself and this organization is what helps them healing from whatever one experienced.
Them telling us they were in bed with KR or him being the father of Ms. Parks’ child does neither help them or us after all. As long as it happened with consent they can do whatever they want. All were adults at the time in question. There is no moral high ground to claim here and these things a just one thing; personal.
So, let them stay quiet if they want or come forward, but do not demand of them to destroy current relationships or their public image for nothing. This is not important evidence in a case of law but just gossip.